Gibson BJB pickup - History anyone?

[2bornot2bop]

What's the history behind the Gibson BJB pickup? Was it a replacement for the Johnny Smith?

And unlike the Johnny Smith, is the BJB always mounted a distance from the end of the fretboard? I ask about the mounting because I've seen it mounted as below on several different guitar brands. Why?

Here's a photo of the BJB in question on one of Danny's many fine Gibsons - Thx in advance!

[Woody Sound]

Bruce J Bolen



Bruce Bolen | NAMM.org

[rpguitar]

I owned this guitar for a while and enjoyed the BJB sound, which is hotter and punchier compared to a Johnny Smith unit. Mine was also mounted a distance from the neck, which I disliked aesthetically but of course was irrelevant from a practical perspective. I don't see any reason why this would be a common or necessary practice; I think it is just coincidence. There's nothing special about the BJB pickup's dimensions.

[2bornot2bop]

I owned this guitar for a while and enjoyed the BJB sound, which is hotter and punchier compared to a Johnny Smith unit. Mine was also mounted a distance from the neck, which I disliked aesthetically but of course was irrelevant from a practical perspective. I don't see any reason why this would be a common or necessary practice; I think it is just coincidence. There's nothing special about the BJB pickup's dimensions.

Thanks Roger. That was a beauty as each of your guitars generally are!

So, looking at the BJB pickup mounting screws, in relationship to the shape of the L5 style pick guard...the guard is narrower near the top and widens out from there. Might Gibson have mounted the BJB in that specific location more so due to the fact if the BJB pickup were mounted at the end of the fretboard the mounting screws would be nearer to the edge of the pickguard?

Surely there must be a reason why they'd not mount the pup closer to the cupids bow? I'm guessing that's over a 1/2" gap between the cupids bow and the pickup?

[Patrick2]

The theory for the mounting location was that it was closer to the bridge and therefore a little more "trebbly" than it would have been closer to the neck. Take a look at where the single pup ES175s have the pup mounted, Here are a couple of other examples;

First, my 18" Unity. As you know Aaron built this for me and he was a long time Gibson Master luthier. The second is a very special custom order SE, which I know you've seen before. It's inset pup loction is even farther to the bridge than that of a 175. (I should have bought this guitar when I had the chance to).

[rpguitar]

If you look closely at my ex-guitar (in the photo you posted), you can see that the 'guard is actually notched out wider than the pickup, and the person who installed the BJB had it mounted at the lower edge of the notch. It could have been mounted at the higher edge, nearer the fingerboard, but it wasn't. There was no obvious reason for that, and it bugged me a bit.

This work was not done at the factory. The 'guard actually had a couple of expertly patched areas where old screws were placed for a prior setup. So it's probably a bad example to use as a data point... Still I thought it was appropos to share.

I don't think this has anything to do with intentionally getting a "treblier" tone. The difference is very minimal so there'd be only a barely perceptible tonal change. Unlike the 175, L-5 electrics and Johnny Smiths generally have the neck pickup flush with the end of the board. It's not traditional on an L-5 to have a gap. So I think it's weird.

Probably better to show a stock Gibson from the time period that the BJB was introduced, the Super V BJB (see pic). Or even better, and I'll save Danny W. the trouble, here's a thread where he shows one of his sub-collections of BJB equpped archtops.

[nopedals]

I think it might have something to do with string harmonics. I know that Guild CA100s with factory dearmonds were not flush to the end of the neck.

[Patrick2]

If you look closely at my ex-guitar (in the photo you posted), you can see that the 'guard is actually notched out wider than the pickup, and the person who installed the BJB had it mounted at the lower edge of the notch. It could have been mounted at the higher edge, nearer the fingerboard, but it wasn't. There was no obvious reason for that, and it bugged me a bit.

This work was not done at the factory. The 'guard actually had a couple of expertly patched areas where old screws were placed for a prior setup. So it's probably a bad example to use as a data point... Still I thought it was appropos to share.

