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Hi there,
From what I could find in this section of the forum, there doesn't seem to be much discussion in relation to the use of effects with jazz guitar...
Like most aspiring players, I am on a pilgrimage to find my own voice et al. I think as guitarists we have it a lot easier than other instrumentalists such as acoustic pianists or horn players as we can control the vast majority of our sound by fiddling with amps and effects (obviously there is plenty that can be done with strings, picks and technique etc).
Basically I thought I'd ask if any of you are using pedals, if you know of anything on the market that is worth checking out etc...
My favourite guitar sound and maybe playing is Frisell's on Kenny Wheeler's album Angel Song, I strongly recommend it to anyone who likes improvisation!
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01-04-2009 02:02 PM
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love love that album, desert island for me.
Lots of that comes from Bill and the Klein guitra, which are hard to come by but I've played a half dozen of them and they're all excellent instruments.
I use effects in my every day sound, reverb and delay mostly. Investing in a new volume pedal and might look into another delay based on some looking around although I do love my current delay and reverb.
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One pedal I found very useful was a graphic equalizer pedal. Because of a bad back and hips, I had a lot of trouble carrying my amps around. I had to get some smaller and really light amps but as we all know, the tone is not the best. Unfortunately, when you find an advantage, sometimes it comes with a few disadvantages as well. After I've dialed in the tone on the amp for best results, I further shaped the sound with the equalizer and it made a significant difference in the sound.
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i get my sound without any pedals, but i don't object to using them. i've never been abe to really bond with anything "chorused" or overdriven in the setting i usually play--and my amp has decent enough reverb if the room is dead acoustically. ihave played in some more modern settings in which i've experimented with two amps and some slight delay, and enjoyed that sound, but for everyday playing for me, it's guitar--> cable--> amp.
overall, i'll think you'll find a couple of schools of thought here, including the players who would never put anything between their guitar and amp but a cord, and those who say it's time to get jazz out of the 50's! whatever helps you find your voice is cool.
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You might want to send a PM to frisellfan.
Personally I like reverb, chorus, a touch of echo, and occasionally some *very* light distortion (to thicken the sound of single-note lines).
My pedals:
- Digitech DigiVerb
- Rocktron Deep Blue Chorus
- Boss RE-20
- Boss RT-20
- Electro-Harmonix Stereo Memory Man with Hazarai
- Tech21 Character Series Blonde
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He used a Klein for a long time and popularized them for a lot of more modern guys looking for something new. Great sound, great feel. Worth the money. The other guy who I teach with has 2 of them and a 3rd on the way. He used them a lot in the 90;s.
Each time I've seen him he used Telecasters but neither time were they actual fenders... guys build him guitars man, he's bill frissel.
I don't think anyone is saying that Effects "make or break" anyone. I tell my students they have to get a good clean sound without any dressings before they can really get anything with stuff you step on. At that point it comes to personal preference. Some guys have an effects chain that makes me dizzy to get a sound that I don't find all that dis-similar then what I get out of my much more simple rig. I played straight through to an amp for about 7 years before I just was feeling I needed more.
Glad I found something more
. I have what works for me, I'm always interested to see what people are coming up with these days. I love Metheny's more acoustic sound on his last few sides, but still love that 80's group sound.
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Hey Jake, I think it's great that you teach your students to do it clean first. I'm of the opinion that many players especially beginners in order to sound like their heros or to impress other customers in the music stores, use effects to actually cover up their sloppy playing. During the early 90's, I would go into a guitar store and ask to try a particular instrument. The first thing the sales person did was turn the amp up, crank the reverb, chorus and distortion up and then hand me the guitar. They looked at me like I had three heads when I cleaned up the sound and played guitar to amp. The same thing used to happen when I tried a bass. The sales guy would turn off the bass and crank up the treble and then whack away on the bass with his thumb. Geez, I hate that sound.
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Yes, I think it's super important to get the clean sound/tone you want first. I know I spent about six months just experimenting with getting the clean tone I wanted when I first started playing jazz. So now it's easy to go with any guitar and any amp and it's a matter of minutes to get the tone that's in my head. I always set the guitar tone rolled off quite a bit and leave a little headroom on the volume just for fine tweaking. Then alter the amp settings to complete the task.
Also you have to examine each device you add to the chain because each one could be altering your optimum 'clean tone' even without stomping on the box. I've used a lot of separate boxes and also have the Vox Valvetronic Tonelab(all in one). I like it too because it has 2 pedals and can be used to control volume and the effects chain without touching the guitar or reaching down to fiddle with an effects box. If has left and right OUTs in case you want to use 2 amps. Effects should be used sparingly of course but it's great to experiment and see it the dogs will hum along.
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When I was younger I felt I always needed overdrive, reverb and big expensive amps to play well... but now I just tend to play my Tele into a small Fender Pro Junior, set and forget and let the "tone" come out of my fingers. It's amazing how many sounds you can get from a dual pickup guitar a with volume and tone knob...
Last edited by whippersnapper; 01-04-2009 at 08:40 PM.
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Absolutely. Eight or nine years ago I used big, heavy, multi-channel tube amps with a pedalboard that weighed almost as much as the amp and guitars that had more controls than strings. "My sound" has evolved to be cleaner, simpler and far more dependent upon my technique.
Originally Posted by whippersnapper
I'm at a point now where I'll play through any clean amp and be happy. A lot of times I'll skip the amp altogether and run the guitar through a DI straight to the PA.
