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  1. #101

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    But is there perfection?
    ahhh...
    a journey without a destination--

    you would have to ask someone that has arrived

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #102

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    Hey Lionel sax...

    I'm going to skip the BS. You have almost no time. It's difficult to even hear or feel your pulse.

    You need to develop a pulse.... Generally with jazz start with simple 2 or 4 bar vamps.... If you like Blues, (who doesn't)

    Work on I7 to IV7... Bb7 to Eb7. Simple 2 bars. Sometimes players start with a 4 bar pattern....2 bars of Bb7 and 2 bars of Eb7.

    From that point.... develop a pulse. Start with 1/4 notes, 1 2 3 4, 1 2 3 4 etc. then turn that into slower pulse by feeling half note pulse. 1 x 3 x, 1 x 3 x. which becomes 1 x 3 x , 2 x 3 x or just counting or feeling by the bar,
    1 x x x , 2 x x x , 1 x x x , 2 x x x , which is feeling by the bar with internal sub-dividions. Which is just feeling 2 bar phrases, with 1st bar being the strong bar and the 2nd bar becoming the weak bar. (now your feeling two bar phrases).

    There are many other breakdowns of how to count, feel or organize.... time or space. But that's the point, your organizing how you count or feel time using rhythmic pulse with sub-divisions.

    Your creating the perception of Time... with the use of organized Repetition.
    You use patterns that repeat or create the perception of repeat.... which create, or at least the perception of "TIME".

    And in the mean time.... you'll develop your internal Pulse....and with the use of sub-dividing, the tempo can be whatever you want.

  4. #103

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reg
    Hey Lionel sax...

    I'm going to skip the BS. You have almost no time. It's difficult to even hear or feel your pulse.

    You need to develop a pulse.... Generally with jazz start with simple 2 or 4 bar vamps.... If you like Blues, (who doesn't)

    Work on I7 to IV7... Bb7 to Eb7. Simple 2 bars. Sometimes players start with a 4 bar pattern....2 bars of Bb7 and 2 bars of Eb7.

    From that point.... develop a pulse. Start with 1/4 notes, 1 2 3 4, 1 2 3 4 etc. then turn that into slower pulse by feeling half note pulse. 1 x 3 x, 1 x 3 x. which becomes 1 x 3 x , 2 x 3 x or just counting or feeling by the bar,
    1 x x x , 2 x x x , 1 x x x , 2 x x x , which is feeling by the bar with internal sub-dividions. Which is just feeling 2 bar phrases, with 1st bar being the strong bar and the 2nd bar becoming the weak bar. (now your feeling two bar phrases).

    There are many other breakdowns of how to count, feel or organize.... time or space. But that's the point, your organizing how you count or feel time using rhythmic pulse with sub-divisions.

    Your creating the perception of Time... with the use of organized Repetition.
    You use patterns that repeat or create the perception of repeat.... which create, or at least the perception of "TIME".

    And in the mean time.... you'll develop your internal Pulse....and with the use of sub-dividing, the tempo can be whatever you want.
    I am sorry if you can't feel the pulse.

  5. #104

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reg
    Hey Lionel sax...

    I'm going to skip the BS. You have almost no time. It's difficult to even hear or feel your pulse.

    You need to develop a pulse....
    OK, who hacked Reg's account? He's usually a bit more supportive.

  6. #105

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    Quote Originally Posted by wolflen
    ahhh...
    a journey without a destination--

    you would have to ask someone that has arrived
    I don't think people realise that if there were literal musical perfection it just wouldn't be attractive. That's why nature doesn't do straight lines :-)

  7. #106

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    Yea... sorry Lionelsax
    I guess I should have gone through the BS. You sound good, it's a difficult journey getting Time together.

    But I thought you were looking for what was wrong with your playing, the time thing. It's not really that difficult... but you do need to have the basics of performing in time. What it is and where it starts from.

