A Modern Method for Guitar Vol 1 Pages 46 to 49

[ten left thumbs]

Thanks for the encouragement. I find singing helps me focus. Some bits are trickier than others.

Kojo - the leaps on picking required for this need elbow, I think.

[Will Glen]

I memorized pattern II this week during review and have pattern I memorized as well. I'm working them up and down the neck. I will work on pattern III this week to try and get it under my fingers. I'm practicing them all in the second position first reading them and then memorizing them over time. I can't believe how long it takes me to memorize just these patterns but it does.

Speed Studies patterns I and II revisited pg 46.mp3 - File Shared from Box - Free Online File Storage

[Will Glen]

Hi everyone, I had another go at endurance etude.

https://www.box.com/s/c05b26b8408adc16e642

This is a fair recording for me - I've played it better, I've played it worse. When I visualise the notes clearly, I get them always. Every mistake is a mistake of mental vagueness, not finger problems.

Great job!

[Clamps]

Here I am, rocket fuel in my hands!

[TOMMO]

Hello again,

on the Endurance Etude and similar picking etudes where you hold down one note at the top and play the melody below (and similar lessons that work vice versa):

How vital is it to pick all the notes with the flatpick? I am used to hybrid picking for decades now and it works perfectly for me, so...

What do you think?

[Kojo27]

Hello again,

on the Endurance Etude and similar picking etudes where you hold down one note at the top and play the melody below (and similar lessons that work vice versa):

How vital is it to pick all the notes with the flatpick? I am used to hybrid picking for decades now and it works perfectly for me, so...

What do you think?

Hi Tom,

IMHO, it depends on whether you want optimal pick technique. Playing the type of etudes you mention are easy with pick and fingers, and super-easy played fingerstyle. But my impression of Leavitt's method is that one of his BIG objectives is to build in the student a strong, versatile technique for using a plectrum/pick. This doesn't mean you have to do that, of course -- but if you aren't doing the exercises as he intended, is it really Leavitt's method you're learning -- or something else?

The type of picking required in pieces such as the Endurance Etude can do wonders toward developing your wrist/forearm/finger muscles such that you'll be better able to use a pick. The thing is, these studies require steady review. Just learning enough to get through it... and then forgetting about it - this is not what Leavitt intended, and that initial learning just might lead to nothing much. Unless one intends to go back and review, almost every day for a while, then for a few days a week for a while; then, say, once a week - then after doing the things once a week for a long time, maybe cut down to once every two weeks.... I hope that makes sense.

According to students of Leavitt, the long-term goal is to master these exercises as if they were pieces of music to be performed before a scrutinizing audience. If you can do that with the pieces Leavitt presents in his method, you'll be FAR, FAR ahead of the herd regarding your ability to use a pick.

For what it's worth: one gripe I have with Leavitt is that he doesn't, to my knowledge, ever stress the importance of staying relaxed when playing with a pick. This was my big mistake during my "first phase" of guitar playing. I had no teacher, and played non-stop, but with my fingers and wrist all tensed up. Needless to say, I got nowhere. Well, I could play smoothly and in time, but with no semblance of speed.

Chris Thile, mandolin "genius" - who has the best pick technique I've ever encountered - says do this: when practicing, esp. scales, arpeggios, exercises -- play a 'game' -- play the stuff and actually play with such a loose grip that you sometimes drop the pick. Just barely hang onto it. You won't get much volume or tone this way, but speed will come quickly. Once you have accuracy and speed, start gripping the pick a little tighter. This gives you more volume. Continue this way until you can play loud and still be very relaxed - and VOILA! (It's working for me!)

kj

[TOMMO]

Why am I not surprised? Stupid question that was, eh? As I am surely aware that Leavitt's method is about using a flatpick to one's best advantage...


Anyway: thanks for taking the time to reply. I am reviewing constantly. I have been at this since late April or early May and there has hardly been a day without me spending at least 20 minutes (most often more time) with the book. I can't sightread yet (didn't expect to be able to do so) but I can learn the etudes, lessons, studies etc. by reading standard notation which I wasn't able to do a couple of months ago. I think it's a great book. My playing technique has advanced a good deal too.

As for pick technique: I think my technique isn't too bad after having played for more than fourty years but you can always build up on it and make it better. Thanks for the head's up on the tips from Chris Tile - I will definitely think of his advice.

Cheers

Tommo

[Langs]

Finally got my homework done for this section, this took me a little more than 2 weeks. I also think, with just 15 mins per day, one section every 2 weeks is more feasible anyways especially with the reviewing in between.

