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Not sure about being high but something strange did happen to me when I was practicing 14 hours a day. My heart was beating fast at the end of the night one day and so I got admitted to a hospital and took a blood test. Apparentedly I had amphetamine in my blood even though I never consumed any drugs or ate anything that day. I may have drank from a water fountain but I don't remember.. so yeah crazy stuff
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02-25-2022 07:26 PM
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If only more musicians, past and present were as wise as Pat Metheny when he was 15; he witnessed players taking substances and playing worse and worse while they thought they were playing better and better. Because of that he has never tasted a drop of alcohol or taken any street drugs.
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Drugs and alcohol are bad for any mind.
Originally Posted by emanresu
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A few years ago I was talking with a piano player. Some players and a critic were also at the table. Somebody asked him about a recording that has been lauded as a classic, iconic, in some circles a 'perfect' performance.
The piano player looked a little vexed. "When was that?" and when told the album and date he was amused. "During that time, we were so high, nobody remembers anything." Asked what he thinks of- thought of the recording, he said "I can't really be proud of it. I don't know what everybody hears, I've done much better since and those seem to have gone unnoticed."
I don't know what this says about playing high, or identifying with what you play, or even whether the concept of a "perfect performance" means anything at all, but it's an amusing story.
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Heard Larry when he was with the Eleventh House. What ever he was on, he was fantastic. (He's consumed for many years now) Originally Posted by jazzkritter
Coryell. Met him backstage at the Red Bank Tal concert (some of you were there))) and the guy was so stoned he could barely stand up, much less talk. He proceded to play a couple of hours in a after concert concert… and jhe was incredible.
Heard many a story about Lenny Breau and Robitussin.
Me? One glass of whatever (or drug equivalent) and i lose all hand brain connection. Dunno if i am lucky or cursed.
Slow forward a few decades and I caught up with him back stage somewhere in western MA. Sloshed and rude. By that time though, maybe my sensibilities had changed but his performance was like a drug itself: put me to sleep.
Some people know to balance their lives and their chemicals. Some just think they do.
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In this situation “Feel normal” Usually means the addict will stop hallucinating, convulsing and vomiting. Originally Posted by BWV
Pretty far from our idea of normal.
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I don't remember who it was who, talking about using drugs off the bandstand said "I don't get high to get buzzed, I do it to try to get the normal I get from playing." Originally Posted by AllanAllen
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Emily Remler was talking about groove (IIRC, in one of her instructional videos) and she said something to the effect that playing music should feel good in the stomach, like physically. Originally Posted by BWV
I remembered stories about opioid addiction - the pleasure people are seeking is sometimes described as a deep happiness centered in the stomach.
And then it occurred to me, that some of the musicians are hooked on this feeling more than everyone else and they try to get it by any means. On one hand it makes them what they are musically, on the other -- it is often tragic.
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sure, just supposing that a daily heroin user could perhaps function better than a methhead or someone who drinks a gallon of vodka every day. Originally Posted by AllanAllen
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Why do you think that guy is drinking a gallon of vodka a day? Originally Posted by BWV
It’s to stop the hallucinations, convulsions and vomiting. There is nothing romantic about addiction.
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what are you referring to? Who is ‘that guy’ and why do you seem to think I am romanticizing opiate addiction? Just saying it’s not inherently worse than addiction to other substances and that many opiate addicts appear to be able to function OK, particularly with access to properly dosed pharmaceuticals - which if you ask me should be the public policy rather than prohibition and criminalization Originally Posted by AllanAllen
Last edited by BWV; 02-26-2022 at 06:32 PM.
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Two guys at a Grateful Dead concert who have not been able to score any weed. Says one to ther other: Geez, this band sucks."
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same thing for much of early 70s Miles like Big Fun? Originally Posted by doc w
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Access to Properly dosed pharmaceuticals? We already have that, it’s called the opioid epidemic. Originally Posted by BWV
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The bottle has ahold on me. Originally Posted by AllanAllen
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and would be far less deaths if they still had access to OxyContin rather than fentanyl supplied by the cartels Originally Posted by AllanAllen
Access to Properly dosed pharmaceuticals? We already have that, it’s called the opioid epidemic.
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I have a strong preference for playing with people who are sober.
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A tenor guy I used to play with went to NYC in mid/late 60's to play jazz. Someone who's name we all know told him that you have to be on junk to play this music. Simple as that. He developed a habit and left NY shortly after that. He survived.
It's just a plain fact that a lot of the recordings we listen to were played by people with substance abuse problems who were totally high at the time.
There's also lots of great players who are sober, and lots that got clean and lived to have a long and fruitful career.
I have a ton of experience performing while high. Practising? Not so much. Drugs should be avoided.
