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I am a recent newcomer to jazz guitar playing but my chord knowledge and theory is coming along really well and I am spending a bit of time practising my comping (bit of chord, bit of melody).
The problem I am having is that I am still getting too harsh a sound out of my pick - it's a Dunlop 2mm plastic one.
Listening to some of the masters comping, you hear that nice mellow sound from their chords and none of the harsh attack and rattle I seem to be getting.
A gut feeling is telling me that there ought to be something like a rubber, or even a leather pick out there somewhere that would overcome this issue. Or is it just poor technique on my part?
Any help much appreciated.
By the way, I am playing an Ibanez Artcore Pat Metheny PM35 with the rosewood bridge fitted and tone control nearly all the way down.
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10-21-2010 05:24 PM
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Don't have any information on leather picks I'm afraid. This video shows a technique called hybrid picking, ie using both pick and fingers. That may be the answer to your tone problem.
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Many thanks for the suggestion. I am actually an acoustic fingerstyle player first and foremost so hybrid picking should not be too far beyond me. However, I'm still aiming for that 'Shangrila' where a chord strummed with the pick comes out clean and smooth.
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Originally Posted by Geoffers
It's not your pick, it's your picking technique. Many people use heavy Dunlops and don't have that problem at all. Try adjusting your angle of attack, or failing that go to a lighter pick.
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Wow, what a lot of replies in a short time! This forum never ceases to impress me.
On the string issue, I'm using 12 gauge flats and I really like them from the elimination of squeak point of view. They do also appear to have more "that tone" than the round wounds it was supplied with.
As for my picking technique - time to get myself a good teacher.
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Hey Geoffers,
beeing a Beginner myself I know exactly what you are talking about.
I think it simply takes Time to get better. Over Time you make a
lot of Microadjustments that you inconciously incorporate into your
righthand Technik. Most Players can nor explain how they Pick.
I use a Dunlop 205 on 0.13 D'Dadario Chrome Flats.
Try this, it worked for me:
Instead of "hitting" the Strings to sound a Chord strike slowly
down from String to Strong. If you get this to Sound good
strike faster (not harder).
Work on this until you can strike a Chord realy fast but controlled.
(I know my English sounds funny, it is because it is funny
)
Hope this helps.
Regards,
Ollie
)
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Many thanks for that advice. I am certainly going to try that later as well as making adjustments to attack angle etc.
By the way, your english is absolutely fine. I'd be interested to know what country you are in.
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I string very light (.8-.38) on a Gibson SG. I use a D'Andea mandolin pick (1.52) with a very soft, full, dark tone to it. I sound like I'm playing .11's. D'Andrea makes some nice full-sized (Fender-shaped) picks, but the pick edge is a bit rounder. Huge tone, 1.52. Watch out for picks with sharp points. Some don't sound so good. Pickboy makes a decent, thick pick. The whole idea that you have to use heavy strings to get a full sound is misleading. I gigged out with the SG playing contemporary "jazz", and that guitar going through a Roland Jazz 120 killed. But the .50 cent piece of plastic really gave me the full tone I was looking for.
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I use the D'Andrea Pro Plec. 1.5mm and the standard 351 shape. The edges are rounder than most which gives and nice warm tone and also maks it much easier to pick because it's polished.
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Hello all,
So, I've been playing almost exclusively using picks (which is one of the many reasons I like the Barry Galbraith arrangements so much ... almost every one can be played with a pick!). I've recently switched from the Jazztone (204) to the D'Andrea Pro Plec (or sometimes the Dawg pick, which is made from the same material, just larger).
To me there's a big difference (at least in my playing): the Jazztone seems flat and scratchy compared to the Pro Plec (not sure how to say this positively: the Pro Plec captures a broader range of the tone qualities?). But when I play them for people, NO ONE agrees. There's almost no difference they say!
What do you think? Here's the Pro Plec -- the standard size, just turned around so I'm playing with one of the rounded corners. (Yes, I know I'm hitting clicking on the pickup toward the beginning!):
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Listening to them back to back I prefer the tone of the upper video. Seems to have more meat and potatoes to my ears.
Nice playing! Is this from one of the paper books of his arrangements or one of the bootleg internet copies of his stuff?
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> Is this from one of the paper books of his arrangements or one of the bootleg internet copies of his stuff?