I don't think this has anything to do with intentionally getting a "treblier" tone. The difference is very minimal so there'd be only a barely perceptible tonal change. Unlike the 175, L-5 electrics and Johnny Smiths generally have the neck pickup flush with the end of the board. It's not traditional on an L-5 to have a gap. So I think it's weird.

Probably better to show a stock Gibson from the time period that the BJB was introduced, the Super V BJB (see pic). Or even better, and I'll save Danny W. the trouble, here's a thread where he shows one of his sub-collections of BJB equpped archtops.

Yeah . . . that's why I said "in theory". I'm very sure that putting the pup an inch or two farther towards the bridge will result in a different tone, I'm also pretty sure you'd need dog-like hearing to discern difference.

[2bornot2bop]

If you look closely at my ex-guitar (in the photo you posted), you can see that the 'guard is actually notched out wider than the pickup, and the person who installed the BJB had it mounted at the lower edge of the notch. It could have been mounted at the higher edge, nearer the fingerboard, but it wasn't. There was no obvious reason for that, and it bugged me a bit.

This work was not done at the factory. The 'guard actually had a couple of expertly patched areas where old screws were placed for a prior setup. So it's probably a bad example to use as a data point... Still I thought it was appropos to share.

I don't think this has anything to do with intentionally getting a "treblier" tone. The difference is very minimal so there'd be only a barely perceptible tonal change. Unlike the 175, L-5 electrics and Johnny Smiths generally have the neck pickup flush with the end of the board. It's not traditional on an L-5 to have a gap. So I think it's weird.

Probably better to show a stock Gibson from the time period that the BJB was introduced, the Super V BJB (see pic). Or even better, and I'll save Danny W. the trouble, here's a thread where he shows one of his sub-collections of BJB equipped archtops.

thanks for that thread....but they're all mounted close to the cupid's bow.

So, still not theory why two Gibson's have a 3/4" gap, or less, with a BJB pickup? perhaps odds are there are more to be found. What's you gut feeling as to why this occurred? btw, I did observe the wider notch on the guard and immediately thought, what's that about...looks like that notch would fit a KA 12 pole PAF.

btw2...why'd you move the guitar if you could have simply replaced the pick guard?

[rpguitar]

I didn't sell the guitar because of the pickguard. First of all, it was original to the guitar (even if modified), so that discouraged me and of course it was no big deal - certainly didn't affect the guitar's sound or any other substantive quality.

If I recall, it was the first time I had exceeded paying a certain amount of money for a guitar. Not long after, sometime in 2006, the famous $800 D'Angelico MIK sale happened. I got an EXL-1SH and it blew me away so much that I decided the Gibson was not worth keeping for how much it had cost me. Also, the frets were kinda low and wide - as was the Gibson style circa 1979/80 - and I had not yet found a trusted local person to do refrets.

It was a dumb move... but in more recent years I've made up for it with a few other (and better) L-5s, so no harm done!

[Danny W.]

The BJB was a revised version of the Gibson Johnny Smith pickup, designed by Bruce Bolan. Unlike the Smith, it doesn't have adjustable slugs, and has somewhat more mid-range; it's punchier overall, but not as "hi-fi."

Since it's not adjustable, installation and string choice are more critical than with the Smith--it's got to be level and electrically centered under the strings. Despite that limitation, I generally prefer it to the Smith, and have it on most of my floater-equipped guitars.

Since I've already been cited twice in this thread, here's a photo of another of my "many fine guitars" showing a BJB in its more common mounting position:



Danny W.

[2bornot2bop]

Thanks guys. My motive for asking these questions was a Super Eagle acoustic that arrived today with a BJB pup. This guitar was previously ordered and spec'd by Thom Van Hoose. Both the pup and the spacing are a new experience to me. Thanks all for their input...I'd anticipated pulling the pickguard, but at this point I'm going to leave things alone...why mess with 25 years...but I'll remove the thumb wheels and return it to the stock vol-tone knobs.

