The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
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  1. #1

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    I'm thinking of trying one of those online courses and am down to either Richie Zellon's, Jens Larsen's, or Matt Warnock's?

    Any advice?

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    I like Jens but I've never worked through his courses. He goes fast through things on YouTube.

    I worked through a lot of the Robert Conti stuff and it gave me a fantastic start.

    Just try the teachers out and see what fits. I think all the teachers mentioned have free material.

  4. #3

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    I took Jens' course a couple of years ago. I got a great deal out of it. It's aimed at people relatively new to jazz, so you may not enjoy it if you're more advanced. There are ten lessons, starting from scales and arps, going through chromatic enclosures, chord subs, pivots, phrasing. You can spend as much time as you like on each lesson. I typically spent a week, with an hour each working day and more time at the weekend. You then post your lesson online and Jens will give you feedback, as will some of the other students. All the lessons are based around Take The A Train, with the goal at the end being that you know enough to apply the same ideas to another standard. Much of the material in the course you'll find in Jens' free videos if you search around enough, but the value I think lies in the structure and the feedback and advice you get.

    Here's my submission for lesson 3:



    And my submission for lesson 10:



    I didn't exactly come out of it playing like Wes, but I hope you'll agree there's a decent improvement over time there.

  5. #4

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    I just recently discovered Jens L's Jazz Blues lessons. I really like his solos and backing tracks. It really helps me if I like the songs/etudes in a lesson.

    Some beginner courses have etudes that, while effective at getting you to learn the lesson, don't sound very good. I have a hard time staying engaged with those types of courses.

    But, I can understand. It is probably really hard to make a good song etude, while keeping it simple enough for a beginner to play.

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by CliffR
    I took Jens' course a couple of years ago. I got a great deal out of it. It's aimed at people relatively new to jazz, so you may not enjoy it if you're more advanced. There are ten lessons, starting from scales and arps, going through chromatic enclosures, chord subs, pivots, phrasing. You can spend as much time as you like on each lesson. I typically spent a week, with an hour each working day and more time at the weekend. You then post your lesson online and Jens will give you feedback, as will some of the other students. All the lessons are based around Take The A Train, with the goal at the end being that you know enough to apply the same ideas to another standard. Much of the material in the course you'll find in Jens' free videos if you search around enough, but the value I think lies in the structure and the feedback and advice you get.

    Here's my submission for lesson 3:



    And my submission for lesson 10:



    I didn't exactly come out of it playing like Wes, but I hope you'll agree there's a decent improvement over time there.
    Cliff, I've seen you have come a long way with you contributions to the weekly jam. What did you do after Jen's course?

  7. #6

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    Very nicely done. What are you using for the backing tracks? Other than what I've picked up from YouTube I don't have many really good tracks. I purchased Band In A Box awhile ago and the backing tracks are just OK but not that great. The synthesized horns don't sound very good.

    Although I admit there might be more to BIAB than I realize. I don't really know my way around the software that well. Maybe there's more to it than I know? I'm just seeking decent quality recorded backing tracks. I'm not wanting to record my own tracks. At least not right now. I have Reaper and some top quality recording hardware and software for that. I simply want some decent quality pre-recorded swing and bop backing tracks for improvisation and chord melody practice.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by fleaaaaaa
    I like Jens but I've never worked through his courses. He goes fast through things on YouTube.

    I worked through a lot of the Robert Conti stuff and it gave me a fantastic start.

    Just try the teachers out and see what fits. I think all the teachers mentioned have free material.
    Which Conti stuff is good for soloing? I have a good enough handle on comping already.

  9. #8

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    I started Barry Greene's lessons 6 month ago and it's great. I am getting better and better. 0% BS, only sound, straight to the point explanations and advices. I am looking forward to this into action this into action in gigs now.

    Envoyé de mon SM-G930F en utilisant Tapatalk

  10. #9

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    @charlieparker - thanks so much! Prior to Jens course, I'd never taken any lessons. I was always of the mind 'there's so much good free stuff available, why bother paying?'. But Jens course made me realise how important good feedback is. So, after a month or so of meandering, I ended ups taking weekly Zoom lessons with regular contributor here Christian Miller. He's taught me a lot, but probably the single most important thing is to try and learn heads by ear.

    @jumpnblues - the. backing track on those was supplied by Jens as part of the course. I normally use iRealPro, but my teacher Christian hates it, and is more and more encouraging me to create my own backing tracks.