    Your not alone... most musicians are time followers, meaning they have good time as long as long as someone is creating a pulse, feel and shape, the Form of whatever your playing.

    Metronomes are great, drum tracts are even better. Drum Genius is a phone app. that has lots of styles and examples of Styles or genres with lists of sub-categories with names and you can adjust the tempos.

    Anyway... good luck.

  8. #107

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    I haven't read the whole thread, but the OP's first question was whether he was skipping a beat or two, which he wasn't in the 2 minutes I heard.

    Time or pulse is a whole different thing, and I actually have no idea how or if that can be "learned".

    My daughter occasionally picks up a guitar to play a simple tune but when she does, each note is in exactly the right place; it's innate. On the other hand, a friend of mine stays in time as long as I'm laying it down for him. When I stop, he will stray after a couple of measures.

  9. #108

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reg
    Yea... sorry Lionelsax
    I guess I should have gone through the BS. You sound good, it's a difficult journey getting Time together.

    But I thought you were looking for what was wrong with your playing, the time thing. It's not really that difficult... but you do need to have the basics of performing in time. What it is and where it starts from.

    Your not alone... most musicians are time followers, meaning they have good time as long as long as someone is creating a pulse, feel and shape, the Form of whatever your playing.

    Metronomes are great, drum tracts are even better. Drum Genius is a phone app. that has lots of styles and examples of Styles or genres with lists of sub-categories with names and you can adjust the tempos.

    Anyway... good luck.
    Thanks a lot but I've got a very nice tool. It's a metronome on two and four.
    I will post something else soon. On the second video I had the metronome in my ear. You can see the light. It wasn't loud enough so I got lost very quickly.
    I think the problem came from there and from other things sure.
    If I managed everything everyone would know who I am. Stupid thought... unknown musicians are sometimes better than the greatest.

  10. #109

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lionelsax
    Thanks a lot but I've got a very nice tool. It's a metronome on two and four.
    To improve your time, try some more challenging exercises with that metronome instead of letting it pull you along. E.g., set it to beat once per measure. Try playing with that beat as the one, the again as the two, then three, then four. Now set it to beat once per two measures and do the same thing. Try that while comping, then while playing simple melodies, then while soloing with the more complex rhythms that were throwing your time off. If you lose lock, slow down or simplify what your are playing until you can nail it.

  11. #110

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    Quote Originally Posted by starjasmine
    OK, who hacked Reg's account? He's usually a bit more supportive.

    Meh .. getting clear advice from a great player like Reg is pretty awesome to me. I can't be anything but grateful that he finds time to help out the rest of us ... Packaging and BS in order to make it more digestible is in the nice to have and not need to have category to me

  12. #111

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    Buddy Miles told Derek Sherinian:
    “Mortimer, you gotta listen to the trains. There’s a train in every song.”

    At 01:18 on this video:


  13. #112

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    Lionel -

    If you're still there...

    Reg hasn't said anything that others haven't said already - mainly because it's just common sense. Some people can do math but not words, some people can sing in tune and some can't, and some people can keep time and some can't. Various exercises might improve it a bit but unless the essential ability is there, I don't know.

    This isn't a helpful exercise, it's just a short test... like going to the doctor :-)

    Will you try it? Here's the chart for Autumn Leaves and a backing track. I've done the first chorus just as it's written on the chart. Can you do the second? I just want to see if you can place the notes correctly. It doesn't have to be from memory - read the chart, it doesn't matter.

    This isn't supposed to embarrass you, it's just a test. If you find yourself lagging behind the beat, which you seem to do a lot, there must be reasons for it. Either you're bored with all this, or you're played out, or your hesitancy is because you can't think ahead in improvisation yet, or it just might be you. But since you do a lot of music all the time it might not be you.

    See if you can do this. It doesn't have to be the first attempt. Any one will do.

    Some problems with blues-aleaves-jpg


  14. #113

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    Lionel -

    If you're still there...

