Who has NO talent, but plays anyway?

[2bornot2bop]

Isn’t that why most of us are here, to learn how to sound better?

[wintermoon]

Isn’t that why most of us are here, to learn how to sound better?

Not me, I came for the free food and drinks.

[jads57]

Say only Nice Things! Wouldn't that be lovely, no negative or critique!

My question then is why when someone points out the truth, the audience mostly can't handle it?
I'm not making these facts up folks. Any older professional in any job will tell you their personal experiences.

Just cause you decided to play dress up Jazz Guitarist or whatever does not automatically qualify ones credentials or abilities.
It's hard ass work, unless you're a gifted musician to begin with like Pat Metheny or Pat Martino maybe.

And actually making a living at playing music involves a lot more than playing an instrument. It involves a whole lot of sacrifice for most people.
So walking in a musicians or artist's shoes is not for most people.

[Jabberwocky]

I do get a lot of requests but I play on anyway.

[jads57]

Actually music isn't hired, it's entertainment. And there in lies the problem.

[deacon Mark]

I don't have a lot of talent but through working at things I can play a few things for sure. I could not sit in at a club in New York and play a few standards without getting real worried, and I have played for 47 years. I just love jazz and jazz guitar sound. I love archtop guitars and mostly drawn to the acoustic archtop. These days I find my taste in what I like to listen to much different that when I was in college and playing and teaching guitar. Back then I had 30 students a week and practiced hours at a time and had a few gigs for sure.

I never as such played music that was popular like classic rock ( I love it), some good older country music. I mostly just listened to jazz and was trying to figure a way to be a bebop wizard on the guitar. I realized that was not going to happen at least like all my hero's. I still played and enjoy what I can and I got very involved in repairing guitars and guitar construction. I like that as well as playing them in fact. But today I find myself listening more to poetic melodic players like Paul Desmond and Chet Baker. I dig Pat Martino mowing down changes on Lazy Bird and Oleo but after awhile I find going to Kenny Burrell and listening to The Tender Gender, seems at least I listen more. I use to think it all had to be complex and moving all around the fingerboard. Well I have learned 2 things. I not talented as such but I know what sounds good and is done well. Even non talented guitarist can sometime get to that point..........and someone enjoys the music. That is my goal.

[Beaubs]

Beaubs , are you buying drinks or paying these guys to gig with you,LOL !

Ironically, we needed a place to practice and my house was in a very general location - so I cleared the basement, bought a drum set (so the drummer didn't have to lug his kit with him), bought a bass amp (so the bassist didn't have to lug his amp with him), bought a p.a. (so we had a good mix) and asked my wife to serve snacks and wine. I am not 100% sure but this may be the primary reason they put up with my less than stellar guitar abilities.

[GuyBoden]

Talent is not as important as being dedicated to regular playing, in the long term.

[jorgemg1984]

Talent is not as important as being dedicated to regular playing, in the long term.

I didn't read the whole thread but I have to say I've not found this to always be true. It's true some people have a lot of talent and waste it, but in the long term it's very hard to fight lack of talent. I know people like to hear that you can make it if you give it all, but I've not found that to be true in music. And having talent just makes it a lot easier to work hard, because you get a lot more progress with a lot less effort (this one I know buy observing others than myself, unfortunately).

[Phil59]

I think these are the two most true statements on this thread.

The word talent just means a natural aptitude or skill. It doesn't necessarily mean high-level aptitude. Someone with a very high-level aptitude will obviously become more famous or successful than those with only mediocre aptitudes but that's to be expected.

Everybody here has a talent for music otherwise we wouldn't be here. We wouldn't be playing the guitar at all if we had no aptitude for it; it would be senseless. And it's highly likely that music isn't our only talent. Nearly all of us can do other things too.

Talent is not as important as being dedicated to regular playing, in the long term.

[princeplanet]

Sure, lots of practice and hard work narrows the gap, but a player with natural talent, who also does the work, will always have an "edge". I know some will disagree, but for me this is personified when I hear someone like Joe Pass as having possessed a relatively unexceptional talent but with a monster work ethic, as opposed to exceptionally gifted players like Wes or Benson - who also put in the work. There's always that 'X' factor you can't practice...

[Kirk Garrett]

I realize I may sound immodest, like a total douchebag, but…unlike most of you, I admit I’m gifted, genetically inclined, “talented”, whatever you want to call it, at wandering in circles, flitting from one interest to another, and accomplishing basically nothing. It just comes naturally to me.

[Mick-7]

Mr. Beaumont's signature quote may be the most fitting reply to this thread:

“I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don’t let anybody tell you different.” - Kurt Vonnegut

I suppose some of us have more talent at that than others, e.g., the last poster may be an unacclaimed FA genius.