  11. #10
    I ended up choosing Zellon's bebop guitar method. I'm just starting to learn his scale fingerings. I'm impressed by the organization he has for that. I've never spent a lot of time learning scales and mastering fingerings in any organized kind of way and this looks helpful.

  12. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by charlieparker
    Which Conti stuff is good for soloing? I have a good enough handle on comping already.
    Hey

    Depending on where your skill level is you have two options.

    The ticket to improv DVD'S teach intermediate solos over the changes to jazz standards. You get four solos on each volume and you can check out people playing a lot of them on YouTube.

    I did one note samba and sped it up


    If your at an advanced level you could get an advanced solo dvd, these are only one solo but they're quite long and usually people find them challenging. My favourite is girl from ipanema.

  13. #12

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    round of applause....cccccccccccccclap

  14. #13

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    as Conti said If you practice modes and scales all the time, that’s what your solos will sound like – boring and uninteresting to say the least...i dont practise them .. .i head straight to the pdf solos..and use band in a box.i shall get one note samba and enjoy the challenge....Conti`s fingers very intimidating...like a concert pianist..express train...no way id ever dream getting there..lol
    Last edited by voxo; 08-15-2022 at 12:13 PM.

  15. #14

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    Which course?-conti-jpg

  16. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by voxo
    Which course?-conti-jpg
    Funny cartoon, but not something I agree with. I've transcribed a fair amount of solos and it didn't magically seep into my playing.

    Also, Zellon's approach is roughly the following.

    Take a tune and a position identify the scale patterns that require the least movements through the changes.
    Play arpeggios using those patterns through the changes.
    Play arpeggios targeting guide tones on important beats using those patterns through the changes.
    Embellish these arpeggios and guide tones using chromatic enclosures and the like to create guide tone lines through the changes.

    IMO, this is a more systematic method to get these sounds under your fingers versus just learning a solo or a set of licks.

    YMMV

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by charlieparker
    Funny cartoon, but not something I agree with. I've transcribed a fair amount of solos and it didn't magically seep into my playing.

    Also, Zellon's approach is roughly the following.

    Take a tune and a position identify the scale patterns that require the least movements through the changes.
    Play arpeggios using those patterns through the changes.
    Play arpeggios targeting guide tones on important beats using those patterns through the changes.
    Embellish these arpeggios and guide tones using chromatic enclosures and the like to create guide tone lines through the changes.

    IMO, this is a more systematic method to get these sounds under your fingers versus just learning a solo or a set of licks.

    YMMV
    I think both are important, I did find after playing a lot of Conti solos that when I improvised I had a connection between my fingers and ears and I would automatically resolve to chord tones.

    (By the way, that one note samba is from ticket to improv volume 2)

  18. #17

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    another great transcription is on Patreon by Francois Leduc...Howard Roberts version and only $2

  19. #18

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  20. #19

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    One of the following might be a good idea. They provide you with a template for learning a tune which you can then use and apply to any tune that takes your fancy.

    Jazz Song Practice Playbook: Introduction - Mimi Fox - Guitar Lesson - TrueFire

    Jazz Standard Learning System: Take The "A" Train: Introduction - Frank Vignola - Guitar Lesson - TrueFire

  21. #20

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    Truefire have really grown their jazz courses over the years. You can buy individual courses or be a member like I am, wonderful courses.

    I also just found about this chord melody teacher unrelated to truefire called Jake Reichbart.

  22. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by charlieparker
    Zellon's approach is roughly the following.

    Take a tune and a position identify the scale patterns that require the least movements through the changes.
    Play arpeggios using those patterns through the changes.
    Play arpeggios targeting guide tones on important beats using those patterns through the changes.
    Embellish these arpeggios and guide tones using chromatic enclosures and the like to create guide tone lines through the changes.

    IMO, this is a more systematic method to get these sounds under your fingers versus just learning a solo or a set of licks.

    YMMV
    I've heard about Richie Zellon's method, would you be able to show how his method's have helped your playing?
    I'd love to see a quick video as I really want to further my playing from here.
    I'm trying a lot of different courses at the moment but I'd like to stick with one person for the most part.

