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  1. #51

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    You mean for instance:

    Em7b5 | A7b9 | Cm7 | F7

    ?

    Interesting thing is there is actually a dominant function buried in there, but I'm not sure it helps to know that.

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by WILSON 1
    So, if Sam b is still with us.....I mean, if he hasn't shot himself by now...he was given a "Rosebud" moment by Mr. Basman before he, unfortunately, had to leave us.

    Now, this is probably in that realm...so go ahead.
    Well it's hardly out there stuff. Things like

    Cm7 | F7 | Bbo7 | Bbmaj7
    Cm7 | F7 | Dbo7 | Bb/D
    Eb7 | Eo7 | Bb/F

    And so on.

  4. #53

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    You mean for instance:

    Em7b5 | A7b9 | Cm7 | F7

    ?

    Interesting thing is there is actually a dominant function buried in there, but I'm not sure it helps to know that.
    I'm sure this is the way much confusion starts. A CM9, as I said, is CEGBD and contains all the notes of an Em7 - EGBD - but a CM9 is a major chord, not a minor chord.

    Similarly, an A7b9 may contain the notes of the Bb/E/Db/G dim7 but it's a dominant chord, not a diminished chord as we know it. Also similarly, a Bb/E/D/G diminished is a diminished chord, not a dominant. Dim7s are things to themselves.

    In your example, it's the A7 which has the dominant function, not any diminished chord. In fact, there isn't a diminished chord there at all.

    Soloing-wise, we might be able to run a diminished line over the A7b9 because of the similarity but that doesn't change anything. We could also run an A alt scale up it because it is, in effect, an altered A7.

    Part of the problem is there's a difference between a diminished triad and a diminished 7 chord. If the dim triads in either the major or melodic minor scales are extended they become m7b5 chords, not dim7s. Only the harmonic minor has a dim7 (at the 7th degree).

    I'm not saying I'm 100% right but personally I like to keep doms and dims separate. It's just a thing.
    Last edited by ragman1; 04-28-2020 at 04:01 AM.

  5. #54

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    The Importance of Being Diminished-untitled-jpg

    Naughty, naughty. Presumably the responses in blue came from someone who wanted their post deleted. They might not thank you for reversing their decision for them!

    'What many players do' is their business.

    'Nice subs' is true but not factually based.

    'Not really' isn't an explanation.

    'How is this relevant?' It's completely relevant. Western harmony is tertiary. Chords are derived from scales.

    The other points are both personal preferences, not a factual point. There's no law or ultimate authority with music, each one can do what they like. No one will get shot because they invent a new sound or change accepted practices. So I agree with the poster.

    But we might get shot for resurrecting posts that their authors want deleted. Unless it was you in the first place, of course :-)
    Last edited by ragman1; 04-28-2020 at 04:01 AM.

  6. #55

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    I've absolutely no intention of getting into an argument. If someone can correct me with fact, I'll be most contrite. But opinions, no.


    'Music theorists have struggled over the centuries to explain the meaning and function of diminished seventh chords.'


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diminished_seventh_chord

  7. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    I've absolutely no intention of getting into an argument. If someone can correct me with fact, I'll be most contrite. But opinions, no.


    'Music theorists have struggled over the centuries to explain the meaning and function of diminished seventh chords.'


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diminished_seventh_chord
    Musicians used them and theorists were confused by them... that’s the way it should be.

  8. #57

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    Absolutely. I see one, I play it. I hear one, I use it. They sound nice. I don't care why.

  9. #58

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    I

    Similarly, an A7b9 may contain the notes of the Bb/E/Db/G dim7 but it's a dominant chord, not a diminished chord as we know it. Also similarly, a Bb/E/D/G diminished is a diminished chord, not a dominant. Dim7s are things to themselves.

    In your example, it's the A7 which has the dominant function, not any diminished chord. In fact, there isn't a diminished chord there at all.
    Not sure why this discussion is getting so doctrinaire but one might say that diminished can serve as substitute for dominant chords in specific contexts. Many musicians will use a C#dim7 to substitute for an A7 if the melody allows for it. It does this because it contains the tri-tone - two of them in fact. That being said, the dominant function does not exhaust the functionality of a diminished chord. For example, you have the Idim7 chord or the descending bIII passing chord that do not assimilate to a dominant function. The dim7th is harmonically unstable (containing two tritones) and completely ambiguous when played in isolation and can practically go anywhere. It is context that drives the function. That seems to be why it is so useful.