Chromatic Scale was the least hard part, still a bit of a struggle:


With the limited time, I just stayed in C major for the first round of the speed studies. Here they are at 44 Bpm;
Pattern 1


Pattern2


Pattern3

[Langs]

I really thought this endurance etude was going to take me a lot of weeks before I would get to the point where I could play this in a more or less controlled way and with only a mistake here and there. A little more than a week got me to this point though:

44 Bpm this is

[michael-m]

Hi Tom,

IMHO, it depends on whether you want optimal pick technique. Playing the type of etudes you mention are easy with pick and fingers, and super-easy played fingerstyle. But my impression of Leavitt's method is that one of his BIG objectives is to build in the student a strong, versatile technique for using a plectrum/pick. This doesn't mean you have to do that, of course -- but if you aren't doing the exercises as he intended, is it really Leavitt's method you're learning -- or something else?

The type of picking required in pieces such as the Endurance Etude can do wonders toward developing your wrist/forearm/finger muscles such that you'll be better able to use a pick. The thing is, these studies require steady review. Just learning enough to get through it... and then forgetting about it - this is not what Leavitt intended, and that initial learning just might lead to nothing much. Unless one intends to go back and review, almost every day for a while, then for a few days a week for a while; then, say, once a week - then after doing the things once a week for a long time, maybe cut down to once every two weeks.... I hope that makes sense.

According to students of Leavitt, the long-term goal is to master these exercises as if they were pieces of music to be performed before a scrutinizing audience. If you can do that with the pieces Leavitt presents in his method, you'll be FAR, FAR ahead of the herd regarding your ability to use a pick.

For what it's worth: one gripe I have with Leavitt is that he doesn't, to my knowledge, ever stress the importance of staying relaxed when playing with a pick. This was my big mistake during my "first phase" of guitar playing. I had no teacher, and played non-stop, but with my fingers and wrist all tensed up. Needless to say, I got nowhere. Well, I could play smoothly and in time, but with no semblance of speed.

Chris Thile, mandolin "genius" - who has the best pick technique I've ever encountered - says do this: when practicing, esp. scales, arpeggios, exercises -- play a 'game' -- play the stuff and actually play with such a loose grip that you sometimes drop the pick. Just barely hang onto it. You won't get much volume or tone this way, but speed will come quickly. Once you have accuracy and speed, start gripping the pick a little tighter. This gives you more volume. Continue this way until you can play loud and still be very relaxed - and VOILA! (It's working for me!)

kj

Interestingly (or maybe not!), as of this past week, I have made the conscious and deliberate decision to NOT review this book*.

For the past 13 weeks or so, I'd play through each "lesson" each day, and whilst my playing of the earlier material has improved, it has come at the cost of playing actual tunes. I've therefore decided to replace this part of my practice with reviewing tunes I've learned (and forgotten) e.g. tunes from "Classical Studies for Pick Style Guitar", Ingram's "25 Pieces for Plectrum Guitar", also some of the tunes from Noad's "Solo Guitar Playing" seem to transfer well to this style of playing.

*Certain pieces which I find enjoyable have avoided the cull(Waltz in F, First & second solos...).

[thetruewheel]

Kojo27 - thanks so much for mentioning Masters of the Plectrum Guitar! This is exactly what I've been looking for, I'm still working through this book and I really wanted more jazzy solo guitar material (in a similar vein to Leavitt's pieces) to listen to and work on. Also thanks to Rob for recording so many of them, I'm going to be listening all day for inspiration!

- derek

[Kojo27]

Kojo27 - thanks so much for mentioning Masters of the Plectrum Guitar! This is exactly what I've been looking for, I'm still working through this book and I really wanted more jazzy solo guitar material (in a similar vein to Leavitt's pieces) to listen to and work on. Also thanks to Rob for recording so many of them, I'm going to be listening all day for inspiration!

- derek

Hey Derek,

Glad you found yourself a genre to explore! "Plectrum Guitar" seems to be developing a fair gathering of practitioners, wielding their old-timey (or whatever) archtops and finding the joy in playing beautiful set pieces like these.

HERE'S the 'A' Part of Solo in G, from the latter half of Volume 2, A Modern Method for Guitar (Berklee, Leavitt) -- the 'B' part is forthcoming. : ) It's a good "plectrum guitar" piece, though I'm playing it fingerstyle here.

I hope you get years of joy from the big guitar book, Derek.

Peace,
Loren/kj

[michael-m]

Yes! Ingrams book is one I know about but haven't worked from. If you're that advanced, heck, you don't need Leavitt!

kj

Oh yes I do! Just started p.50 of Vol 1, but I'm still very much a novice with regards to reading music. Maybe though I need to be a bit more selective about which parts I use, e.g. Key of Bb? I can't say I'm learning much from this - it's more "drilling" my fingers to go to the frets they're not used to using, effectively I'm simply "memorizing" where to put my fingers as I seem to absorb that quicker than absorbing the B's and E's are flat.

