The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
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  1. #1
    We practice, practice and practice. And when the time to record comes, we realize how much more we have to practice to reach the desired result.

    I believe many other players here are trying to be less of a perfectionist regarding recording and performing. Still, they love their playing without getting upset later about the mistakes or imperfections.

    Coping methods are different and depend on each person's personality type.

    For example, as a person who analyzes things in depth, I can delve more and more into what can be improved, removed, or added. The answer is probably counterintuitive, which means thinking less and feeling more.

    What do you think?

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    For me, it's more of a perception problem than anything else... Why do I look worse in a photograph than I do in my mirror? That kind of thing.

    Recording frequently closes the gap of the difference between what I think I sound like vs. what I really sound like on a recording. It's as simple as that, create and record a lot. As the gap closes it becomes easier to accept what I really sound like, warts and all.

  4. #3

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    For me, I've been able to combat perfectionism by being incredibly lazy and apathetic.

  5. #4

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    I just stopped fighting it and consequently I'm perfect.

  6. #5

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    I adopt a Kaizendo approach , which translates to the path of continual improvement.
    Perfection is not a human quality , but the quest for it never ends

  7. #6

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    sometimes i get sent a recording
    of a gig or whatever ....
    I don’t listen !
    works for me
    ——————
    also i don’t go for perfect
    i just want a good groove and play the head right
    make it feel good etc etc

    I ain’t Sevovia

  8. #7

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    I’m not to the point that perfection and my jazz guitar playing can exist in the same paragraph, let alone a sentence. But…I just did.

    I think it’s a common problem for most musicians regardless of genre.

  9. #8

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    Don't make mistakes. If you do, rationalize it. There is always a good excuse.

    Tony

  10. #9

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    one note away from satori...

    it comes..in a flash..and then its gone..I didnt see it..it fades before I can be amazed by it..

    ahh to savor it..invite it for tea..and discuss the nature of time..and hope it will stay longer

    like a tiger that looks at you..you see its majesty its power its beauty..you want to be friends with it but you know you can't capture it ..cage it

    you don't really understand its nature..but some tell you its their lover

    it leaves hints for you..the rose..the river the sun..the universe..and the quality of mystery

  11. #10

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    There is nothing about my personality or behavior that is perfect, despite what my dog might think. Hence, my musical ability is a reflection of the imperfect human being I am. Despite decades of playing and God knows how many hours of practice, I will never be the player that I want to be. I can gracefully accept that, recognizing that for me, my life with the guitar is more about the journey than the destination. As for recordings, I seldom listen to my performances. If I played well, I know it; and if I didn't, I know that as well and need not be reminded of it. If I record with a purpose, that is an entirely different story - one that focuses on self-improvement.

    But like Segovia said in his later life, he continues to practice because there were still certain things he hadn't quite gotten right. I ain't no Segovia but I share that sentiment.

  12. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by pingu
    I ain’t Sevovia
    And neither was Segovia! Sorry, I couldn’t help it.

    Perfectionism is a foreign country.

  13. #12

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    I've been trying to listen to recordings later and post more videos of my playing, even if I m not happy with it in the moment. When I initially finish playing all I can think about is a mistake or something I wish I did. If I make myself post it, and come back in a few days and listen again with fresh ears I usually find that the mistake was nowhere near what I though and can focus on the positives of my playing and what I need to work on going forward

  14. #13

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    I think this following article is interesting and related: The Art of the Mistake

    Walser’s analysis, and Gioia’s concept, also have the side effect of highlighting Miles Davis’s apparent flaws to a degree Davis himself would likely not appreciate. As (music theorist Robert) Walser explains, Davis demonstrated a fairly ambiguous approach to mistakes. When choosing takes after a recording session, Walser writes that Davis “invariably picked the one with the fewest mistakes.”

    However, Davis is also reported to have valued mistakes, saying, “When they make records with all the mistakes in, as well as the rest, then they’ll really make jazz records. If the mistakes aren’t there, too, it ain’t none of you.”