  10. #59

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    Well it's hardly out there stuff. Things like

    Cm7 | F7 | Bbo7 | Bbmaj7

    And so on.
    OK, looking at this progression I see the dim on the tonic just before resolving to the tonic.
    But could you explain why that is "hardly out there stuff", I'm not familiar with that expression.

  11. #60

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    Quote Originally Posted by WILSON 1
    OK, looking at this progression I see the dim on the tonic just before resolving to the tonic.
    But could you explain why that is "hardly out there stuff", I'm not familiar with that expression.
    I think Christian is saying this is fairly standard harmonic technique. He is correct in that it is very old and found in the long classical era and early popular music.

    See as we are nerding out on diminished chords, I offer up this hand out on common tone diminished chords, that expands what we are talking about in regard to the Idim chord.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  12. #61

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roberoo
    I think Christian is saying this is fairly standard harmonic technique. He is correct in that it is very old and found in the long classical era and early popular music.

    See as we are nerding out on diminished chords, I offer up this hand out on common tone diminished chords, that expands what we are talking about in regard to the Idim chord.
    I’m sure you caught it out all three dim chords are inversions of the same thing and resolving to the tonic.

    Bearing in mind most of my musings come from observations of what people seem to play rather than the myriad of possibilities....

    Interesting Thing - as far as I can tell, people tend to treat biiio7 differently if it goes to I then if it goes to ii V. The second example is actually an example of hidden dominant function because it goes II7 (iim7) V7, but raise the root of the II mixolydian up by a half step. So in C

    D E F# G A B C (D mix)
    to
    D# E F# G A B C

    (Even for Insenatez where we never really get V per se.)

    this is iii harmonic minor starting on the 7. The related dominant here is that VII7b9 from Stella. So that’s the connection. VII7b9 moving to (iim7) V7. Diminished symmetry (brothers and sisters)

    ——-

    If the biiio7 goes to I it relates to a #IVo7 and Io7 much more.

    in this case IV7 or VII7 is the most common dominant relationship. Tritone subs. As we get IV7-I we could think of this as the blues resolution. Indeed the I blues scale is a great choice here, especially descending from b5. The chords are very often used to harmonise b3 and b5 blue notes in the melody.

    The harmonic minor on V would be the choice that emerges from the Barry Harris approach (IV mixolydian with a sharpened root.)

    But I wonder if that’s really a common approach? I would say bluesy ideas, dim arpeggios are much more common in recordings. Or just ignoring that chord or pretending it’s something else. Or the whole half scale (see Bill Evans.)

    (Jordan Klemons suggests basing your playing on this chord on the VII triad which does sound great. We can add the b9. Again this contains both the b3 and the b5 of the key. Simple but, clean, modern sounding and effective. interestingly that seems to take us back to iii harmonic minor, but also whole-half. It does for both.)

    Other resolutions for dim chords are very rare. There’s only one I can think of off the top of my head:

    Cm7 Bo7 Bbmaj7 from Insenatez. Very unusual!
    Last edited by christianm77; 04-26-2020 at 02:23 PM.

  13. #62

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    TL;DR if we are going to use Barry Harris ‘brothers and sisters’ metaphor for the relationship between dominants and diminished it seems to me some are very much the favourites over the others.

    Like swapping out Dm7b5 G7 Cm for Dm7b5 E7 Cm as opposed to Dm7b5 Db7 Cm

    This is also true of common tone dims

  14. #63

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    Other resolutions for dim chords are very rare. There’s only one I can think of off the top of my head:

    Cm7 Bo7 Bbmaj7 from Insenatez. Very unusual![/QUOTE]

    one other way to see it as a tritone sub..

    Cmi7 E7b9/B BbM7

  15. #64

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    It's not resolving to Bb because the tune's in Dm. The Bb is just a chord along the way.

    There's a descending bass line from Dm in the previous bars:

    Dm - Db7 - Cm - Bo - Bb - A7 - Dm

    The Bo is just a connecting chord. It could just as easily have been a B7b5 but the trouble with that is that it does sound as though it's resolved to the BbM7 and you don't want that. The Bo gives the feel that there's still somewhere to go.

