The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
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  1. #1

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    Compliments of another forum member I've just received my first Loar in a LH-650. She arrived with an aftermarket Ultimaguitar bridge in Cherrywood and a Bartolini 5J floater. How could I resist?

    Where to begin!? My biggest apprehension, since I ALWAYS buy blind...acoustic volume, and tone....this 'little archtop that could' quickly put my fears to rest...I couldn't be more impressed with her acoustic volume, warmth of tone, clarity, or her playability.

    R U kidding me? This is what U get 4 x amount of dollars???

    Being a bonafide 18" big box man, and having a negative experience with a 16" a year ago, I've been shy about sampling another 16" archtop. Oh that previous archtop was fine in most respects, other than being on the bright side - For my tastes. I prefer a darker, warmer tone...with clarity.

    Enter the LH650...

    Spotting this LH650 on the FS pages, and after a bout or two of gas, I found her too irresistible to deny.

    Fit and finish on this ONE is very good. I've discovered nothing out of the ordinary, from my previous archtops, all of which were in the $6 - $8k retail range. Sure, she doesn't have the grade 4a spruce, but what does that truly matter? What she lacks in higher grade woods she makes up for in actual useable preferred tone. And if you're like me, that's where the rubber really meets the road.

    Warmth, warmth, warmth....

    After giving her the Virtuoso premium clean and polish treatment, oh what sweet NITRO, I couldn't resist making a rare NGD post just to say for the record:

    if you're searching for a smaller archtop, say a 16" with an acoustic voice on par with a 17", look no further...and cheap too!

    Here's a few quickie iPhone pix...enjoy!



















    Last edited by 2bornot2bop; 09-01-2013 at 01:09 PM.

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  3. #2

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    First off.. happy NGD. I know how you like getting a good deal as long as it's combined with a good sound. Glad you posted as I've been curious about these.

    This one has several improvements and apparently no factory misses so it's not quite apples to apples, but you can get a new Loar LH-650 online for $1275 with a 5 second search. For an all solid wood instrument with a hand carved top, that's very hard to beat. And you aren't the first person I've heard say that these have a very good acoustic tone. Would be interesting to do a side-by-side with a Godin or two. In this price range it would be reasonable to expect some flaws and I think you're fortunate not to have encountered any, but jeez.. heckuva deal. Makes you wonder if you got a plum or if a lot of them are this good.

  4. #3

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    The Godins are laminate...not even trying to compete with the Loar.

    i think it'd be interesting to hear a Loar vs. a 1930's L5. That's an actual comparison.


    2bop nice pics..Was I right? These things have some attitude.

  5. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
    The Godins are laminate...not even trying to compete with the Loar.

    i think it'd be interesting to hear a Loaf vs. a 1930's L5. That's an actual comparison.


    2bop nice pics..Was I right? These things have some attitude.

    Good point. Godin came to mind because the top of the 5th avenue line is in the Loar price range, both brands are available from mass retailers, and Godin uses 'acoustic' a lot in their ad copy while targeting a vintage vibe. Of course, I'm absolutely in favor of 2B's getting a 1930's L5 and performing a complete and thorough comparison.

  6. #5

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    Sweet guitar I dig Bartolini PUPs.

    Congrat's!

  7. #6

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    Happy NGD. Although my LH350 is sitting in the corner now after my upgrade, I still say it's a great guitar. Love what it can do, especially for the price. I'm sure that the better parts the 650 has vs the 350 must make it sound much better. However, I do suggest you look into getting some anti-feedback gear (doug's plugs? I don't suggest tape so you don't ruin the great finish). Loar's tend to feedback like crazy at moderate volume (anything you would gig at), so watch out for that.

  8. #7

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    I'm glad you like the Bartolini, 2bornot2bop. I have one mounted on my Godin 5th Avenue and I like it. It retains a lot of the acoustic character.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Spook410
    Good point. Godin came to mind because the top of the 5th avenue line is in the Loar price range, both brands are available from mass retailers, and Godin uses 'acoustic' a lot in their ad copy while targeting a vintage vibe. Of course, I'm absolutely in favor of 2B's getting a 1930's L5 and performing a complete and thorough comparison.
    2b would be in favor of owning a 30's L5 too!

    Quote Originally Posted by docbop
    Sweet guitar I dig Bartolini PUPs.

    Congrat's!
    Thx all! This is the 2nd Barto pup I've acquired by way of a previous owner's install upgrade. The other was a humbucker version in the 16" archtop I earlier eluded to. Even though that guitar was too bright I thought the Barto was a gem. So far I'd have to give Bartolini's 2 thumbs UP!!!

  10. #9

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    Allways glad to hear from another happy Loar owner!
    Yours looks just like my blonde LH-600.

