Gibson's Dreaded Norlin Era

**vinnyv1k** · 02-10-2015, 03:27 PM

Patrick's advise is spot on. The best guitar I ever owned was a 1978 Gibson Super 400. Plain Jane wood but build quality, sound, and playability was the best ever.

**Woody Sound** · 02-10-2015, 04:30 PM

I had a fabulous mid-70's walnut 335 with the normal 11/16 neck, bought it new. Gorgeous wood, perfect fit & finish, rock solid neck.

**Marty Grass** · 02-10-2015, 05:45 PM

I'm in the minority I suppose, but the volute doesn't bother me. I'm not sure it has saved any guitars from decapitation, but that was the hope.

Many guitarists don't like anyone changing the designs of their traditional guitars. The addition of the volute created a lot of wailing.

**2bornot2bop** · 02-10-2015, 06:09 PM

Some 95 plus archtops, I've never owned a better looking archtop than the early 70's S400. Zero binding cracks or nitro checks...nada. I enjoy photo bombing it.

**Patrick2** · 02-10-2015, 07:57 PM

Originally Posted by Marty Grass

I'm in the minority I suppose, but the volute doesn't bother me. I'm not sure it has saved any guitars from decapitation, but that was the hope.

Many guitarists don't like anyone changing the designs of their traditional guitars. The addition of the volute created a lot of wailing.

Not at all in the minority about the volutes. There was quite a lengthy thread devoted entirely to volutes.

Why the dislike for volutes?

**Archie** · 02-10-2015, 09:59 PM

Originally Posted by Marty Grass

I'm in the minority I suppose, but the volute doesn't bother me. I'm not sure it has saved any guitars from decapitation, but that was the hope.

Many guitarists don't like anyone changing the designs of their traditional guitars. The addition of the volute created a lot of wailing.

I like volutes. As pointless as they are, they break up the long line from the neck to the headstock which is nice.

Some people love living by the sea but I think its depressing. Nothing changes, no seasons etc. The volute is my tree at sea.

Jesus I talk some bollocks.

**parker1713** · 02-18-2015, 05:29 AM

Have anyone know about notorious years of Gibson belong to Norlin from late70' to early 80'?

They have the bad reputation for les paul;but I'm not sure about L5 Archtop that made during these periods

Thanks

**paco1976** · 02-18-2015, 10:33 AM

Les Pauls are good. I got a 75 Les Paul Custom and it is an extraordinary guitar.
The controversy is due to changes in the design, introducing maple neck, volute, pancake body. But none of them is actually wrong, it is just a different design.
Arch tops are a different matter, they started using non flamed tops, which is quite unimportant related to sound. But they introduced as well kerfed bracing which is a major "no go" if you're planning buying the guitar.

Personal experience, solid bodies are good, concern with kerfed bracing. Not all archtops had this issue, if the one you're checking has normal parallel bracing you should go for it.

Another thing to keep in mind in the Norlin period, from 1969 to late 70s the pickups were T-Tops, considered he best pickups ever Gibson has made (except the original PAF in the 50s). From late 70s to 1986 the pickups were the Tim Shaw, also known as Dirty Fingers, not so many fans here...

**rob taft** · 02-18-2015, 11:19 AM

The Dirty Fingers pickups were but one type of full size humbucking pickup produced by Gibson during Tim Shaw's stay at Gibson. I own a 83 Heritage Flying V that came stock with his PAF pickups. These are very good PAF replica's and can produce a very good jazz tone. The Dirty Fingers were wound to be hot.

**Bluedawg** · 02-18-2015, 11:24 AM

There are some great Norlin archtops out there.

Judge each guitar on it's own merits ....

That said ... most of us would prefer to have something made after 1988 or 1992 or so ...

or something made before 1960

**Franz 1997** · 02-18-2015, 11:54 AM

Originally Posted by paco1976

Arch tops are a different matter, they started using non flamed tops, which is quite unimportant related to sound. But they introduced as well kerfed bracing which is a major "no go" if you're planning buying the guitar.

That's not quite right. Try reading this thread for forum info on when kerfed bracing was introduced:

Kerfed Bracing on ES 175

**paco1976** · 02-18-2015, 01:49 PM

Didn't know it was already used in the 50s. Very interesting.

In any case it is not a general rule, there are ES175 with and without kerfing in the same decades.

As usual with Gibson, there is a lack of consistency.

**Franz 1997** · 02-18-2015, 02:02 PM

My point was that you can't call every arch top guitar with kerfed bracing a ''major no go''..

**Al_F** · 02-18-2015, 02:11 PM

Not exactly guitar you are looking for but i have a 74 335 purchased it in 1981. It has Ttops, sounds great, people who play it love it. Think there is something valid to the bad rap 70's Gibsons get but bet it is over blown because most people buying vintage guitars are collectors really.