    Reg hasn't said anything that others haven't said already - mainly because it's just common sense. Some people can do math but not words, some people can sing in tune and some can't, and some people can keep time and some can't. Various exercises might improve it a bit but unless the essential ability is there, I don't know.

    This isn't a helpful exercise, it's just a short test... like going to the doctor :-)

    Will you try it? Here's the chart for Autumn Leaves and a backing track. I've done the first chorus just as it's written on the chart. Can you do the second? I just want to see if you can place the notes correctly. It doesn't have to be from memory - read the chart, it doesn't matter.

    This isn't supposed to embarrass you, it's just a test. If you find yourself lagging behind the beat, which you seem to do a lot, there must be reasons for it. Either you're bored with all this, or you're played out, or your hesitancy is because you can't think ahead in improvisation yet, or it just might be you. But since you do a lot of music all the time it might not be you.

    See if you can do this. It doesn't have to be the first attempt. Any one will do.

    Some problems with blues-aleaves-jpg

    Sure I can but there is no interest the way it is played. It doesn't swing. I want the melody to swing even if they are just 4th notes. My problem is not this one. Mine is more about articulation I think. Not really the beat but the feeling I give to the notes by trying to emulate my saxophone playing. It is something I cannot manage yet. I barely manage it on saxophone.
    I play with a kind of feeling I can't explore properly because of a lack of technique.
    I don't have the fingers, lack of practise.
    Nothing to do with the beat.

    Like if I weren't able to clap my hands because one misses the other one.

  15. #114

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    The transcription is bar by bar but Brecker isn't playing in time. Anybody care? No-o-o-o
    One of my heroes! Man this guy was good. It's a shame he's gone.

  16. #115

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    Contrary to popular belief.... pulse and timing can be developed.

    Most just don't develop rhythmic skills with a musically organized approach. Using a metronome is not an approach, it's using a tool.

    For almost all musicians, that internal sense of pulse and timing comes from,
    1) learning rhythmic figures.
    2) being able to recognizing them.
    3) being able to perform them by yourself and in group contexts.

    How you approach developing those skills.... has direct results. I'll skip the usual approach, over and over using or not using a metronome, just keep memorizing material over and over etc...

    If you want to improve the process... you need to learn how to breakdown and recognize rhythmic figures and understand how they work in different musical contexts. It's the only way to improve your speed and accuracy performing.

    (The breakdown part is through analysis of rhythmic figures). This is not my opinion.... I studied with professional drummers as a kid, players like Alan Dawson, his books. Ted Reed's "Syncopation". Peter Erskine's "Time Awareness. Even...Frank Malabe & Bob Weine's "Afro-Cuban", Duduka Da Fonseca and Bob Weine's "Brazilian rudiments" And all drummers have Bellson's Books.

    Most of this info. can be picked up Free on line...or with a subscription to Scribd for a month, under $10. Most can also be viewed on Youtube etc...

  17. #116

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    One can play AL melody and swing it, probably more with when notes are played than with how they are played.

    But I won't try to convince anyone of that. In fact, where is this thread going ? Although I'm not too surprised ...

  18. #117

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    Can't disagree with any of that. TBH I think almost anything Lionel practices here will help. As Reg says, using a metronome is not an approach. It is a TOOL. Right on!

    @Starjasmin - started Konnakol lessons today. This is going to be a RIDE.

  19. #118

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    Lionel -

    If you're still there...


    Some problems with blues-aleaves-jpg

    You are probably right but I found one of the issue.
    The big issue is my right hand, it doesn't float so I try to put only my pinky on the body, I used to put it like a rocker.
    It's not the best thing I did in my life but I tried.
    Box

  20. #119

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    So Lionel.... your thinking that your timing difficulties are from... "technical issue".

    Most problems with musicians, timing and just performing in general are from... Technical issues.