No, it's a real paper copy! I try to be pretty careful with copyright (at least in the spirit of the law, if not always in the letter). I wouldn't want to cheat someone (or in this case, someone's estate) of their fair royalties! Besides, I can hardly think of a better spent $15 than either of the two Barry Galbraith solo books! Every arrangement is a gem ... I want to learn them all!
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The top video - Pro Plec - is better, in my opinion. Don't let anyone tell you there's not a difference.
At the end of the day, however, whatever you prefer, go with it!
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The more I listen to the top version, the more I like it. Maybe you can answer another question: What is the chord on beat three of the second measure?
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> What is the chord on beat three of the second measure?
The notes are (from the bottom) Ab Bb Eb G. The editors added chord symbols to the Galbraith arrangements and they label this as an AbMaj9 (even though there's no major third). By any chance are you a chord substitution guy? The entire measure is Dm11, Eb7, Abmaj9, A7 -- back to Dm11. It sounds great but can you explain how the Eb7 & Abmaj9 function coming from and going back to Dmi? Just an interesting modulation to a remote key? If so, is that a common modulation? Or are they substitutes for something more expected in Dmi?
Brian
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Though in the case of the Andy Polon site (which has copies of the original, hand-written Galbraith mss), I think they may have predated the Mel Bay publication. Does anyone know if this is the case? At any rate, I think most guitar students would want the Mel Bay editions, since the hand written copies are quite difficult to read. The Mel Bay version has fingerings, as well (which I like, though sometimes ignore), and chord symbols. I'd prefer that there weren't tabs (since I tend to be lazy and not read the music when they are there) ... but you can't have everything. Originally Posted by Brian B.
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Beautiful playing, Brian. I love these arrangements - my kind of jazz. I'm going to listen to them both again. If pushed, I would only listen to the first.
I use a Gibson XH, but also use the rounded end.
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One essential for a pick/plectrum is that I don't drop it during a show. Need a nice grip, not too smooth.
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Funny, I used the Jazztone 204 until recently. I wondered what all the ProPlec hype was about, ordered a dozen and now I'm a convert :-)
So I vote for the warm meaty tone and round attack of your first vid.
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I am currently a fan of these Dava control picks. Dava Guitar Picks - Dava Control
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I'm old school....
I use one of four picks depending on the sound I want to hear for a certain song/arrangement...
As noted elsewhere on this forum....the material of the pick...the thickness of the pick... the finger pressure on the pick...your technique ...the angle of attack on the string all contribute to the sound you hear...
time on the instrument...
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I only use Dunlop Tortex Jazz III's, can't play anything else. The Tortex material makes me sound so smooth! and the size of the pick is perfect. I can't play any other shape/sized picks either.
On chord melodies, I use a mix of pick playing and hybrid picking, depending on what I'm doing.
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I agree the Pro Plec sounds better and the Jazztone sounds scratchy.
I am new to picks since in the past I have played only classical guitar with my fingers.
I still feel more comfortable using my fingers but I am trying to adapt to a pick.
It seems the Pro Plec comes in at least half a dozen styles, which one do you recommend?
D'Andrea Pro Plec Standard 351 Guitar Picks One Dozen | Musician's Friend
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The Eb7 could be thought of as a tritone sub for the V of Dmin. I'd call that "Abmaj9" an Ebadd11 with the root being on top. I think Galbraith was just looking for a particular voice movement connecting to the A7, giving it a sus quality, so I'd probably see that as a beat of Dmin, two beats of Eb and a beat of A7. I like to keep these things as conceptually simple as I can.
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Being new at this and having not used a pick I decided it would be worth trying a few:
The green one is a generic thin plastic one I had around. It is too flabby to use for jazz guitar.
Next to that is the Dunlop Jazz III max grip. It is very small, too small I think and the sound didn't seem that great.
Next to that is the D'Andrea Pro Plec which I do like size wise, but I think the blunt end could make it hard to pick fast.
It has a very round, warm sound that I like in certain situations but can be too muddled otherwise.
Next is the Dunlop Jazztone 205. Kind of the same as the Jazz III, didn't like it.
The last one and I think the winner is the Dunlop Jazztone 208. Pretty much the same size as the Pro Plec but feels stiffer and a bit thicker and has a pointier end which makes it easier to get between the strings. I think this had the best overall tone with better definition and note separation than the Pro Plec.
It didn't cost me much money to do this I think it was very worthwhile and could improve my sound and technique.
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