Any guitar... Yah, I suppose I *could* play any guitar, but I like mine too much to play anything else. It's a matter of comfort and familiarity.
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When it comes to Amps and things like that it's vital to be able to get a good sound on any amp. Absolutely there will be preferences. Me, I like fender tube amps, but I've been out on the road or on residencies and what not and you just have to use what you have there at the gig.
Most, if not %90 of all jazz guitarists out there (exception being like Metheny or Jim Hall) backline everything. Meaning they send their rider and get what they want or their 2nd or 3rd choice. So often you get to the gig and end up with an old JC-120 and just shrug. The good thing about a lot of those old amps are they can universally be tweeked to the point of sounding good.
I know a lot of guys want certain things. Example, Rosenwinkel wants a fender twin on the gig, it's smart of him. They're everywhere, sound good with lots of head room and he's not carryin it around so there's no problem. Adam Rogers is a fender man also. Abercrombie runs stereo always and tends to go with one solid state and one tube (refers Polytones and Boogies). Jim Hall brings his own Polytone with him now, it fits as carry-on (although he's done touring for the most part). Martino back lines JC-120's a lot of the time now.
The trick is to know your frequency range on yoru EQ for whatever kind of sound you want to have. Then understand the difference between EQ on Tube vs Solid State and handwired vs machine made. It's not all that difficult.
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worked on my sound for years i use a es335 gibson 83 dot neck and a fender blues all tube amp added a compresson limiter pedal and a digital delay pedal finally got the sound you hear from a recording studio
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I recently got a Lexicon MX200 and love it. The reverbs are far superior to those that are built into my amp. Also have a Visual sound H20 chorus/delay that I just got last winter but will now be selling due to the lexicon having chorus and delay as well. I like playing with my effects and at times without the effects.
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I love spring/amp reverb. The reverb in my Ampeg Jet is much better to my ears than anything digital. That said, Lexicon has some great sounding gear for not a lot of money! Originally Posted by pmgnut
=-) PJ
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I use an Electro Harmonix Tube EQ to thicken the sound of my Ibanez AK105 through my Fender Princeton Chorus solid state amp. I changed the tubes to JJs and needed quite a while to find the right settings that will not alter the sound of the guitar but just add some mid frequency tubey boost. Those settings are a little tricky to find but once you have them, the result is very satisfying. The difference with or without the pedal is not night and day but I have come to really love it and don't want to play without it anymore. It adds character and although the sound comes from the fingers, it seems easier to get a jazzy tone with the pedal.
I plan to buy a Henriksen Jazzamp one day and I'm not sure whether I will need the Tube EQ then. Maybe it's more a usefull addition to not so jazzy sounding solid state amps.
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I've seen him a lot of the past handful of years and he's been using a Acoustic Image Clarus head (simple to travel with obviously) and then gets a cabinet locally for the gig. I've seen him use 4x12 Mesa cabs with the Clarus when he hits Boston. Originally Posted by Jake Hanlon
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I got me 3 Alesis Nanoverbs because they have a bypass jack on them, I use one as a chorus one as a delay and one a reverb. These are all half racks are 1/4 rack maybe but any way I built a little rack and stack them angle up toward me. I took an old peavey 3 button channel switcher pedal and made in to a pedal to turn on and off each nano verb like a pedal works great and only 99 bucks a pop new better sound cheaper then most pedals. I use a marshall bluesbreakerII for blues and to thicken the sound.
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I'm a guitar-cord-amp kinda guy at this point, though I've owned pedals and even floor multi-processors here and there in the past. I like a touch of amp reverb; if it's digital I like the 'Plate' model (I used to love the real thing). I do like compression plus delay in a country or rockabilly context. The only 'pedal' that intrigues me right now is the Carl Martin Quattro, but it's very expensive. Does anybody have experience with it? Oh, and I used to have a ShoBud volume pedal - that's one that I should have kept!
Last edited by Tom Karol; 09-06-2009 at 05:07 PM.
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I like Scofield's modulator effects. Not sure what he uses. Maybe he has used different things at different times. For a while I used one of those purple pedals from Line 6 to get a similar sound. It also had an auto-wah that put a nice edge on comping funkier tunes.
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One of Jim halls videos he explains how he uses a harmonizer instead of hurting his hands by doing odd intervals.
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Ya...I never really listened to Jazz much before now so Im sort of working my way through the classic stuff and pedals weren't around then. I guess I might notice more use of modern methods when I listen to more modern guitarists Originally Posted by Solo Flight
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I use a compressor pedal to even out the sound jump between plain and wound strings, bit of reverb, occaisional chourus and tremelo, Nice.......
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Sometimes...
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Have a bit of a problem with this at the moment. The saxophonist in my quartet doesn't think that if you have a good basic sound, you need to use pedals. Maybe being a bit of a purist. or neglecting the fact that this isn't 1953.
He's also ignoring the fact that unlike him, I play an electric instrument.
I use reverb almost always, depending upon the band and the room.
Sometimes I have a separate loop with an Electro-Harmonix POG and a chorus to generate a "faux Hammond" sound.
Always TC Electronics Polytune.
Plus I have delay, chorus and vaious modelled pedal fx from the amp (Vox valvertronix).
However, if it's a Big band gig, then I use the Polytune and my Henriksen jazzamp and.....er no, that's it.
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