    Technical issues, make playing and performing with speed and accuracy almost impossible.

    But having and developing time and pulse are also just... technical issues. Just like how you place your hand and fingers are technical issues. You just need to become aware of the technical issues of Time and Pulse.

    Just for the record... I've performed with incredible professional players.... who also have technical issues with time and pulse. Performing Live generally exposes some of these issues, but that's why most touring professional hire band or musical directors that have the time thing together. Generally.... drummers or rhythm section players know how to help set up "Time". Make attacks feel natural, have balance and symmetry.

    The most common rhythmic tool to help create this effect.... is with the use of Repetition and Contrast to help create the sense or perception of Musical Form.

    This reality or perception of Time with the use of Repetition and Contrast, makes use of "patterns" that repeat. Repetition create sense of natural "Time".

    These are all technical issues of creating "Rhythm" or organized succession of strong and weak beats. And "Timing"... your ability to keep the beat, by yourself or in a group.

  21. #120

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reg
    So Lionel.... your thinking that your timing difficulties are from... "technical issue".

    Most problems with musicians, timing and just performing in general are from... Technical issues.

    Technical issues, make playing and performing with speed and accuracy almost impossible.

    But having and developing time and pulse are also just... technical issues. Just like how you place your hand and fingers are technical issues. You just need to become aware of the technical issues of Time and Pulse.

    Just for the record... I've performed with incredible professional players.... who also have technical issues with time and pulse. Performing Live generally exposes some of these issues, but that's why most touring professional hire band or musical directors that have the time thing together. Generally.... drummers or rhythm section players know how to help set up "Time". Make attacks feel natural, have balance and symmetry.

    The most common rhythmic tool to help create this effect.... is with the use of Repetition and Contrast to help create the sense or perception of Musical Form.

    This reality or perception of Time with the use of Repetition and Contrast, makes use of "patterns" that repeat. Repetition create sense of natural "Time".

    These are all technical issues of creating "Rhythm" or organized succession of strong and weak beats. And "Timing"... your ability to keep the beat, by yourself or in a group.
    Yes, this is my answer if you've got enough time, if you haven't... you won't understand.
    Good luck if you watch and listen, and yes my problem is 75% technical.

    I am more a musician than a guitarist, a mediocre musician and a bad guitarist.

  22. #121

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    Thanks, well done. Most of your notes are timed correctly on the beat, right? That means you can do it. So it's not you. You're not one of those people who just hasn't got any sense of time! Thank god :-)

    The problem comes when you improvise. Actually, you're not quite sure what you're doing, if you don't mind my saying so. There's a vague idea about playing some scales but you're not confident about what to play. That's going to throw out your timing because your mind can't keep up.

    May I suggest something? You're doing it in Gm rather than Em. Em or Dm is easier on guitar. But if you prefer it, so be it. So try playing it simply using G harmonic minor for the minor sections and Bb major for the major sections. Don't forget to make the lines fit the chords. You can also put some bluesy sounds in, especially on the minor sections.

    Don't be over-ambitious, keep it basic. Complicate it later, which isn't hard to do, but it's foolish to do the clever stuff if the simple stuff isn't understood first.

    Here's one chorus in Gm ( not a preferred key). It's just those two scales, making them fit the chords. It's easier to make the notes fit the chords if you can hear them! There are no b9 or altered sounds yet.

    And try to use the whole range of the guitar, not just the treble, if you can.


  23. #122

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    Cool .... best of luck.

  24. #123

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    Thanks, well done. Most of your notes are timed correctly on the beat, right? That means you can do it. So it's not you. You're not one of those people who just hasn't got any sense of time! Thank god :-)

    The problem comes when you improvise. Actually, you're not quite sure what you're doing, if you don't mind my saying so. There's a vague idea about playing some scales but you're not confident about what to play. That's going to throw out your timing because your mind can't keep up.