    Quote Originally Posted by jtizzle
    However, I do suggest you look into getting some anti-feedback gear (doug's plugs? I don't suggest tape so you don't ruin the great finish). Loar's tend to feedback like crazy at moderate volume (anything you would gig at), so watch out for that.
    I have a K Armstrong single coil on mine and gig with this every week in lots of different venues and with lots of different musicians. I never had any feedback problems with this guitar.

    Enjoy your Loar!

  11. #10

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    I know the pickup is not stock but, be it a Bartolini or the stock K.Armstrong, can this guitar be strung with phosphor bronze acoustic strings without string imbalance or does it have to be some DR Zebra or specifically electric guitar strings, Thomastik BB, etc ... ?

    I'm asking because the previous owner seemed to have phosphor bronze strings on it (???)

    Thanks

  12. #11

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    About strings, it all depends on how you want to play the instrument, acoustically or amplified.

    Can the guitar be strung with bronze? Certainly, and it probably should be (I prefer 80/20 to PB on an archtop). Can the pickup handle bronze strings? That's an entirely different question. If it doesn't have adjustable polepieces it probably won't do justice to the wound strings, but you never know. That's the problem with non-adjustable floating pickups on an acoustic archtop. If I had that guitar it would irk me because it's often a no-win situation.

  13. #12

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    I have flatwounds on mine because they sound best when I play amplified.
    At home i never play amplified, and I like the tone from the flatwounds unamplified. The guitar is certainly loud enough.
    I took the guitar on holiday this year and changed the strings to bronze 12's. It is offcourse only than when you hear what this guitar can do acousticaly.

    Like RP said: it depends on what you want to do.

  14. #13

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    Thanks for the answer about strings and apologies for having slightly hijacked the thread.

    It's because i most certainly have an LH-650 on the way to my home and i intend to put some soundboard transducer on it and blend it with the magnetic pickup. Apparently the guitar already has plenty of acoustic volume so in the worst case (string imbalance and poor signal) i can always just use electric or DR Zebra strings.

    Thank you. ^ ^

  15. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Geert
    Allways glad to hear from another happy Loar owner!
    Yours looks just like my blonde LH-600.

    I have a K Armstrong single coil on mine and gig with this every week in lots of different venues and with lots of different musicians. I never had any feedback problems with this guitar.

    Enjoy your Loar!
    Congrats on your blonde LH-600. I'd actually been passively searching for a blonde LH-600 over the past year. I too haven't experienced feedback issues in my home. I attribute that to the fact that I use a tube amp to compliment an archtop's natural volume, not as a substitute for it. Think blend.

    Quote Originally Posted by xuoham
    Thanks for the answer about strings and apologies for having slightly hijacked the thread.

    It's because i most certainly have an LH-650 on the way to my home and i intend to put some soundboard transducer on it and blend it with the magnetic pickup. Apparently the guitar already has plenty of acoustic volume so in the worst case (string imbalance and poor signal) i can always just use electric or DR Zebra strings.

    Thank you. ^ ^
    Hey, this is a jack free zone, isn't it!?

    Congrat's on your new acquisition. Your question was a very valid one. Had I a pair of acoustic strings on hand I'd have installed them when the guitar arrived yesterday. But perhaps that's a good thing because it gives me a couple days to discover the guitar's acoustic properties through flat's before installing some bronze strings.

    Hey RP, it's a guitar - No need to feel conflicted...just enjoy it...that's what it's for.

  16. #15

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    Beautiful wood on that guitar. The corner on that cutaway is sharp! Be careful you don't hurt yourself...

    Re' strings, just my opinion that bronze strings are a no-go with a modern magnetic pickup. Bronze is not magnetic, so you are never gonna get the balanced tone that the pickup was designed for. With my Godin Kingpin I used D'Addario Pure Nickel roundwound strings, which is a good balance between bright tone and mellow. It has that vintage vibe, if you will. Great for finger-picking too.

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
    Re' strings, just my opinion that bronze strings are a no-go with a modern magnetic pickup. Bronze is not magnetic, so you are never gonna get the balanced tone that the pickup was designed for. With my Godin Kingpin I used D'Addario Pure Nickel roundwound strings, which is a good balance between bright tone and mellow. It has that vintage vibe, if you will. Great for finger-picking too.
    As far as round wound strings go, there doesn't seem to be much love for the DR Zebra here..
    I like them, they really sound great as acoustic as well as electric.
    Slightly more finger squeak than the Thomastik BB though.
    If i remember correctly, GHS is also doing a hybrid string, forgot the name.
    Last edited by xuoham; 09-02-2013 at 10:17 AM.

  18. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by losaltosjoe
    2B, Congrats on the new Loar! The pix look great with the Headstrong Verbrovibe amp in the background. -- Cheers, Joe
    Thx Joe. How goes Cali?

    Quote Originally Posted by Keira Witherkay
    great looking guitar ...congrats and enjoy
    Thank you Keira!

    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
    Beautiful wood on that guitar. The corner on that cutaway is sharp! Be careful you don't hurt yourself...