  15. #14

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    Maybe the perfect rendition of the song you are attempting to play is up there with Plato. Maybe it is not something that could exist in the real world. If you tried to imagine it, what would you hear in your mind? If it is something beyond your technical ability, then you might be able to improve your plain to attain it. But if the perfect rendition is beyond your imagination – if your mind presents you with nothing more than a vague sense of wellbeing – then the rendition probably could not be realised.

  16. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
    For me, I've been able to combat perfectionism by being incredibly lazy and apathetic.
    For me, I've been able to combat perfectionism by being redundantly imperfect.

    Joking aside:

    The bar is forever within sight and always out of reach.

    Good news, though. Here is empirical proof that perfection is over-rated:
    All those people who listen to your gig?
    They know and love Miles, Trane, Chick, Herbie, Brecker and {insert name here} just as much as you.
    And they still stuck around to the end of your set.
    You -- me! -- the redundantly-imperfect musician, still had what they needed at least for tonight.

  17. #16

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    I only read the OP, will read else later.

    Most of my appearances for money.. a bare minimum - that means a ton of work

    When recording stuff, it needs tons of tons more work. But it's fun. With capital F.

  18. #17

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    I think I'd be a better player if I were more of a perfectionist.

    I think one of my bandmates might be a better player if he were less of a perfectionist.

    On average, I think it would be better to function on the perfectionistic side of neutral, but not all the way.

  19. #18

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    There is no prefect. There is only expression and your own path. That path will demand work, but will never allow for perfection. At moments it can feel like perfection, but all of a sudden things open up a little more and once again the path creates demands.

    The real question is how to have healthy motivation. I am not sure. The perfection game, is really about motivation. That cycle is damaging to a person’s self esteem. Probably most of what people use to motivate themselves is damaging to thier self esteem.

    I feel like love is the answer, but yet I find that negative things keep me more motivated to do the hard work.

    I also think a lot of the disfunction, and destructive behavior is related to this core issue.

    This is a multifaceted discussion.

  20. #19

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    Perhaps we should try to compile a list of top players who are NOT perfectionists?

    David

  21. #20

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    The way to think about if you play a gig is from the perspective of the mostly musically uneducated and non musican audience you play to.

    Do they notice / care about:
    - mistakes / missed notes?
    - your guitar tone?
    - your playing being probably the same few stolen ideas recycled and re-phrased across the gig?

    NO!

  22. #21

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    Still waiting for that list of top/favoured players who are NOT perfectionists! No takers?

    B.Katt

  23. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackcat
    Still waiting for that list of top/favoured players who are NOT perfectionists! No takers?

    B.Katt
    I imagine very few. Perfectionism can be crippling. Particularly in an artform that improvisation is such a big part of.

    There's a difference between "never being satisfied" and "perfectionist." I imagine most great players are in the first category.

  24. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
    I imagine very few. Perfectionism can be crippling. Particularly in an artform that improvisation is such a big part of.

    There's a difference between "never being satisfied" and "perfectionist." I imagine most great players are in the first category.
    Fine distinction Jeff methinks, but a valid one I am sure. Thanks for that. Exactly what Bill Frisell suggests in his Solos dvd - 'A never ending struggle'.

    David

  25. #24

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    Interestingly as I am getting older an older, becoming less and less perfectionist. My family and friends knows and recognizes me as perfectionist, and did not know my secret shift to became a lazy... I can say it is a relief, sometimes I am even enjoying it. (I am not talking playing guitar, instead work)

  26. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by KingKong
    The way to think about if you play a gig is from the perspective of the mostly musically uneducated and non musican audience you play to.

    Do they notice / care about:
    - mistakes / missed notes?
    - your guitar tone?
    - your playing being probably the same few stolen ideas recycled and re-phrased across the gig?

    NO!
    I assume musically uneducated non-musicians absolutely
    do notice and care about errors, tone, and a lack of ability

    If I thought otherwise, why or how would I enjoy playing for
    them, or playing with others that think like you seem to do?