    May I suggest something? You're doing it in Gm rather than Em. Em or Dm is easier on guitar. But if you prefer it, so be it. So try playing it simply using G harmonic minor for the minor sections and Bb major for the major sections. Don't forget to make the lines fit the chords. You can also put some bluesy sounds in, especially on the minor sections.

    Don't be over-ambitious, keep it basic. Complicate it later, which isn't hard to do, but it's foolish to do the clever stuff if the simple stuff isn't understood first.

    Here's one chorus in Gm ( not a preferred key). It's just those two scales, making them fit the chords. It's easier to make the notes fit the chords if you can hear them! There are no b9 or altered sounds yet.

    And yes, you're right, I'm not sure, my left hand spends more times to correct wrong notes than playing.
    About playing modal on a tonal tune, it is not my thing, I used to do it years ago, it sounds flat (not in a musical meaning) and too commercial.
    I want to play long phrases like in be bop, not few 8th notes then a long note each 2 or 4 measures.
    I know what a structure is, maybe I want to run before learning walking but I'm able to walk yet.
    As you understood, I'm making my first running steps, I don't want to stop even if I fall down.

    And yes, you're absolutely right about the range !!!
    I'm not used to playing chorus and head... I'm too bad.

  25. #124

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lionelsax
    maybe I want to run before learning walking .
    I think so :-)

    I also think the other problems - timing and hand positions, etc - would cure themselves if this was solved.

    You have to be very sure of what you're doing before you can play continuous, or near-continuous, 8th-note bop lines. They don't always work on every song. I think, but I don't know, that it might be easier on a saxophone. I may be wrong but I regard that language on guitar as a specialised skill. It takes a lot of practice.

    Personally, I've never been attracted to it, I don't feel it or hear it in my head. That's just the way it is although I certainly appreciate it when I hear it done well. But I've also seen instructional material from good professional players that says use short melodic phrases... so I suppose each to their own.

  26. #125

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    I like this guy's playing. Real bop. I posted this album on You Tube :-)


  27. #126

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    Your box clip.

    My immediate reaction is it's too complicated. Slow down. Get the rhythm really clear and steady. Play simpler stuff. If you must do continuous 8ths, fine, but 16ths are probably a bit ambitious at this stage. To keep time needs fluency in what you're playing. Unless you're just playing something memorised, improvisation needs to be spontaneous. That's the test, if you like.

    We have a saying: KISS. Keep it simple, stupid. It's not very polite but it's a good message.

    When you can go round the simple stuff, then complicate it. Patience and perseverance!
    Ah ! You listened to Duet2, this is Duet1 : Box

  28. #127

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lionelsax
    Ah ! You listened to Duet2, this is Duet1 : Box
    Well the backtrack itself isn't in time, the melody isn't either and too complicated, despite what has been suggested.

    One step at a time is the only road to success ... proper backtrack, simple melody with silence, a bit more complex melody but not too much melody, still with silence (or phrases to say it otherwise), then when all of this is in time, then add a few rushed notes (16th).

    But as I already said, I doubt this thread will lead to anything. Reg quickly understood it.

  29. #128

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    Quote Originally Posted by mhch
    Well the backtrack itself isn't in time, the melody isn't either and too complicated, despite what has been suggested.

    One step at a time is the only road to success ... proper backtrack, simple melody with silence, a bit more complex melody but not too much melody, still with silence (or phrases to say it otherwise), then when all of this is in time, then add a few rushed notes (16th).

    But as I already said, I doubt this thread will lead to anything. Reg quickly understood it.
    Yes, he is a legend, he understands facts before they happen.

  30. #129

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lionelsax
    Yes, he is a legend, he understands facts before they happen.
    He is considered one of the biggest resources in a forum populated by gigging jazz musicians ... and if anyone has that ability chances are it's him

  31. #130

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lobomov
    He is considered one of the biggest resources in a forum populated by gigging jazz musicians ... and if anyone has that ability chances are it's him
    I like his tutorials.