  16. #65

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    Quote Originally Posted by wolflen
    one other way to see it as a tritone sub..

    Cmi7 E7b9/B BbM7
    How does that help? :-)

  17. #66

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    It's not resolving to Bb because the tune's in Dm. The Bb is just a chord along the way.

    There's a descending bass line from Dm in the previous bars:

    Dm - Db7 - Cm - Bo - Bb - A7 - Dm

    The Bo is just a connecting chord. It could just as easily have been a B7b5 but the trouble with that is that it does sound as though it's resolved to the BbM7 and you don't want that. The Bo gives the feel that there's still somewhere to go.
    Sure

    But - if you can find an example of this resolution to any maj7 chord in another song subdominant, tonic whatever, let me know. I can’t think of one. Can you?

    I don’t care if people can rationalise it with theory; my statement was that it was unusual in the repertoire.

    (you can rationalise anything with theory.)

    in terms of what I’d play on it, I’d play options from C harmonic minor. Cm - Bb is not that weird really. And this is a very simple flowing approach to that chord that suits the song in my opinion.

    I would tend to avoid using the dim chord like this in most situations... feels weak compared to a V7 or bII7. But maybe that’s it’s charm... bridging chord as you say.

    there is something very beautiful about that change of colour in that place in that song, that I don’t think really works elsewhere... it’s the sound of that song... but that’s Jobim for you.
    Last edited by christianm77; 04-27-2020 at 09:11 AM.

  18. #67

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    if you can find an example of this resolution to any maj7 chord in another song subdominant, tonic whatever, let me know. I can’t think of one. Can you?
    I could have a look but I don't know songs that well. I'm assuming you mean a diminished a half-tone above a M7. Is that right?

    .. but that’s Jobim for you.
    Too true, but isn't this tune based on a Chopin prelude?

  19. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by WILSON 1
    So, if Sam b is still with us.....I mean, if he hasn't shot himself by now...he was given a "Rosebud" moment by Mr. Basman before he, unfortunately, had to leave us.

    Now, this is probably in that realm...so go ahead.
    Ah, no, I haven't shot myself yet. Thanks, I think....
    I think that probably what Ken was trying to explain was either the point that I got from the Henry Johnson video and was expanded on very early in this thread or it was a more esoteric mystical thing like Pat Martino's diagrams that, while I enjoy looking at, are far beyond my brain to translate in a practical way.
    Thanks for helping me out.

  20. #69

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sam b
    Thanks for helping me out.
    Honestly, I don't think I helped that much. But don't wander too far from what your good friend was telling you.

  21. #70

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    Resolution is the move of a note or chord from dissonance (an unstable sound) to a consonance (a more final or stable sounding one).

    "Wave"

    | Dmaj7 | Bbdim7 | A-7 | D7 | Gmaj7 | G-6 | etc.

    Bar 4-5 of Chopin Prelude Op 28 No. 4 in E minor, which I have played for 50 years, bars 4-5 does the Edim to A-7/E movement. Bars 2-3 goes F#dim7 to F7. Bar 14 goes F#dim7 to F7. Bar 15 Fdim7 to E7. Bar 16 C#dim to A-/C.
    Last edited by rintincop; 04-28-2020 at 12:07 AM.

  22. #71

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    Chopin Prelude No. 4 Opus 28 in E Minor
    Attached Images Attached Images The Importance of Being Diminished-chopin-prelude-op-28-no-4-page1-51c90bcbef2b41-jpg 

  23. #72

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    How Insensitive
    Attached Images Attached Images

  24. #73

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    I could have a look but I don't know songs that well. I'm assuming you mean a diminished a half-tone above a M7. Is that right?
    Yes. I don't recall seeing it elsewhere in the standards rep.

    It just doesn't sound right if you do it in most situations.

    Dm7 Dbo7 | Cm7 Bo7 | Bbmaj7

    In a Rhythm Changes for example, but in the Jobim it sounds amazing.

    I suppose that's why music is an artform?

  25. #74

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    Quote Originally Posted by rintincop
    Resolution is the move of a note or chord from dissonance (an unstable sound) to a consonance (a more final or stable sounding one).

    "Wave"

    | Dmaj7 | Bbdim7 | A-7 | D7 | Gmaj7 | G-6 | etc.