  23. #22

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    I'm about 9 months into Richie's Bebop course. I like it for the following reasons:
    • The harmonic approach he takes to improvisation (which he picked up from his teacher Charlie Banacos). I.e. it's all about understanding the chords, the chord tones and approach notes and enclosures to those chord tones. These are the raw ingredients to creating bebop lines.
    • He uses the heptatonic fingering system which organizes the fretboard so you can easily find your way around. As a trained pianist, the fretboard has always been frustrating to me. The heptatonic system brought order to it. I'm not familiar with CAGED but I've heard others say the heptatonic system is similar to CAGED with a few more patterns.
    • The first several modules focus on just jazz blues and on just one 'pattern'.
    • His approach is VERY systematic. Like anything, you need to study every. single. day. His systematic approach has made it easier for me to stick with the daily practice habit. This daily habit, probably as much as anything, has contributed to my progress.
    • His bebop calisthenics and especially the arpeggio frameworks were/are force multipliers for me.


    There's a very long thread somewhere here in the forums about his course. I suggest reading through that (at least the first few pages) for more details.

    HTH!

  24. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by fleaaaaaa
    I've heard about Richie Zellon's method, would you be able to show how his method's have helped your playing?
    I'd love to see a quick video as I really want to further my playing from here.
    I'm trying a lot of different courses at the moment but I'd like to stick with one person for the most part.
    I'm 3 weeks into it. Not sure what you want to see.

    Personally, I was looking for something very systematic and had narrowed down to three methods, Larsen's, Richie's and Warnock's.

    All I can tell you is what I like about it so far and they mostly echo the points made Maroonblazer.

    Richie's instructions are detailed. He has very specific instructions on what to practice and how long. There are 9 modules that are supposed to be covered in a year and you should basically spend 1 month on each. He also has a detailed lesson plan for each module as to what to practice and in what order and roughly how long to spend on each item. For me it is great not having to think about what to do when and just plow through the material.

    In each module he introduces a concept like arpeggios or guide tones and then he prescribes exercises to work through with his scale fingerings to ingrain the concept. In addition, he as musical etudes built around the concepts learned up to that point. So it is an integrated method to learn all of this. You learn a scale fingering, it's arpeggios and then use it in some etudes.

    He does this all on blues changes starting off with a basic 1-4-5 blues then progressing to a jazz blues and finally Bird blues.

    He has tons of videos and resources like backing tracks that demonstrates everything he is presenting.

    I can't say what the final result will be as I plan to spend a year mostly studying this.

    I signed up for the platinum which also includes 6 lessons with him.

  25. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by charlieparker
    I'm 3 weeks into it. Not sure what you want to see.

    Personally, I was looking for something very systematic and had narrowed down to three methods, Larsen's, Richie's and Warnock's.

    All I can tell you is what I like about it so far and they mostly echo the points made Maroonblazer.

    Richie's instructions are detailed. He has very specific instructions on what to practice and how long. There are 9 modules that are supposed to be covered in a year and you should basically spend 1 month on each. He also has a detailed lesson plan for each module as to what to practice and in what order and roughly how long to spend on each item. For me it is great not having to think about what to do when and just plow through the material.

    In each module he introduces a concept like arpeggios or guide tones and then he prescribes exercises to work through with his scale fingerings to ingrain the concept. In addition, he as musical etudes built around the concepts learned up to that point. So it is an integrated method to learn all of this. You learn a scale fingering, it's arpeggios and then use it in some etudes.

    He does this all on blues changes starting off with a basic 1-4-5 blues then progressing to a jazz blues and finally Bird blues.

    He has tons of videos and resources like backing tracks that demonstrates everything he is presenting.

    I can't say what the final result will be as I plan to spend a year mostly studying this.

    I signed up for the platinum which also includes 6 lessons with him.
    Excellent Well I'd love to see the end result later on because when I googled the course I just found this poll I linked. I hope the course works well for you, having one on one instruction with him should be highly beneficial too.
    Play everyday, that's the key.

    Poll: How far have you made with the Richie Zellon's course? (vol 1)

  26. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maroonblazer
    I'm about 9 months into Richie's Bebop course.

    There's a very long thread somewhere here in the forums about his course. I suggest reading through that (at least the first few pages) for more details.

    HTH!
    Any chance I could see how you play after 9 months? Or alternatively did anyone in the long thread you mentioned post anything?

    Still looking for my next long term jazz study but I want to see where this course leads. Even a lo fi phone recording would be ok.