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  1. #1

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    Hi all,

    a proposal with the aim of more clarity ....

    could we all write bar lines as |

    and save the symbol / for slash chords eg G/A etc

    For example .....

    |A-7 D7 | Gm7 C7 | Fmaj7/A | Bb/C |

    Seems clearer to me ....
    what do we think of that ?

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    I do that so obviously I think so haha

  4. #3

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    And while we're at at...

    + means augmented. the FIFTH. THE FIFTH IS RAISED. Stop with this Cmaj7+11 or E7+9 GARBAGE.

    And don't get me started on people who use "M" for major and "m" for minor.
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  5. #4

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    If only there was a clear standard. Only a dream.

  6. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by mr. beaumont View Post
    And while we're at at...

    + means augmented. the FIFTH. THE FIFTH IS RAISED. Stop with this Cmaj7+11 or E7+9 GARBAGE.

    And don't get me started on people who use "M" for major and "m" for minor.
    Kill them

  7. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by mr. beaumont View Post
    And while we're at at...

    + means augmented. the FIFTH. THE FIFTH IS RAISED. Stop with this Cmaj7+11 or E7+9 GARBAGE.

    And don't get me started on people who use "M" for major and "m" for minor.
    yeah, I don't pay much mind to extension symbols, but I would have read that as Cmaj7 with a raised 5th and a natural 11th and E7 with a raised 5th and natural 9.

    the M and m is used in classical theory, not saying that makes it anymore clear though
    White belt
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  8. #7

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    people who play that nasty jazz music with those nasty jazz cords should be loked up and thro away the key just sayin.

  9. #8

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    How about using " - " for minor. Big band charts are all over the place, many times I have to study the whole chart just to find out how a minor is noted.

    In a feeble defense of "M" for major and "m" for minor. It was taught in theory class to describe intervals the minor had to have a line over the m or it was marked wrong. Using it for chords just adds to the confusion.

    I like the interval "diminished second".

  10. #9

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    So, yous guys still aspire to understand all this stuff?

    Wow.

  11. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by rabbit View Post
    So, yous guys still aspire to understand all this stuff?

    Wow.
    have to love the cool-guy responses
    White belt
    My Youtube

  12. #11

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    While we at it, no #11 on dom 7th chords- it's b5 for God's sake! On the guitar, anyway. You think anyone is going to play #11 and natural 5th at the same time on the guitar??

    So like C7b5, not C7#11, pls.

  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hep To The Jive View Post
    While we at it, no #11 on dom 7th chords- it's b5 for God's sake! On the guitar, anyway. You think anyone is going to play #11 and natural 5th at the same time on the guitar??

    So like C7b5, not C7#11, pls.
    I don't mind that as much, because it kinda gives me a better idea as to what the person who wrote the chart is hearing function wise/what notes are acceptable against it...at least in a modern style non-functional harmony type of situation...not Take the A Train

    Assuming they use it correctly, which is a whole 'nuther can of worms.
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  14. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Hep To The Jive View Post
    While we at it, no #11 on dom 7th chords- it's b5 for God's sake! On the guitar, anyway. You think anyone is going to play #11 and natural 5th at the same time on the guitar??

    So like C7b5, not C7#11, pls.
    sorry got to dissagree with you ...
    if it's the common Lydian Dominant type sound
    (from Fmelodic minor)

    anyway what do you think of | for bar lines ?
    and / saved for slash chords ?

  15. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by mr. beaumont View Post
    And while we're at at...

    + means augmented. the FIFTH. THE FIFTH IS RAISED. Stop with this Cmaj7+11 or E7+9 GARBAGE.
    agree that ...

  16. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by pingu View Post

    anyway what do you think of | for bar lines ?
    And / saved for slash chords ?
    absolutely yes.
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  17. #16

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    There is no ascii code for triangle

  18. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hep To The Jive View Post
    While we at it, no #11 on dom 7th chords- it's b5 for God's sake! On the guitar, anyway. You think anyone is going to play #11 and natural 5th at the same time on the guitar??

    So like C7b5, not C7#11, pls.
    As mentioned, cool lydian dominant sound:

    C7#11: x35352
    or
    8x8.11.8.12
    Build bridges, not walls.