    Bar 4-5 of Chopin Prelude Op 28 No. 4 in E minor, which I have played for 50 years, bars 4-5 does the Edim to A-7/E movement. Bars 2-3 goes F#dim7 to F7. Bar 14 goes F#dim7 to F7. Bar 15 Fdim7 to E7. Bar 16 C#dim to A-/C.
    That Bbdim7 is a pretty typical thing though to be followed with A-7 D7, here in the subdominant area..

    I'll have to check out the Chopin...

  26. #75

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    All diminished uses I know can simply be stated:

    Functional:
    o Leading note diminished: resolves a half step above. Effectively b9 backdoor dominant
    o #IV diminished: Resolves to the 2nd inversion of I (5th on the bass). It's also the same chord as I dim which also resolves to I.
    o bIII diminished: Resolves to IImin.

    Non-functional:
    o As a passing chord: Anytime a diminished chord voices fall between the voices of two chords ascending or descending, throwing the diminished in between usually works in retrospect even if it doesn't correspond to any in the "functional" category. The difference is these chords do not have a meaningful functional (ie secondary dominant) interpretation, so they don't usually get their own measures.
    Last edited by Tal_175; 04-28-2020 at 08:53 AM.

  27. #76

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    Yes. I don't recall seeing it elsewhere in the standards rep.

    It just doesn't sound right if you do it in most situations.

    Dm7 Dbo7 | Cm7 Bo7 | Bbmaj7

    In a Rhythm Changes for example, but in the Jobim it sounds amazing.

    I suppose that's why music is an artform?
    I had a quick look through the 3 vols of the Jobim songbook and didn’t notice this device anywhere but Insensatez. So even Jobim may have only used it once.

  28. #77

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    Prelude No. 4 Opus 28 by Chopin

    "This prelude uses what I can only think to call the "chromatic slip down technique." While it would be possible to label all the ensuing chords with function symbols or Roman numerals, few of them would resolve in the way they are "supposed" to resolve. The F# diminished seventh chord in the second half of the second measure, for example, could be called a viiº7/III, except the chord moves into a F7 , which is, what exactly?—V7/bIII in the relative major? Similarly, the E7 chord in measure 4 would be called a V7/IV in traditional harmonic progressions, but it does not move in any way towards A minor. The "chromatic slip down technique" is an elaborate way to get from i to V, and to express poignant, "world-weariness" at the same time. It is ambiguous harmony in service to a higher poetic purpose. I must point out an error in the copy. This anthology prints from an old edition, where the chord near the final cadence, just before the fermata over the half rest, is spelled like a C7 chord in third inversion. But in fact, in Chopin's hand, the Bb is spelled as A#, the making this a German 6th chord (C to A# is the augmented sixth, or in this case the diminished third) with the sixth in the bass, resolving in this case "properly" to the dominant of E. "
    http://legacy.earlham.edu/~tobeyfo/musictheory/Book2/FFH2_CH6/6F_ChopinChromaticism.html

    Last edited by rintincop; 04-28-2020 at 12:08 AM.

  29. #78

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    Quote Originally Posted by rintincop
    Here's my Chopin Prelude No. 4 Opus 28 lead sheet; I've been playing it on solo piano gigs for many years:
    B4 be like B D# E F#?

  30. #79

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    Yes. I don't recall seeing it elsewhere in the standards rep.

    It just doesn't sound right if you do it in most situations.
    Quite. I'll have a look. I know a Bossa site, that might give up something.

    PS. The Chopin/Jobim thing is very old hat :-)

  31. #80

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    Quote Originally Posted by pcjazz
    I had a quick look through the 3 vols of the Jobim songbook and didn’t notice this device anywhere but Insensatez. So even Jobim may have only used it once.
    But I repeat, it's not 'resolving to BbM7', it's just a connecting chord in a chromatically descending sequence to Dm.

  32. #81

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    What's the definition of resolving?
    Last edited by rintincop; 04-28-2020 at 12:05 AM.

  33. #82

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    Quote Originally Posted by rintincop
    What's the definition of resolving?
    Dm7-G7-CM7 is a ii-V-I progression that resolves to the tonic C.

    But it's not right to say 'Dm7 resolves to G7' because they happen to be next to each other. Otherwise you could take any two chords and say one was resolving to the other.

    Resolve means to come to a resting place, a finality, a completion, within the right context. To resolve a problem is to solve it so it's no longer an issue. An unresolved crime is one they can't solve.