Another thing: be absolutely SURE, Michael, to get yourself a copy of Mel Bay's HUGE book, Masters of the Plectrum Guitar. It presents a lifetime of pick-style jazz/classical pieces that are as good as music gets. I hope you're aware of this book already. I'm urgent because for some reason I'm thinking it might be about to go out of print, which will be a sad day. I could be wrong (hope so) about that, but still get it if you don't have it.

Also, if you enjoy Ingram's book, hear all the tunes played here, PLUS a lot of the Harry Volpe pieces from "Masters of the Plectrum Guitar" -- by the great Rob MacKillop. Read his wisdom in the forum's "Plectrum Guitar" thread, wherever it is now - it's here somewhere; just search.

I agree: Waltz in F is timeless. From Volume 2, check out Solo in G -- especially if you can play it fingerstyle, although it works with a pick, too.

You sound great! Your time is spot-on, and your tone (much overlooked aspect of playing good music, imo) is wonderful.

kj

I am aware of this book, but have avoided so far as I thought it might :
a) be too advanced.
b) distract me from the Leavitt book.

However, I recently stumbled across the name of "Eddy Lang". Love what I've heard of him so far, and there's a few of his pieces in that book (which kind of reinforces my perception that it might be a bit too advanced!). I'll will get a copy though.

[michael-m]

Hey Derek,

Glad you found yourself a genre to explore! "Plectrum Guitar" seems to be developing a fair gathering of practitioners, wielding their old-timey (or whatever) archtops and finding the joy in playing beautiful set pieces like these.

HERE'S the 'A' Part of Solo in G, from the latter half of Volume 2, A Modern Method for Guitar (Berklee, Leavitt) -- the 'B' part is forthcoming. : ) It's a good "plectrum guitar" piece, though I'm playing it fingerstyle here.

I hope you get years of joy from the big guitar book, Derek.

Peace,
Loren/kj

That solo's sounding good. Just another 70 odd pages of Vol 1 to go then I can start on Vol 2... :-)

[Kojo27]

Oh yes I do! Just started p.50 of Vol 1, but I'm still very much a novice with regards to reading music. Maybe though I need to be a bit more selective about which parts I use, e.g. Key of Bb? I can't say I'm learning much from this - it's more "drilling" my fingers to go to the frets they're not used to using, effectively I'm simply "memorizing" where to put my fingers as I seem to absorb that quicker than absorbing the B's and E's are flat.




I am aware of this book, but have avoided so far as I thought it might :
a) be too advanced.
b) distract me from the Leavitt book.

However, I recently stumbled across the name of "Eddy Lang". Love what I've heard of him so far, and there's a few of his pieces in that book (which kind of reinforces my perception that it might be a bit too advanced!). I'll will get a copy though.

The Eddie Lang pieces are tough, yes. Many are in two parts, too. However, the rest of the book (almost) is presented in notation and tablature, so you get to cheat a bit. : ) Rob MacKillop plays the Irish-ish tune, "Mighty Lak a Rose" - and it isn't so hard. Quarter notes and eighth notes, some screwy chord shapes, not too bad.

If it's your reading you're wanting to improve, you're certainly using the right books. If I were you, I'd at least review the "sight-reading" pieces, later in the book, and in the later volumes. It won't hurt, now and then, to review the pieces that came before. If you had been reviewing everything, everyday - wow! That would kill me! I don't think Leavitt intended that much review. If you could "grade" each piece (1-10), according to how much trouble it gives you, and review the harder ones more often, the easier ones less often, changing your "grades" as you grow -- you'll save much time and still master the Method. It really is about reading, and pick technique, imo. I think the rock-solid pick technique comes from playing the same pieces (the etudes) until they're pretty much flawless. I don't mean to preach, man - you do whatever you think's best. I'm just thinking about the rest stroke, which is the single most important thing in Volume One, I think. I hope you have the DVD version of the book and watch it often. Leavitt fails to stress a couple of crucial things, and the rest stroke is one of them. If you want to play Plectrum guitar, or pick-style chord melody, the rest-stroke is essential, I think. (Not that I'm an expert, but I can see it from where I am : )

Finally, not to deluge you with books, but there's a good "supplement" to Leavitt, a new book by Chris Buono (former Berklee teacher) on music reading for guitarists. The stand-by by Oakes. You probably know about these. Read everything you can find (I will try to follow my own advice!)