  32. #131

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lionelsax
    Ah ! You listened to Duet2, this is Duet1 : Box
    Obviously the same answer. Which you must hear yourself, surely? Anyway, shouldn't #2 be better than #1?

    Do Autumn Leaves with Bb maj and G harmonic minor. Better still, play it in Em because Gm is not a good key for guitar. If you can't play something simple like that, how will you ever do clever bebop stuff? Don't deceive yourself and waste time.

    You can ask who you want but no one, repeat no one, will make you play better, only you. All the possible advice has been given here already. There's no secret formula that only special people know, it's all just basic music knowledge.

  33. #132

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    Il n'est pire sourd qui ne veut entendre ... pourquoi parler davantage

  34. #133

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    Ce n'est pas encore entièrement prouvé.

  35. #134

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lionelsax
    And yes, you're right, I'm not sure, my left hand spends more times to correct wrong notes than playing.
    About playing modal on a tonal tune, it is not my thing, I used to do it years ago, it sounds flat (not in a musical meaning) and too commercial.
    I want to play long phrases like in be bop, not few 8th notes then a long note each 2 or 4 measures.
    I know what a structure is, maybe I want to run before learning walking but I'm able to walk yet.
    As you understood, I'm making my first running steps, I don't want to stop even if I fall down.

    And yes, you're absolutely right about the range !!!
    I'm not used to playing chorus and head... I'm too bad.
    I enjoyed your last video. Sounding very musical.

    I would say - pay attention to upbeat placement. This should be consistent.

    Try playing the melody without backing and see how it feels to comp or clap along. Notice where it goes wrong.

    Listen and play, listen and play, listen and play. Listen to people who CAN play and copy what they do, just a few bars a day is fine.

    Your aim is to get a strong enough aural impression of where it should be that you are at least aware of where the technique fails...

  36. #135

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    I have to say to LionelSax that I admired his inner confidence to post his playing and let others comment. A lot of people just are not secure enough in themselves to do it. But, you have the instestinal fortitude to take the slings and arrows.

    That says a lot about you and I hope you were able to learn something that can propel you to the next level that you seek on the guitar - or at least give you some insight so that you can create a good plan.

    As we say in some parts of the USA, "Props to you, sir!"

  37. #136

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    Obviously the same answer. Which you must hear yourself, surely? Anyway, shouldn't #2 be better than #1?

    Do Autumn Leaves with Bb maj and G harmonic minor. Better still, play it in Em because Gm is not a good key for guitar. If you can't play something simple like that, how will you ever do clever bebop stuff? Don't deceive yourself and waste time.

    You can ask who you want but no one, repeat no one, will make you play better, only you. All the possible advice has been given here already. There's no secret formula that only special people know, it's all just basic music knowledge.
    Now I understand why what I play sounds complicated for you.


    Quote Originally Posted by mhch
    Il n'est pire sourd qui ne veut entendre ... pourquoi parler davantage
    I don't need a parrot.


    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    I enjoyed your last video. Sounding very musical.

    I would say - pay attention to upbeat placement. This should be consistent.

    Try playing the melody without backing and see how it feels to comp or clap along. Notice where it goes wrong.

    Listen and play, listen and play, listen and play. Listen to people who CAN play and copy what they do, just a few bars a day is fine.

    Your aim is to get a strong enough aural impression of where it should be that you are at least aware of where the technique fails...
    Thanks very much, thanks for listening.


    Quote Originally Posted by AlsoRan
    I have to say to LionelSax that I admired his inner confidence to post his playing and let others comment. A lot of people just are not secure enough in themselves to do it. But, you have the instestinal fortitude to take the slings and arrows.

    That says a lot about you and I hope you were able to learn something that can propel you to the next level that you seek on the guitar - or at least give you some insight so that you can create a good plan.

    As we say in some parts of the USA, "Props to you, sir!"
    I've got a French quote from George Patton.

