The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
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  1. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Donplaysguitar
    Yeah but that's gettting ahead. Not to start a debate but;

    1. Playing from non-roots is more advanced (and was at least partially addressed in my post by "play freely" and "whatever you want"), and

    2. This fretboard "lighting up" business is getting waaaay ahead. I can think of at least two well known methods (I won't name them) that have the player focus on "one area of the fretboard" at a time when getting their improv legs under them. But one example would be Joe Pass' rather advanced "beginning" Blues etudes. Playable in one area.

    "Everything all the time" end goals is what overwhelms beginning improvisors, and discourages them to the point of throwing in the towel.
    In music, there's always a great player who got there some other way.

    In my view, it's a good idea to build in good habits from the beginning. To me, it makes sense to learn where the notes are. You can start with one string at a time if you want to. It doesn't have to be overwhelming.

    It also depends on the player. Some people, apparently, relate to diagrams of the fingerboard with lots of dots. I couldn't. Others can.

    The OP was asking how to connect G mixo to C mixo. The answer is to play G mixo and then, when the chord changes, switch to the nearest note in C mixo. You have to know where the notes are to do that. If you have to return to the root, you aren't there yet.

    I'm inclined to think that, at least for some, this is the fastest way to get to sound good. It won't be long before the student realizes that the same notes are lighting up for both chords, except B moves to Bb. And, then he has full facility to solo over, say, a G to C vamp without thinking about diagrams or roots.

    Could you be right? Of course. There's nothing in music where there's only one way.

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  3. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar
    In music, there's always a great player who got there some other way.

    In my view, it's a good idea to build in good habits from the beginning. To me, it makes sense to learn where the notes are. You can start with one string at a time if you want to. It doesn't have to be overwhelming.

    It also depends on the player. Some people, apparently, relate to diagrams of the fingerboard with lots of dots. I couldn't. Others can.

    The OP was asking how to connect G mixo to C mixo. The answer is to play G mixo and then, when the chord changes, switch to the nearest note in C mixo. You have to know where the notes are to do that. If you have to return to the root, you aren't there yet.

    I'm inclined to think that, at least for some, this is the fastest way to get to sound good. It won't be long before the student realizes that the same notes are lighting up for both chords, except B moves to Bb. And, then he has full facility to solo over, say, a G to C vamp without thinking about diagrams or roots.

    Could you be right? Of course. There's nothing in music where there's only one way.
    Yeah, if a player is able to skip some of those steps that I laid out, all to the good. If not...

  4. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by dionder_1
    Hello everyone, I asked a similar question a few months ago but I'd like to be a bit clearer this time. If there are any CAGED system guitarists that can help I'd appreciate it a lot. I'll use the example of a G blues I7-IV7 progression for reference.

    Let's assume, using the CAGED system specifically, I want to play the corresponding Mixolydian scales for the I and IV chord of the blues progression in G, which would be G Mixolydian and C Mixolydian. I know that using the CAGED system to make this change from the first scale to the second, I should switch to the nearest CAGED position of the scale I am switching to.
    For example I could start by playing over the I7 chord using the CAGED E-form G Mixolydian scale(root on the 3rd fret of the e string), and once the IV7 chord comes around I'd switch to the A-form C mixolydian scale(Root on the 3rd fret, A string).

    Basically my question is how I make this switch? What is the practical method to do so? All the material I've seen on the subject explains that I have to switch from one scale position to another, but never explains how exactly. I think I heard Martin Miller say he uses the lowest root note of the scale position as his reference point, but even so, how does that work? If was playing over the blues example, would he start playing G Mixolydian, and think "there's a C7 chord coming up, so I should find the nearest C note and apply the corresponding Mixolydian CAGED position I know that has a root on that string", or would he think "I'm currently playing in G mixolydian, the next chord change modulates up a fourth so I need to find the note a fourth away from my current root of G, then treat that new note as my new root to apply the corresponding CAGED Mixolydian scale position to it". Or am I thinking about this completely wrong? Hopefully I explained it clearly enough.
    .
    im not sure if I grasp exactly what the problem is from your description, but as a full time teacher and player, this is what I suggest to students.

    Whatever system you use (and CAGED is fine, Joe bloody Pass used it) and keep everything in the same part of the neck. You want to develop fluency and if you have to move position each time you change chord that works against that.

    So if you are in G, try using E, A and C shapes in 3rd position, or C, E and G shapes around 8th position for G7, C7 and D7 respectively.

    You want to be able to run scales into each other.

  5. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by dionder_1
    Would you mind elaborating on how an arpeggio based system like this would work in a practical context? eg. using the I to IV example. Basically, how would you think about this change in order to execute it practically?
    for me ...the arpeggios are the chords
    (the harmony) broken into bits (tones)
    this is good

    OK

    I7 to IV7

    in a bluesy situation in G

    the important moves to me are .....
    the 3rd of G7 B descends to become Bb. (the b7 of the C7)

    and also quite nice is
    the b7 of G7 , F decends to become E (the 3rd of C7)

    So I make sure that on the change I play a definite B to Bb
    and be sure to land the Bb on beat 1
    of the new bar !
    or maybe do the same with F to E
    and land that E on beat 1

    this is ‘making the change’

  6. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by pingu
    for me ...the arpeggios are the chords
    (the harmony) broken into bits (tones)
    this is good

    OK

    I7 to IV7

    in a bluesy situation in G

    the important moves to me are .....
    the 3rd of G7 B descends to become Bb. (the b7 of the C7)

    and also quite nice is
    the b7 of G7 , F decends to become E (the 3rd of C7)

    So I make sure that on the change I play a definite B to Bb
    and be sure to land the Bb on beat 1
    of the new bar !
    or maybe do the same with F to E
    and land that E on beat 1

    this is ‘making the change’
    Yep, it's referred to as "Guide tones" and "direct voice leading", "voice leading with guide tones", etc., etc..

  7. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by Donplaysguitar;[URL="tel:1157920"
    1157920[/URL]]

    This fretboard "lighting up" business is getting waaaay ahead.

    "Everything all the time" end goals is what overwhelms beginning improvisors, and often discourages them to the point of throwing in the towel.
    I totally agree with you
    I learn by
    just learning one thing ....
    on one tune in one Key

    its easy to give way too much info

    the whole learning thing is fractal anyway