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I enjoy hitting the bottle, getting all hyped up, and playing Hammond. I don't like to do it to the extent that it feels like it's at the expense of my health tho. Also, the majority of my playing/practicing is done sober. Don't care for weed because it feels like a stressful hallucination to me.
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I remember some T-shirt wisdom from the 1980s:
"I don't have a drinking problem. I drink, I get drunk, I fall down. No problem."
"Reality is for people who can't handle drugs."
I have noticed that even having one beer or a glass of wine adversely affects my playing. I think that just to be a mediocre jazz musician I need every brain cell up and running just to keep up with the music. Maybe if I had actual musical talent it would be a different story. Thus I do not even have a beer until after the gig is over, back in my gigging days anyway. I haven't smoked weed or done other drugs since I graduated from college 41 years ago because that was just incompatible with functioning as an adult and making a living. I can't even imagine trying to play a jazz gig stoned or tripping. Back in college I remember using LSD and mushrooms and feeling like I gained something positive from it; some of the benefits of which have been rather long lasting although I'd be hard-pressed to explain them in a way that would make sense to anyone else. But, as Alan Watts once wrote about drug use, "once you get the message, hang up the phone."
While we talk about many of our musical heroes being drunk or high on this or that and playing on famous groundbreaking records, fantastic live recordings, etc., I always wonder if they wouldn't have played even better if they'd been straight at the time.
Jim Hall has mentioned that his drinking was out of control earlier in his life; he quit (and used to go to meetings with Mike Stern, according to the latter). Both of their music seems to have flourished without the use of alcohol or other drugs. And have you ever seen anyone happier to be playing music than Mike Stern? He's got a 100W amp and a 1000W smile. Even battling his hand problems after his injuries, he still lights up the room when he plays. He did not seem to look like that in pictures and videos of him during his using days while playing with Miles (and for which he got fired).
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As several have mentioned already, there is evidence that the state of mind/intoxication that a player is in when learning and practising is the state most conductive to performance. So if you practice sober, play sober.
Here on my amateur level, I think a good deal of drug and alcohol use is self medication for stage fright. Should be dealt with in therapy but people reach for the bottle
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You've nailed it with "self-medication." Unfortunately, the circumstances seemingly requiring medicinal management tend to expand into other ares, like being awake. It's a steep, slippery slope. I have great empathy for those afflicted. I sometimes run short of patience. My weakness. Originally Posted by Average Joe
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For stage fright there is Toastmasters, meditation, self-hypnosis, breathing and visualization techniques, beta blockers (which are also used for doing purposes in golf, pool and a snooker, etc.).
I have some of this- I don't even like my wife listening when I practice and at gigs basically ignore the existence of the audience, otherwise I am too self-conscious to play well. Breathing and grounding techniques help.
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I just think it's sad that many musicians still think you have to be drunk or stoned to play your best. For me? No way! I only played drunk once. It was at a band rehearsal over 30 years ago, where myself, and the other woman in the band showed up a bit drunk, after indulging in too much alcohol, while dining at a local bar & grill before rehearsal. We annoyed the drummer (who was the band leader) to put it mildly. I couldn't stay focused, and as a result spent much of the rehearsal goofing off, making the rehearsal a bust. I also played (in the same band I just mentioned), with a bass player who was a drunk. He drank cheap beer like it was Kool-Ade, and basically hacked his way through the songs (kind of like I did, the few times I played drunk). Ugh!
As for drugs - definitely no. And that also goes for heavy alcohol consumption. Along with the general knowledge that drugs and excess alcohol consumption are bad for you, there is a personal element for me avoiding them. Addictive tendencies are very high in my family. On both sides of my family, alcoholism is rampant. My own father had a drinking problem that almost cost him his marriage (it took him getting cancer to finally stop drinking) - I won't even go into the drunken behavior he exhibited (I had to stop him, when he was loaded one time, from getting physically abusive with my mother), that in one case, angered me so much as a teenager, I didn't speak to him for over 2 months. Drugs? I've seen the results of meth addiction first hand, with my niece. Awful to say the least. She is in rehab, but she has relapsed at least once, and her fragile mental state makes me worry about how well she will stay away from that vile stuff.
A beer or mix drink once in a blue moon? Sure, why not? Heavy amounts? No way!!, and don't even go there with me, when it comes to drugs (I've even gotten into arguments on the phone with a friend of mine who lives in California, when she talks about toking up on some weed she bought from one of the state approved shops, that sells the stuff).Last edited by EllenGtrGrl; 02-28-2022 at 12:00 AM.
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I had a week Catskills gig years ago, doubling with a guy who was a long time Catskills player/singer. Nice fun guy to work with… looked the part, lots of chest hair, shirt open wide, gold chains, in 1992. Anyway he played with a glass of scotch in his hand (or on his amp) the whole time. Bar made sure it was replaced as required. Every gig, every hour, every song. Never missed a beat.
Like I said before, I just could never play altered.
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