  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by pingu View Post
    anyway what do you think of | for bar lines ?
    and / saved for slash chords ?
    Talk about dry humor.

  20. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by pingu View Post
    Hi all,

    a proposal with the aim of more clarity ....

    could we all write bar lines as |

    and save the symbol / for slash chords eg G/A etc

    For example .....

    |A-7 D7 | Gm7 C7 | Fmaj7/A | Bb/C |

    Seems clearer to me ....
    what do we think of that ?
    What polychords, like B triad over C triad? I write it B|C. Context (or spacing) should tell you that is not a bar line.
    Build bridges, not walls.

  21. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by emanresu View Post
    There is no ascii code for triangle
    Why won't this work when posted - screen shot shows the preview...(turns into ??? when posted)
    Attached Images Attached Images Signs and Symbols ??-triangles-png 

  22. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by BigDaddyLoveHandles View Post
    What polychords, like B triad over C triad? I write it B|C. Context (or spacing) should tell you that is not a bar line.
    Still seem ambiguous to me ....
    why not just use B/C ?

    could you write an example please ?

  23. #22

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    ? ?
    copied/pasted from
    Unicode characters table

    Yep, the preview showed correctly but the forum font doesn't have that character.
    edit:C?
    Last edited by emanresu; 11-20-2019 at 01:25 PM.

  24. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by pingu View Post
    Still seem ambiguous to me ....
    why not just use B/C ?

    could you write an example please ?
    B

    B/C (slash) means a B triad over a bass C note. Polychord B|C means a B triad over a C triad.

    B/C: x3x422
    B|C: 332442 (G C E ... B D# F#)
    Build bridges, not walls.

  25. #24

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    I see no mention yet of the Roman numerals where for instance you have IV as the major four chord, and you might want to indicate D/A# to mean D major over A# in the bass.

    Does the note under the slash take its Roman numeral from the key or from the chord above the slash, and do those numbers abide by the diatonic note letter names of the key signature?

    Is it IV/bIII (where the bIII is with reference to the root of the key chord I (G))

    or IV/bVII (where the bVII is with reference to the root of the IV)

    and should whichever is the correct numeral be changed and accidental(s) adjusted if the context is key of G (sharp key) to IV/#II or IV/#VI?
    "Bent my ear to hear the tune and closed my eyes to see."

  26. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by pingu View Post
    could we all write bar lines as |
    So...where do I find this character on my word processor?

  27. #26

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    Usually it's just above the Enter key, to the right of the }] key.

  28. #27

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    \\\\\\\\\\......reverse slash?? Maybe it's an Apple thing? Pingu? Can't use what you ain't got.

  29. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by cosmic gumbo View Post
    \\\\\\\\\\......reverse slash?? Maybe it's an Apple thing? Pingu? Can't use what you ain't got.
    Signs and Symbols ??-image-jpeg

    Thats a Windows keyboard above ...
    what system is your 'word processor' on Cosmic ?

  30. #29

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    Windows....yup, now I see it above the enter key like sgosnell said, except mine has an odd character printed on the key, looks like a colon with 2 lines instead of dots. Oh well, it works, thanks all for the help. |||||||||||||||

    Last edited by cosmic gumbo; 11-19-2019 at 07:50 AM.

  31. #30
    Under the backspace button

  32. #31

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    My forward slash is under the question mark, to the right of the > and to the left of the pause bar. That's to say, it's between the two, at the bottom right of the keyboard, to the left of the...

    Oh, forget it, it's around somewhere

  33. #32

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    [QUOTE=cosmic gumbo;989913]Windows....yup, now I see it above the enter key like sgosnell said, except mine has an odd character printed on the key, looks like a colon with 2 lines instead of dots. Oh well, it works, thanks all for the help. |||||||||||||||

    [/QUOTE

    For fans of ASCII, that's ASCII 124, the "vbar". Sometimes rendered with a gap, sometimes not
    Build bridges, not walls.

  34. #33

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    But we still can't get a triangle. I found one online and it still came out as a ?