    "Quand on fait quelque chose, on provoque des critiques chez trois catégories de personnes : 1) celles qui font la même chose ; 2) celles qui font le contraire ; 3) et surtout celles qui ne font rien."

    No confidence is needed, I just share what I do, some listen to what I do, some just repeat like parrots what they read about it, some try to help me but don't really understand, others show me what I'm looking for and I really appreciate.
    So nobody can listen without prejudice... Well it's just a forum.

    I understand it's hard for a lot of people to hear a standard, that's been played for nine minutes with a metronome on 2 & 4 without destroying the form.
    Nobody listened to it entirely (it's a waste of time maybe).
    Nobody understood I was playing bop phrases or kind of on some recordings.

    OK, not in time, I assume it, I'm not making an album, it's a recording.

    Well... The most important thing is that I understand what I do, if some people can't...

    It makes me laugh, nothing else.

    I wish someone worked the way I do but I'm pretty sure nobody does or just a few people.

    I'm sorry if I don't belong to a team, I know what I do, I've got my own opinion about it, I think by myself, I'm not a sarcastic parrot.

    I really thank the few people who really listened to what I do.

    For the other ones, stay like you are, don't listen carefully, keep your prejudices, act like parrot if you want, it's the way you are, it's fine, internet gives you a life.
    Last edited by Lionelsax; 09-11-2020 at 03:11 PM.

  38. #137

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    Translating your French quote:

    "When we do something, we provoke criticism in three categories of people: 1) those who do the same thing; 2) those who do the opposite; 3) and especially those which do nothing."

    That's a good one...

  39. #138

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    Here's something. It's not supposed to be depressing but I suppose it is :-)

    A friendly answer to Alfred.


  40. #139

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    For those who love listening to short music, shorter than a pop song.
    This is the same thing modified by Audacity.
    You will say... We don't feel the articulation...
    Box

  41. #140

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    Lionel -

    Salut!

    Well, it wasn't bad. Audacity can be useful :-)

    No, it doesn't sound complicated to me, that's standard jazz blues playing at a fairly high level IF you know what you're doing and how to do it. I know you're doing it but I don't know how much you understand the ideas behind it. Maybe you do, I don't know.

    I notice you were swaying in the video. That's a very good sign; the music is in you.

    See, I think we've come full circle in a way. Being here has maybe inspired you to practice more carefully and it's showing in the music. It's still just the timing and the content. I think the two go together. Confidence in the content will help the timing. Jazz stuff is difficult!!!

    Here... I don't bring this out very often but this is Stella speeded up with Audacity in 2009. I can do this stuff but these days I prefer my experimental things, I like it. 'Blues For Lionel' was abstract and experimental. Or maybe just mental, I don't know :-)



    I wasn't suggesting Autumn Leaves because I think you're a beginner or ignorant of jazz - you're obviously not - but because it really is beneficial to play simple stuff really well. But too many people want the success without the work. You know, they just want to be 'cool' but don't realise what it takes to do it in real terms. They're impatient, not that I blame them.

    Like I said before, no one can help you really, you just need to keep at it. None of it is easy.

    How did you learn such good English, by the way?

  42. #141

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    And I forgot -

    No team and no parrot. YES!

  43. #142

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    While I was waiting, I thought I'd just try something in Gm for Autumn Leaves. It's quite long but it just shows how it's fairly easy to push out lines using only a few ideas. Well, basically two and some subs. Sounds like good enough music to me, I don't know about you. I'm happy with it anyway.


  44. #143

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    Lionel -

    Salut!

    Well, it wasn't bad. Audacity can be useful :-)

    No, it doesn't sound complicated to me, that's standard jazz blues playing at a fairly high level IF you know what you're doing and how to do it. I know you're doing it but I don't know how much you understand the ideas behind it. Maybe you do, I don't know.