(I'll post the rest of Solo in G soon.)

Take care - keep playing.

Loren/kj

[znerken]

I'm not really sure I grasp the purpose of these speed studies, even after reading through this thread, and watching the instructional videos. Anyone care to clarify? I like to know why I practice something

[Jazzstdnt]

The ability to navigate scales and simple melodic patterns, ascending and descending, with solid coordination between the hands.

Play as fast as you can - but only with - clear picking sound, clear solid tone, and full control.

If you're pursuing jazz it only gets more complicated from here, so these studies are helpful for developing basic melodic technique in a diatonic setting (a pop/rock player would say "lead guitar skills")

[znerken]

The ability to navigate scales and simple melodic patterns, ascending and descending, with solid coordination between the hands.

Play as fast as you can - but only with - clear picking sound, clear solid tone, and full control.

If you're pursuing jazz it only gets more complicated from here, so these studies are helpful for developing basic melodic technique in a diatonic setting (a pop/rock player would say "lead guitar skills")

So being able to transpose “licks” to different keys, essentially. Also being able to play licks fast, but clear?

[Jazzstdnt]

Well, I'd say that these are scales and scale patterns more than licks.

Are you struggling with the question of why one practices anything beyond repertoire/songs on one's instrument, or is it just these particular studies?

[znerken]

Well, I'd say that these are scales and scale patterns more than licks.

Are you struggling with the question of why one practices anything beyond repertoire/songs on one's instrument, or is it just these particular studies?

Sorry for being unclear. Just this study. The picking etudes, or the exercises focusing on special time signature, or the excersies focusing on note values, they all have clear reason behind them. The reason behind the speed studies I didn’t quite grasp. Is it to learn a pattern you should get into your vocabulary. Is it to focus on playing faster. Is it to learn to transpose a pattern to another scale, by seeing that the pattern goes i.e. r-1-2-r. I am not quite sure, and it wasn’t discussed in the dvd. Also, I’m pretty sure all keys, mean all keys.

[Jazzstdnt]

Page 46 I presume? Patterns 1 and 3 in particular are very useful. You hear them in jazz and classical music all the time, although in shorter durations most of the time.

Practicing them comprehensively (for an octave or more) is important because you need to be able to rip them off from anywhere at any time. Section 1 of the book is devoted to open position playing. In section 2 you'll move on to movable forms which don't employ open strings (at least for scales and arpeggios). You'll want to know patterns 1 and 3 all over the instrument.

[znerken]

Page 46 I presume? Patterns 1 and 3 in particular are very useful. You hear them in jazz and classical music all the time, although in shorter durations most of the time.

Practicing them comprehensively (for an octave or more) is important because you need to be able to rip them off from anywhere at any time. Section 1 of the book is devoted to open position playing. In section 2 you'll move on to movable forms which don't employ open strings (at least for scales and arpeggios). You'll want to know patterns 1 and 3 all over the instrument.

Oh, that makes it even more meaningful. So pattern 1-3 actually adds to your vocabulary of jazz licks. Cool!

[Jazzstdnt]

Yes Pattern 3 is "melodic thirds". Its been a while but my recollection is that Benson got on a melodic interval kick in his solo on El Mar (I think it was thirds, wouldn't swear to it).

I also seem to recall Lenny Breau using melodic thirds quite a bit in one solo, maybe too much. The trick is to sound musical as opposed to mechanical, so using them sparingly is the artful part.

Anyway, gotta run, have a listen if you want to. Solo starts at about 2:19, check it out at about 4:27

[znerken]

Yes Pattern 3 is "melodic thirds". Its been a while but my recollection is that Benson got on a melodic interval kick in his solo on El Mar (I think it was thirds, wouldn't swear to it).

I also seem to recall Lenny Breau using melodic thirds quite a bit in one solo, maybe too much. The trick is to sound musical as opposed to mechanical, so using them sparingly is the artful part.

Anyway, gotta run, have a listen if you want to. Solo starts at about 2:19, check it out at about 4:27

Could it be that the purpose/what Leavitt meant, is that you should remember the pattern relative to the position you are in, so you can be able to move the position on the neck? Just like you do with a scale pattern/position. Just move the up the neck to play the same pattern in another key? Strange that he introduces this concept before we have started on position playing.. Perhaps cause he means we should come back to it.

Funnily enough, it was quite easy to play pattern 1 in F major just by ear, after I had played it in C for a while.

[Jazzstdnt]

I don't know but wouldn't worry about it. The greatest utility will be up the fret board, but sure try it in your other open position scales as you go through them. Sounds like you've got a start already, which is great.