    But I did find a ø, which was great.
    Last edited by ragman1; 11-20-2019 at 11:01 AM.

  35. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1 View Post
    But we still can't get a triangle. I found one online and it still came out as a ?

    But I did fine a ø, which was great.
    I

    I think this website, in particular, has a filter that removes unusual characters, for security reasons, perhaps.
    Build bridges, not walls.

  36. #35

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    STOP!

    I'VE SOLVED IT! TELL EVERYBODY!

    It's not an ASCI code, it's a Hex code.

    So now we can write C△

    But it'll cost ya to get it hahahaha!

  37. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1 View Post
    STOP!

    I'VE SOLVED IT! TELL EVERYBODY!

    It's not an ASCI code, it's a Hex code.

    So now we can write C?

    But it'll cost ya to get it hahahaha!
    Unicode # 9651 ; -- that's cheating!
    Build bridges, not walls.

  38. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1 View Post

    So now we can write C?
    So is that CMaj7 or a C triad?

  39. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by pcjazz View Post
    So is that CMaj7 or a C triad?
    C "triangle" is CMaj7.
    C is C triad, no?
    Build bridges, not walls.

  40. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigDaddyLoveHandles View Post
    Unicode # 9651 ; -- that's cheating!
    That's not it. Did you get a triangle with # 9651?

    Oh, the power, the power

  41. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by pcjazz View Post
    So is that CMaj7 or a C triad?
    C△ is CM7.

    C by itself is just a C major chord. You can play it how you like.

  42. #41

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    Test... #9651;

    Bah! I can't get it to work. I noticed that the triangle, when the post was quoted, turned into a ?, so there are still issues.
    Build bridges, not walls.

  43. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1 View Post
    C? is CM7.

    C by itself is just a C major chord. You can play it how you like.
    test again -- see the triangle is now a "?" -- I didn't touch it.
    Build bridges, not walls.

  44. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1 View Post
    ............

    But I did find a ø, which was great.

    How'd you do that?

  45. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1 View Post
    C? is CM7.

    C by itself is just a C major chord. You can play it how you like.
    Not in my charts you can’t boyo

    I write a triad I mean a triad.

  46. #45

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    When I write G&/@14

    I obviously mean Gm9

  47. #46

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    The proper fonts to display the characters has to be installed on the device, and on the online software. This forum's software can't display the characters discussed, and probably many users' computers can't either. Just because a character exists doesn't mean it can be displayed. Consider all the non-Roman alphabets in existence - none of them can be displayed without the proper fonts being installed, and Windows doesn't come with many by default. You have to install anything other than English manually.

  48. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgosnell View Post
    The proper fonts to display the characters has to be installed on the device, and on the online software. This forum's software can't display the characters discussed, and probably many users' computers can't either. Just because a character exists doesn't mean it can be displayed. Consider all the non-Roman alphabets in existence - none of them can be displayed without the proper fonts being installed, and Windows doesn't come with many by default. You have to install anything other than English manually.
    I can see the triangle in reply #40, but it disappeared when I quoted 40 in reply #42. This tells me the forum software is a little buggy wrt that roundtrip.
    Build bridges, not walls.

  49. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigDaddyLoveHandles View Post
    I can see the triangle in reply #40, but it disappeared when I quoted 40 in reply #42. This tells me the forum software is a little buggy wrt that roundtrip.
    The first time I used the hex code and it displayed the triangle. When you copied it, the symbol, not the code, wasn't recognised.

    Let's try it. This is the hex code:

    ?

    That should display as a triangle. I pressed Preview and It does. I'm writing this in Preview. Now if I actually Submit the post it probably won't recognise it.
    Last edited by ragman1; 11-20-2019 at 09:26 PM.

  50. #49

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    It didn't. So, in the absence of the right software, the hex code has to be entered directly first time - like this:



    Voila.

    The hex code is

    &#96x51;

    (Remove the x)

    That's:

    ampersand, hash, 9, 6, 5, 1, semi-colon.

    See how nice I am to you?

  51. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by A. Kingstone View Post
    How'd you do that?
    The Ø sign is in Character Map (part of Windows) under Times New Roman. You'll see it.