    A good example of musical resolution, apart from chord progressions, is a suspended chord. An open D chord with the top G played - xx0233 - sounds unresolved. When it goes back to D major - xx0232 - it sounds resolved and complete.

    The very essence of music is that, tension and resolution.

  34. #83

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    Just to bang on a bit...

    It's quite interesting why a dominant blues sounds resolved to our ears. It shouldn't really

  35. #84

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    Resolution does not mean a resting place or finality. There are different types of resolutions (plagal, deceptive etc). V chord resolving to I is not the same as V chord resolving to iii. There are different degrees of conclusion. One is like period, the other is like a comma.
    The whole secondary dominant concept is based on these incomplete resolutions. That's why altered dominants work in say rhythm bridge.

    Sometimes a chord works as a passing chord because of voice leading. Say a diminished chord may not have a diatonic or secondary dominant function but just work as a smooth connection between two functional chords.
    Last edited by Tal_175; 04-28-2020 at 07:23 AM.

  36. #85

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    I said:

    'Resolve means to come to a resting place, a finality, a completion, within the right context'

    You're discussing contexts. Quite right.

    If it doesn't resolve then it's unresolved, which means it's floating about with nowhere to go. It's one or the other.

  37. #86

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    Resolution itself is a relative concept. For centuries the minor triad wasn't considered a proper consonance (why minor key Renaissance pieces usually ended on the major chord or bare fifths, something that Bach continued to do)

    And of course in jazz we regard chords with added notes to be consonant.. it's relative. C6/9 or Cmaj13 is more consonant seeming than G7#9.

    But there's still a sliding scale... A triad will always be a simpler sound that some lydian cluster voicing....

  38. #87

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    Resolution itself is a relative concept
    How relative?

    From now on it's only Locrian for me... who said it's a horrible mode? Resolves perfectly to itself :-)


  39. #88

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    chords with added notes
    Do you mean extended diatonically or altered? Diatonic extensions don't affect much although it depends on context, probably the harmony underneath them.

    But altered notes are quite deliberately made unresolved precisely because they can be resolved, like G7#5b9 to CM9#11. The #11 is not diatonic but no one would regard that sound as unresolved.

    An A7b9 to Dm7 in the middle of a tune in C is also a resolution because it's a perfect minor V-i (or, strictly, V of ii). But the Dm7 isn't resolved in the context of the tune as a whole.

  40. #89

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    The tonic has the sound of final resolution. However, resolution to the tonic may take "the long way home" by a path of partial increasing resolutions, often with departures from resolution in order to sustain or prolong the overall path length. I notice that just because the path of chords reaches the tonic that does not necessarily mean the end. Of the first three times the tonic is encountered, I hear that as complete resolution, yet the next chords seems to sound like increasing resolution on their way to a subsequent resolution - without having produced immediate decreases from which to manifest their increase.

    I'm curious if others agree with my tracking of resolution, below.

    Also wondering how others think about the tonic being completely and firmly totally resolved "home", yet one can follow the tonic with a chord that seems to sound like it is furthering additional increase toward resolution (achieving additional resolution after the tonic without an apparent decrease from which to resolve).

    x 8 9 9 8 x this is the tonic
    x 7 7 7 8 x increasing resolution (after the tonic!)
    x 6 7 7 8 x increasing resolution
    x x 6 7 8 8 neutral, maybe slight decrease in resolution
    x x 5 5 5 7 increasing resolution
    x 7 7 7 8 x neutral
    x 9 10 9 12 x increasing
    x 12 14 12 15 x neutral
    x 12 13 12 15 x increasing
    x 15 16 15 18 x neutral
    x 14 14 14 15 x increasing (this is the tonic)
    x 12 13 12 15 x increasing
    x 11 11 11 12 x increasing
    x 9 10 9 12 x increasing
    x 8 9 9 8 x increasing (this is the tonic)
    x 7 6 7 8 x increasing
    6 x 6 5 5 x increasing
    5 x 5 5 5 x increasing
    x 6 5 6 6 x decreasing
    x 5 4 5 6 x increasing
    4 x 4 5 5 x increasing
    3 x 2 2 3 x increasing (this is the tonic)

  41. #90

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    Do you mean extended diatonically or altered?
    So, this depends. Because not all diatonic extensions are consonant.

