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Hi, first post in this forum for me.
I'm a bit curious on all the love for Roland Cubes around here. In other forums such as thegearpage many complain about the COSM modeling compared to other manufacturers more recent modeling offers. Perhaps it is the more high-gain models that get the most flames, though. I own a Microcube which is really handy to have around the living room. I like its Vox model a lot. I have no experience on the bigger recent models.
Also, the Cubes have been around since the 70's I believe. I have an old orange tolex Cube 60 , which is made somewhere between 1979 and 1984. I think it sounds rather good and gets plenty loud. Are people here using these old ones for jazz or is it mostly the newer modeling versions that get people so excited around here?
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04-05-2012 05:02 PM
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Therein lies the difference, methinks. For the jazzers, it's the quality of the clean channel that's attractive at the price/weight point occupied by the Cubes. I'm sure there are many others like me who've hardly ever even tried the modeling effects of their Cubie.
Originally Posted by krueger
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Yep, this is a jazz board...we like clean...solid state does great clean.
The rock cats who dig the sound of their amp malfunctioning are after something different
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Indeed. For me it is the combination of:
- Plenty o' clean headroom at low weight, low cost, tough box.
- Decent balance and enough EQ to deal with most situations.
The only "modeling" I even think about is the "Deluxe" on occasion vs. JC most of the time.
OK, I use the "Rectifier" at full gain about once very six months (for about 90 seconds max) to recall my 3-piece metal headbanger anti-disco youth.
Chris
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Hi, welcome to the forum
(it's a great one)
The modern Cubes are pretty popular here yes. I doubt that many would say it's the greatest amp ever, but when you look at factors like price, portability, reliability and sound it's a pretty good option for JAZZ.
I think the thing it has going for it is a very tight/full lower end. I own a Cube40xl myself. In it's price range there was simply no competion when I was shopping for amp. All amps in that range seem to be very thin/lacking in the lower end which is very important for achieving a jazzy tone.
Also it has a very nice punchy attack.
So for now I'm fine with the Cube. But I do plan to get another (tube) amp as soon as my economy allows it.
Don't know too much about the older Cubes but there ARE folks around here who use them.Last edited by aniss1001; 04-05-2012 at 05:38 PM.
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I own two. I have a Micro Cube and Cube 20X. I like both of them and I switch between the two for practice at home. Honestly, I have not used the "clean" channel or the Jazz Chorus model. The 20X has a really convincing "Tube Drive" model which I like just as well as any small tube amp that I've owned in the past. I have experimented with the 20X's "Distortion" and "Metal Stack" models and I like them both. I set them for only mild breakup when using a neck humbucker on my Les Paul and by switching to the bridge pup for the grind and distortion. The trick that I've learned is that the gain control sounds best set between 9:00 o'clock and noon. If I e.q. both models with care, I really like what they produce for tone. I have found that the gain on the 20X can also affect the e.q. I discovered this one day and it changed my method of just how I e.q. the 20X. The "Tube Drive"model was not included on the 20XL or any other Cube for that matter........I think that was a mistake on Roland's part IMHO.
I agree that the VOX AC30 model on the Micro Cube is great. I can use it also for Jazz as well as Rock. The "Classic Stack" model is another one I use a lot. It is found on the Cube 40XL amp, I believe. I use the same method of setting it for "cleaner" tones from a neck humbucker, and get the drive from the bridge pickup.
Classicplayer
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Well just to have a dissonant opinion here (after all jazzers do like dissonance don't they?): the best word to me to describe the current cubes is "decent"... I don't get the love for them honestly.
The old ones sound pretty good to me.
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I tend to agree with you I believe. On the other hand what alternatives are there when talking NEW amps anywhere near that price range? Originally Posted by jorgemg1984
Last edited by aniss1001; 04-05-2012 at 06:46 PM.
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so are you saying my roland cube has more features than just the clean channel and reverb ?????????? :-) well on my cube i'm not even sure if the modelling even works other than the clean setting ......... the area where the modelling switch/dial is is definitely the "dusty end" of my cube
AND NO IT'S not MY ONLY AMP .......... I own a custom build tube amp and 2 other ss amps ......
But as everyone said they sound good enough clean to handle most any "live" jazz gig on a pro level ( i specified "live" i wouldn't want one in a studio session) without compromising sound quality and they small light and inexpensive...........
a roland cube is kinda like the 'swiss army knife" for jazz muso's .......maybe not the finest tool out there but it gets the job doneLast edited by Keira Witherkay; 04-06-2012 at 01:11 AM.
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Hello Krueger and welcome abroad!
To be honest I have been had a Roland cube 60 for 1.5 years long or so. It was ok, and did the job, but I recognized some day that after I picked a string and its sound was starting to disappear there was some unwanted soudn (like "hissss") coming out from the box. IT was not loud but I could hear that. I think it was because of the modeling and the plenty of things which were built in. Sometimes less is more than enough. So I sold it, and now have an IBanez WT80 jazz amp, which costs 50 usd more, but more better in my opinion.
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Hmm... like I said I'm no huge fan of the Cube but merely see my 40xl as a temporary solution until I can afford something nicer. But still the fact that your Cube was malfunctioning doesn't say a lot about the whole series. They are generally known for their reliability. Originally Posted by mrblues
Also the modern methods of efficient mass production haven't exactly improved on quality. That is any newer mass produced amps are rather prone to malfunctioning. Nothing particular about the Cubes.