[voxo]

great posts..my only concern is what am i going to play when i get up..mostly tabs with notation added for achievment....today Basies Bag..after watching George at Newport..

[hotpepper01]

I do. My guitars are way better than my playing deserves. When I was young I could only afford to spend 150 NLG (appr 150 USD) on both a guitar and an amp. Of course I ended up with crappy stuff. Against the advise given to me, I bought a worse guitar and a worse amp instead of a reasonable guitar and a lousy amp. ( I was 16 at that time).
Now, more than 50 years later, I can afford a couple of 10K guitars that are way better than me. I have a couple of L5s and they do make me feel great if I am playing one of them. If I play such a good guitar, I get a big smile on my face, that only is worth spending the money on a nice guitar like that, than having it on my bank account.

[pingu]

1326511[/URL]]I realize I may sound immodest, like a total douchebag, but…unlike most of you, I admit I’m gifted, genetically inclined, “talented”, whatever you want to call it, at wandering in circles, flitting from one interest to another, and accomplishing basically nothing. It just comes naturally to me.

wandering in cycles mmmmm
a kind of jazz ?

[Kirk Garrett]

wandering in cycles mmmmm
a kind of jazz ?

I like this. It’s even true lately. I’ll fully credit myself if I can continue to stick to the cycles (learning and playing standards/jazz songs) daily for a full year instead of cycling off into other pursuits.

[JGinNJ]

Playing jazz, on a guitar or other instrument is a funny thing even as a hobby.
Most of us here do something else for primary income. But Do you think, "I suck at being an (doctor, lawyer, Indian chief), I should just quit"?
Likewise for other recreations- "I'm not the faster runner/bicyclist, I guess I have no talent, I quit"

I never quit guitar for those reasons, but I have put away my trumpet for months at a time, so I get it. The inner critic is merciless, and irrational.

[Kirk Garrett]

^ It’s hard because I have a couple other things I love, like visual art, where I also have no talent.

The good news about music is that I am able to pursue it if I stay very focused in those little 10 and 15 minute increments I get here and there throughout the day. This doesn’t work very well for other pursuits. So with my life the way it currently is, the blessing is that my lack of time kind of makes the choice for me.

[mickmac]

I have been told many times that Ihave no talent and my technique is terrible.. First time was 1961. Since then I have made a semi respectable living playing at the guitar.If I quit, I would starve. mickmac..

[Jazz4Four]

This is an interesting thread. Somebody mentioned athletes earlier, and it’s an interesting comparison in that most amateur athletes, even very good ones, aren’t under the impression that they’re going pro. Why is it different with music? The greats got that way with natural talent + hard work. I get the feeling that a lot of people here are attempting to emulate Wes, or Pat Martino, Benson, Metheny, etc… That’s an awfully high bar unless you possess a ton of natural ability to begin with, and are willing to dedicate your life to music (no doubt those guys did, on both counts).


Talent is easy to admire, such as in the case of rlrhett’s friend. Hard work can be respected, however. When I was dabbling with guitar—which was most of the past 30 years—I thought that if/when I worked harder at it that it would come easier. Then when I started working harder at it, I realized, “holy crap, it is difficult to play well.” In that sense, I admire the solid, non-famous player who makes a living at music, and perhaps didn’t have the benefit of gobs of natural talent.


And, finally, what is talent? I’d say it’s the innate ability to pick things up quickly and make improvements quickly. Everyone is somewhere on the spectrum of this, and has strengths/weaknesses in the various subcategories of musical ability. An interesting statement I heard many years ago is that even the greats have a ceiling—it’s just difficult to see b/c their ceilings are so high.

[emanresu]

A human person is a 100-number lottery. Maybe 1000.
But not mathematical numbers. Biochemical-neuroelectrical-emotional ones. Mostly emotional.

[deacon Mark]

One thing about talent is that the guitar is much like athletic ability, because it requires certain physical movements. Some players are naturally faster and all the work in the world will not get you to their level. Playing Donna Lee at 300 bpm ( i cannot) takes work and natural talent. One cannot simply spend hours at it and get to others level. Just like you could not practice sprinting the 100-meter dash all the time and you will never touch Usain Bolt. He could even stop training and beat you.

It takes a certain amount of some kind of talent just to stay the course and keep at the guitar. The guitar looks at me everyday saying.......I better play some or what little I have is going to be going downhill. If George Benson stopped playing the guitar period even for years. I think in about a few days he would be smoking most anyone playing again. I am not putting down hard work or those that have great talent don't work hard, just realize some things come easier for some folks.

[emanresu]

The faster you can play, the less talent you need to have.

[Jimmy Smith]

My up sides are I have organized thinking and then I have abstract thinking/feels/emotion. My disadvantages are my facility kind of sux and I don't have raw artistic creativity. I don't think I'm super loaded with talent. I'm tryin tho. At least I have a bit.