    To be honest, in general, most of the extensions we encounter in actual repertoire are diatonic, if not to the overall key centre then to some temporary key centre or modal interchange in the melody (for instance major/minor or blues). The extensions we add into changes are our own business...

    Even things like Kenny Wheeler and Wayne tunes, the extensions come from harmonising a diatonic note (i.e. in the key) with a chromatic chord. For instance, from the Kenny tune Kind Folk. The melody is clearly diatonic to C major, but the harmony is not.

    The Importance of Being Diminished-screenshot-2020-04-29-10-11-32-jpg

    The extensions represent the C major melody against the Fmaj7 and Ab7 chords. (notice no one likes to write F#m11b5 haha. This is not Kenny's chart so I don't know what he had.)

    I bring this up because some people tend to go 'oh yes vanilla, but not modern jazz with modal interchange harmonic blue notes organisation advanced concepts' and I think it's fairly obvious in that at least this case Kenny was writing a diatonic nice tune, and harmonising with nice chords. (It's a gorgeous thing actually. Also recorded as Heyoke.) Now that doesn't tell you how to solo on it... but it shows Kenny's approach to composition here was not that different from a standards composer...

    Often the best practice is to improvise on the melody in these tunes, because just applying chord scale stuff can destroy the mood.

    But the thing is... as a musician, the sounds are not interchangeable. Some tunes want a complex major sound, others want a simple one. Sometimes you want a seventh, sometimes you don't, and so on.

    But in any case, a lot of what we think of as extensions in say, Stella, are long diatonic appogiaturas (the melody is in Bb with two accidentals) - the always resolve to a triadic chord tone in the latter half of the bar (look at the original changes). So the guy who wrote Stella heard them as dissonances, but jazz improvisers hear them as colours. That's the paradigm shift...

    Diatonic extensions don't affect much although it depends on context, probably the harmony underneath them.
    That's not quite accurate. For instance, putting a 4th on a major chord changes its character quite a lot.

    But altered notes are quite deliberately made unresolved precisely because they can be resolved, like G7#5b9 to CM9#11. The #11 is not diatonic but no one would regard that sound as unresolved.
    Yeah. I agree.

    Which covers my last point re: the 4... I would not use #11 in all situations. It can be a bit much. But acoustically it works as a resolution.

    But this is my point really. G7#5b9 is 'gubbins' it doesn't have an identity of its own. So you can use any cadence you like into the C chord. It's just going to Cmaj7#11. You could play A7-->D if you wanted!

    However, it is a thing for modern players to disassociate this altered dominant sound as a voice leading moment type of thing and recontextualise it as a sound in its own right.

    So we get, for instance:

    Eb on G7 D on Cmaj7

    Obviously both sounds are consonant to some degree. In this case the tonic chord is more complex.

    An A7b9 to Dm7 in the middle of a tune in C is also a resolution because it's a perfect minor V-i (or, strictly, V of ii). But the Dm7 isn't resolved in the context of the tune as a whole.
    Well these tonicisations/temporary key changes represent levels of detail the improviser can add in or ignore according to taste.

  42. #91

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    G7#5b9 is 'gubbins' it doesn't have an identity of its own
    Would that apply to any altered chord? That is, they're the work of man... but as opposed to what? I'd say 'alt' was a standard identity in current musical terms.
    The Importance of Being Diminished-kind-folk-wheeler-concert-lead-sheet-jpg

    PS. I hate to tout my own stuff but you might care for this (as we're talking about resolution):

    Our Own Compositions. Post them here!
    Last edited by ragman1; 04-29-2020 at 11:43 AM.

  43. #92

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    "resolution" through a specific
    voice leading
    procedure.
    Last edited by rintincop; 04-30-2020 at 04:13 PM.

  44. #93

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    "...so in the end..."

    ...as they say...

    what did Sam b "take" about the diminished chord?

  45. #94

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    "The Importance Of Being Diminished"

  46. #95

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    A true gateway to improvisation lost in academic babel.

  47. #96

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    Try as I may , i can't make the HW or WH dim scale
    sound any good on anything ...

    I know where they SHOULD fit but ....
    (I do like the sound of dim arpeggio played on dim chords)

    can anyone help me with a nice sounding line or two
    to study , in the context of a tune would be great ....

    I don't need any more theory thanks chaps
    just a nice practical example or two