    I notice you were swaying in the video. That's a very good sign; the music is in you.

    See, I think we've come full circle in a way. Being here has maybe inspired you to practice more carefully and it's showing in the music. It's still just the timing and the content. I think the two go together. Confidence in the content will help the timing. Jazz stuff is difficult!!!

    Here... I don't bring this out very often but this is Stella speeded up with Audacity in 2009. I can do this stuff but these days I prefer my experimental things, I like it. 'Blues For Lionel' was abstract and experimental. Or maybe just mental, I don't know :-)



    I wasn't suggesting Autumn Leaves because I think you're a beginner or ignorant of jazz - you're obviously not - but because it really is beneficial to play simple stuff really well. But too many people want the success without the work. You know, they just want to be 'cool' but don't realise what it takes to do it in real terms. They're impatient, not that I blame them.

    Like I said before, no one can help you really, you just need to keep at it. None of it is easy.

    How did you learn such good English, by the way?
    Thanks, I only say and play what I understand, that's my answer.

    The saxophone is not a combination of tricks and shapes like the guitar, you've got to understand what you play.

    My English is not so good, I'm French from a Spanish family, my parents are used to speaking and understanding three languages, their native language (Valencian), Castilian and French.
    So I've always been aware that there were several languages in the World, it's the way I have been brought up.
    When I understood that British were British anywhere they were and the other ones were just foreigners (some French are like these British too) so I figured out I had to be understood.
    I learnt it at school, that's all.

  45. #144

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    I only say and play what I understand, that's my answer.
    We all do that, everybody does that, it's all we can do. But it hopefully increases with time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lionelsax
    British were British anywhere
    Heh heh, quite so :-)

    You're lucky to have so many influences. I had an army family so I spent most of life abroad in other countries and cultures. So when I got back here I wasn't fooled. Imperialism isn't dead. Mind you, bureaucracy is still alive and well in France too. But the internet has made quite a difference.

    The saxophone is not a combination of tricks and shapes like the guitar, you've got to understand what you play.
    Oh, that applies to the guitar too, or any other instrument. You have to know the theory behind what you're doing. But It's true that guitar can be played with shapes and tricks, in fact it makes it easier and produces better guitar music for jazz. I used to play the trumpet, by the way, so I know what you're saying. But I could never play a piano, I can't coordinate the two hands.

  46. #145

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    I think you have some nice licks going.. so congrats on that. It is very hard to carry on with an entire tune with no band or backing track etc.. at least for me.

    Your post resulted in some excellent input from other users that will help me and probably others so thanks for that!

    Good luck.

  47. #146

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    I'm going to give you a great song to pick with. Miles and Hooker together and it's awesome I was just out back playing to this 10 minutes ago...


  48. #147

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    I understand the issue... and it can be good excercise - I mean trying to improve it.

    But in many cases - if you play alone it actually does not matter.

    Even more --- maybe it is better to let it go as it goes, not trying to put restrictions.

    If you play alone you have only yourself for reference...

    If we play with others - or if someone drops a bit in strictly rythmically/metrically arranged tune - then it is a problem to be solved (I remember i saw a vid of ' Fly Me to The Moon' 4 for the bar walking arrangement where a guy suddenly dropped 4th beat in one place and did not notice it. Of course it is a problem that should learnt and solved (to hear a pulse not of every beat but of every 4 or 8 or 16 (or 12 bars).

    But if you improvise lines and play a sort of shifted accents, re-grouping, opolymeter things... i guess it is no peoblem if you lose 'backing 4/4' track.... you just have to appoint where the next 1st beat will be to get on track when you need it.


    Of course unless you have a particular goal to develope that skill in particular.

    I remember I also had a problem with blues when alone playing lines switching to 16 bars...

  49. #148

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    Thanks for your messages, I post another thing.

  50. #149

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    It's a miracle, you're cured!

  51. #150

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    Something with a lot of clichés !