    Re' strings, just my opinion that bronze strings are a no-go with a modern magnetic pickup. Bronze is not magnetic, so you are never gonna get the balanced tone that the pickup was designed for. With my Godin Kingpin I used D'Addario Pure Nickel roundwound strings, which is a good balance between bright tone and mellow. It has that vintage vibe, if you will. Great for finger-picking too.
    Thanks for that Jeff. Actually my interest in trying the bronze strings is more an experimentation to evaluate the guitar for maximum acoustic properties. For electric I'll be using half rounds....seems the best of both worlds. But I must say, these D'Angelico flats that came with the guitar seem real decent.

  19. #18
    Someone on another forum entry mentioned a Loar LH-750 available in Europe. Was that a cutaway with an ebony fretboard?

  20. #19

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    Congratulations on your new LH-650.

    Was there a previous owner that changed the pickup and bridge, or did you get some kind of custom order of a new one?

    Does the Bartolini give (almost unarguably) a better sound or just a different sound character?
    What about the bridge? Does it change the sound much?


    Does anyone know how much different the LH-600 and LH-650 (unamplified) sound?

    I have a LH-300 and I am wondering if I should get a LH-650 instead (or LH-750 if it becomes available).

  21. #20
    Thanks! Good questions all around. Since I'm the 2nd owner I have no personal experience with how the archtop played with all stock components. Per the previous owner it's now much better. This archtop reportedly received a fret dressing by the previous owner's luthier.

    All I know is, since this archtop arrived 5 days ago, there's not been a day I've not been engaged to play it for several hours, which is a first for me. The tone is so pleasing, so woody and warm, that I'm drawn to pick it up to engage that tone once again. That's a plus....

  22. #21

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    I have a LH-650 on the way to my home, a matter of less than a week i guess.
    Well, if i happens to be discontinued also i will feel lucky !
    Apparently it's hard to find a used one. I grabbed my square inch of chance (like in Carlos Castaneda's books) while it was under my nose: 1200 dollars for a slightly used store display item from ... (cough) Musician's Friend.
    I'm crossing fingers hoping for a correct neck angle (gulp...) and not too many QC issues (gulp ...).
    Even though shipped to Japan i can always return in the worst case, it will cost me a hundred shipping but it's still better than the horrible feeling of having bought a guitar by mistake.
    Never thought i would buy a more than 250 bucks guitar online, especially Musician's F****d, but i must say that 2B's post finished me off as i know he had many guitars and much more expensive ones.
    Just praying for a good lucky number ! ^_^

    Already bought a JJB Electronics sound board transducer to stick in the f-holes with a stereo jack output. Should not be too hard a job.

    BTW, o.t. but those JJBElectronics SBT are awesome, half the price of K&K and slightly better imho.
    Got one on my Recording King RD-10 dreadnought and it sounds incredible and is rather feedback resistant.
    paid 50 bucks !
    Last edited by Dirk; 05-19-2020 at 12:17 PM.

  23. #22

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    I went to a local shop and tried a LH-650
    I really like it and really want it.
    I liked the C neck much better than the V neck on my LH-300 (I think older LH-650s had V necks?)

    But it had cracks in the neck binding.
    I know it is common. But they shouldn't be in new guitars?
    I asked the employee in the shop and he said it is just normal and it is common and nothing to worry about.

    I think I can just as well order one online. I saw that Kiearan Moloney in Ireland (I think he is a forum member here) has great prices on LH-650 including shipping and optional full set up for a better price than the local shop.
    (but I can trade in my LH-300 in my local shop, but I can probably sell it anyway).

  24. #23

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    So, 2B, how is the Bartolini ? Is it ok without adjustable pole pieces ?

    My LH-650 is not here yet, at least one more week to wait, but meanwhile i read a bit about licensed Kent Armstrong vs Handmade Kent Armstrong humbuckers.
    Since anyway i'm going to stick some JJB transducers and route them to a stereo jack with the magnetic PU, i'd rather have some fat and dark sound. Apparently the stock pickup i bright and i guess so is the Bartolini, though very fine and acoustic sounding, but it would be very informative to hear it from you.

    Thanks

  25. #24
    No. In fact, the Barto is on the darker side of warm. Darker than a neck set hand wound KA. Not as vibrant as the humbucker, but very natural...did I say warm? It's very complimentary to the '650. Bright is how I'd describe many Eastman archtops acoustically...I've owned most of them. This lone 650 lacks any brightness. So much so that its just a step or two tonally lighter than most of the 18's I've owned, and darker than most of my former 17's.

    I've heard these are hit and miss, but for Euro prices on these one can't miss. It's such a comfortable archtop to play too. I can see why folks enjoy their 16's. Ridiculous amount of archtop for the money.
    Last edited by 2bornot2bop; 09-08-2013 at 09:26 PM.

  26. #25

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    Now I have also ordered one
    I am very much looking forward to receiving it.