**kamlapati** · 02-18-2015, 02:18 PM

My '77 L-5C is one of the best guitars I have ever played.

Other than the plain maple, no short cuts were taken on these guitars. Mine stacks up well against my '46 and against all other L-5 that I've compared it to.

The conventional wisdom is that L-5 s from the era maintained their quality extremely well, even with the plain maple backs.

**parker1713** · 02-19-2015, 12:33 AM

Thanks for all comments

I have 1982 L5 comparing with 2011 L7. Sound wise, it proves that it's not inferior for Norlin period archtop except Norlin year don't have the flamed back&side.

**Hammertone** · 02-19-2015, 02:16 AM

Interesting - I see your 2011 L-7C has bound f-holes, which is a custom feature.
Could you please post pix of the guitar front and back?

**paco1976** · 02-20-2015, 07:05 AM

Originally Posted by Franz 1997

My point was that you can't call every arch top guitar with kerfed bracing a ''major no go''..

Right, I can't generalize.
It is a major no-go for me at this price level, personal opinion. Sorry if it sounded otherwise.

The sound amplified will not be affected by this.

As a general approach, if the kerfed bracing is something you can accept and the guitar sound and feels good to you then go for it.

**jzucker** · 02-20-2015, 07:46 AM

kriesberg uses one. 'nuff said.

**grahambop** · 02-20-2015, 02:44 PM

My 175 is Norlin-era (1976). Sounds ok to me. Here's something I recorded recently on it.

**Hammertone** · 02-20-2015, 03:00 PM

Originally Posted by parker1713

This is the pictures . I look through it; I think there is not post-production for F-Binding.

Thanks. That is a lovely-looking instrument.
What year was it built?
I have a Bozeman-built L-7C as well, built in 2004, and it is an excellent acoustic archtop guitar.
Does yours have a label in it?
I have seen several of them that do not have labels, mine included, which strikes me as odd.

Regarding Norlin guitars and wood selection, Gibson didn't simply decide to use plain maple for these guitars during the Norlin era. They decided to go from using slab-cut maple to using quartersawn maple. It so happens that the quartersawn maple they used was plain. They subsequently started using quartersawn figured maple, which they have now been using for over 25 years.

**wintermoon** · 02-20-2015, 03:31 PM

Originally Posted by Hammertone

Thanks. That is a lovely-looking instrument.
What year was it built?
I have a Bozeman-built L-7C as well, built in 2004, and it is an excellent acoustic archtop guitar.
Does yours have a label in it?
I have seen several of them that do not have labels, mine included, which strikes me as odd.

Regarding Norlin guitars and wood selection, Gibson didn't simply decide to use plain maple for these guitars during the Norlin era. They decided to go from using slab-cut maple to using quartersawn maple. It so happens that the quartersawn maple they used was plain. They subsequently started using quartersawn figured maple, which they have now been using for over 25 years.

this is true of the later Norlin era, but in the early Norlin era ['70-'73 ish] you'll see some of the most figured flat sawn maple from any Gibson era. last year I sold my '72 L-5CES and the wood was off the charts flamed....

**DB's Jazz Guitar Blog** · 03-14-2020, 03:58 PM

A while ago Graham and I talked about doing another virtual duet here. We have done one earlier years ago.

This time we went for a Raney vibe and I like the result. Graham is the right channel.

It's a Norlin duet actually ... Graham is playing a 1976 ES 175 and I a 1982 one.

Hope you like. I do!

DB

**Stringswinger** · 03-14-2020, 04:49 PM

Excellent playing and excellent guitars.

Over the years I owned three Norlin 175's (1970, 1977 and 1982). All were superb. I liked them way better than the pre Norlin 175's I have owned (a 1963 and a 1967).

I also owned a 2008 model which was the worst of them all.

I currently own three (a 1997, a 2017 Figured and a 2017 59 Reissue) 175's and all three are superb, but if I could go back in time, I would not have sold my 1982 175.

**DB's Jazz Guitar Blog** · 03-14-2020, 06:00 PM

Originally Posted by Stringswinger

Excellent playing and excellent guitars. Over the years I owned three Norlin 175's (1970, 1977 and 1982). All were superb. I liked them way better than the pre Norlin 175's I have owned (a 1963 and a 1967). I also owned a 2008 model which was the worst of them all. I currently own three (a 1997, a 2017 Figured and a 2017 59 Reissue) 175's and all three are superb, but if I could go back in time, I would not have sold my 1982 175.

I like my 82 a lot. Why exactly do Norlin guitars have such a bad rep? Is there a specific era people dislike? Maybe the late 70s when Gibson switched to maple necks on the 175? I especially like the 80s guitars, the ones with the mahogany backs and sides ...

DB