IMO off course...
The Wholetone looks like a beast though. I'm pretty sure I would prefer it over a Cube60/80 too. Looks like it has got the low end of a hippo
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I think some of that "fizz" and noise produced may be caused by it being a digital amp. I've noticed that on my Cube 20X there is a "digitail tail" happening at the end of some sustained notes, usually for me, on the lower strings. I can't remember what model, perhaps the JC clean model on my amp.
I don't get it on the other models on the drive channel. Year ago I had a DigiTech delay pedal that had that "tail" on every note at the very end of the note. Maybe it was not noticeable in performance volumes, but it sure was in practice volumes. I think current technology has gotten rid of a lot of that aspect of digital sound, although some folks still complain of hearing it in newer amps.
Classicplayer
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Where I live no pro goes for an important jazz gig with a roland cube... Originally Posted by Keira Witherkay
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I am not sure actually, you probably don't get better. I like the AC line much better than the Cubes but they are more expensive. At that price range I would always go the used route - an old Cube for example. Originally Posted by aniss1001
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The Wholetone didn't sound very good when I tried one - sort of what rock guys think a jazz sound is. I think I would like the Cube better... it was a great idea but it sounded very artificial to me although it had a sort of a Polytone voice. Originally Posted by aniss1001
The Wholetone looks like a beast though. I'm pretty sure I would prefer it over a Cube60/80 too. Looks like it has got the low end of a hippo
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I had a Cube 60 as one of my amps for a couple of years, but I got tired of it and traded it to my local music store towards a guitar. I agree it was good for what it was, but I don't miss it. It's now a couple of years later, and it's still there at the store. I asked them why it hadn't sold. They said, "It's not for sale. It's our demo amp. We love it!"
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+1 Originally Posted by jscjr64
My Cube has modeling effects? I'll be darned.
Seriously, though, the Cube is great at smooth, dark, open cleans. I do hear complaints that the modeling channels are weak compared to other modern amps but I'd never know.
Personally, I even hate most tube amps because they all sound too fuzzy to me. I had assumed that's why I hated those channels on modeling amps.
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I did a number of drummer-less jazz trio restaurant gigs with a Cube 30. It worked well for that. After a while I just grew tired of it though...solid/inexpensive grab & go for jazz though.
I think the Ibanez Wholetone could be a good alternative if one is looking for a strictly jazz amp. But then again, once a solid state amp gets over 30 lbs, (which the Ibanez is) it loses its luster for me...I would tend to just grab a tube amp that doesn't weigh too much more. I think Ibanez should come out with a 10" speaker version which would cut weight and sell more in my opinion.
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Always exceptions of course but I know a pro whose gigging amp is Cube60. Originally Posted by jorgemg1984
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I know two guys who tried to do it for a while when the first batch was released but they quickly gave up. A know a few who do small gigs with AC-60 or AC-90. Originally Posted by Al_F
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A neo speaker and a little more watts would help the amp... I am not sure how well the amp is selling but if Ibanez has the same policy Fender has (giving up products that don't sell above a certain number like the jazzmaster ultralight) I am not sure how long will the Wholetone stay. The jazz market is a tough one for the big companies. Originally Posted by martinopass
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I had both the 80XL and the 40XL and ended up keeping the 40. I did notice the slight "fizz" accompanying notes with the 80 which I attribute to the bright switch on that unit. I think that switch has no usable function even for rock as it sounds terrible but I noticed it's effect was still subtly still there even when switched out. I have no evidence that this is the case, but I don't get the fizz with the 40XL which doesn't have the bright switch and the circuits are otherwise quite similar. In the end I'm quite happy with the 40XL and in fact have sold off my tube amps, I had a Deluxe Reverb, Blues Deluxe and Blues Jr and don't miss them at all. Good luck.
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I think the Cube suffers from being in a problematic position. People who are dedicated to jazz will usually go with something like a Polytone that can do a great jazz tone and not much else. Occasionally they might go for a Fender Twin or Princeton. On the other side of the curve, guys who like modeling loud rock stuff are more likely to use a Line 6, either an amp or a POD, or maybe a Fender Mustang. There isn't a huge market for people who want both.
I've tried a Cube in a store and though it was pretty good, but I've (currently) settled on a ZT Lunchbox occasionally supplemented by a Tech 21 Blonde for EQ. Can't quite tell you why, just that the ZT spoke to me more than Roland.
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That's interesting. I don't think there's any comparison at all, at least not at the volumes I play at. I own both a ZT Lunchbox and a Cube 80X, and the little ZT just can't push the amount of air I need to play in even a small-medium venue without sounding thin and weak. Originally Posted by Atticus
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Well when I bought the amp some months ago I tried all the ones in that price range I could and they all sounded just awful for jazz IMO. There was no competition at all. Closest runner up would be the Mustang. Originally Posted by jorgemg1984
I actually do regret that I didn't check out the old (pre-transtube) Peavey Envoy that you recommended, which was the only interesting used option I had. But it was pretty far to go and I guess I was afraid to buy a used amp thereby risking ending up with a dud with no warranty.
But I'm still wondering what it would sound like
If I see one like that used here in Cordoba I may even buy it and sell the Cube.
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