[BigDaddyLoveHandles]

My L-5P. I assumes that's a BJB that was mounted onto it later.

[wintermoon]

nice L-5P, looks like a '47

[BigDaddyLoveHandles]

nice L-5P, looks like a '47

Close, I think it is a '49.

I've had it since the '80s -- can't remember exactly when I bought it, but I saved up from a summer job as a janitor -- don't want you thinkin I'm some rich dentist!

[wintermoon]

it would likely have a modern peghead logo if it was a '49 and would be an L-5C
still have the label w/serial number?

[BigDaddyLoveHandles]

it would likely have a modern peghead logo if it was a '49 and would be an L-5C
still have the label w/serial number?

The label is still inside and it definitely says L-5P. i once looked up the serial number (A-something), but perhaps I'm getting the date wrong.

[guitarcarver]

I think that the reason pickups get mounted farther back sometimes is not always about the sound, but where the pole pieces line up with the string spacing. It really doesn't make much difference though because the magnetic field is not that narrow. With a pickup like a Benedetto S6 it's less crucial since it has a magnetized blade.

[Tom Painter]

Aside from sonic considerations, some folks like a space between the end of the FB and PU so their pick isn't constantly hitting it.

[2bornot2bop]

I think that the reason pickups get mounted farther back sometimes is not always about the sound, but where the pole pieces line up with the string spacing. It really doesn't make much difference though because the magnetic field is not that narrow. With a pickup like a Benedetto S6 it's less crucial since it has a magnetized blade.

Aside from sonic considerations, some folks like a space between the end of the FB and PU so their pick isn't constantly hitting it.

Gary and Tom, each of these set well with my sense of logic.

So, after cleaning the vol-tone pots I finally got to hear the BJB...wait 4 it...wow...I can see why this pup has been on the guitar for a quarter century...lovin it...just lovin it.

[fritz jones]

is it under the harmonic where the 24th fret would be?

[brm]

The BJB pickup has bar magnets so string spacing is not a real issue. The pickup is internally almost exactly like a firebird pickup. The only real difference is there is no metal strip on the top side of the pickup (under the cover) over the "B" string on the BJB. The winding is also perhaps a bit different and unlike the later firebird pickups the BJB is unpotted (original firebird pickups are also unpotted).

I believe one main reason for the pickup mounted away from the fingerboard is so one can pick close to the end of the fingerboard without the pickup in the way. Picking at the end of the fingerboard compared to further back toward the bridge has more sonic change than moving the pickup mounting position back a little in my opinion. I have a BJB pickup (among a few others) for an old (1949 L-7P) and I know on that guitar having the pickup mounted back a bit so there is easy access to picking at the end of the fingerboard is a real plus.

[Crm114]

Here’s two top flight Gibsons, both Hutch builds from 2002 with BJBs
yeah the red one has seen the world

[2bornot2bop]

Here’s two top flight Gibsons, both Hutch builds from 2002 with BJBs
yeah the red one has seen the world

Those are beautiful guitars man!

[citizenk74]

The BJB pickup has bar magnets so string spacing is not a real issue. The pickup is internally almost exactly like a firebird pickup. The only real difference is there is no metal strip on the top side of the pickup (under the cover) over the "B" string on the BJB. The winding is also perhaps a bit different and unlike the later firebird pickups the BJB is unpotted (original firebird pickups are also unpotted).

I believe one main reason for the pickup mounted away from the fingerboard is so one can pick close to the end of the fingerboard without the pickup in the way. Picking at the end of the fingerboard compared to further back toward the bridge has more sonic change than moving the pickup mounting position back a little in my opinion. I have a BJB pickup (among a few others) for an old (1949 L-7P) and I know on that guitar having the pickup mounted back a bit so there is easy access to picking at the end of the fingerboard is a real plus.