The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
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  1. #1

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    I picked up this book at random while in a book store on vacation. I didn't recognize Kenny Werner at first, I have seen him on youtube though. I must say I was blown away at how powerful this book is and how hard it hit me. I've been studying meditation, buddhism and the science of flow states etc for about a year, which I think really helped set up a good platform to absorb this book. To have someone come along and really lay out such deep rooted problem and frustrations blew my mind.

    I have been enjoying music and studying more than I have in the last 7-8 years. It feels like the first few years of playing all over again. I would recommend this book to anyone who takes music seriously at all.

    I'd love to hear about thoughts or input from anyone else who has read this book and how it was for them

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    I have found the book very interesting. (Also recommended: Victor Wooten's The Music Lesson).

    What I like about Werner is the idea of going deeply into one thing until you get it, not skipping around. And I found that after I listened to one of his meditations I practiced well that day.

    However, one thing I'm skeptical about. This is to paraphrase: you are supposed to practice in a meditative state. You don't try; you just watch your fingers play the music for you.

    This is the opposite of the other "how to practice" advice I've read. To me the idea is, you have to focus very intently on what you're doing, and slowly teach your fingers to do the right things. It's only after you've done this for a long time, that you get to step back and just "let it happen".

  4. #3

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    I think the idea being that you have to practice being in that state That is, you can't expect "for the magic to happen" just because you now have an audience. You play what you practice, therefore you must practice making music in that state. Not saying it's easy, or that I can do it, but I think that's what Kenny is implying.

  5. #4

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    Yeah and I think that medative state is more in termsof performance. As in you dont think while you play...you just play

  6. #5
    Thanks for the replies everyone.

    In terms of practicing in a meditative state, Kenny does say in his clinics that practice time is the act of absorbing new information and actually thinking about what you're doing, in a focused way. Absorbing things in small pieces until they are mastered. It would be of great benefit to be in a meditative state while doing this. All he means by meditative state is the lack of thinking about useless and distracting things at the moment. Most people have minds that run rampant with thoughts and worries, and find it difficult for the mind to be quiet. I like the distinction between practicing and playing, playing being just playing what you know and letting it fly out.

    I've had a daily meditation practice going for just over a year now. I just sit in silence for an 30-45mins 2x a day. It has improved my playing, learning, listening abilityand quality of life to a great degree. The brain does extremely well with some quiet each day.

    This always made me feel that learning jazz was a lot like learning zen. Zen masters are confusing when you read them. If you've ever read anything by Linji, Mumon or Huangpo it can be really confusing. The students keep asking questions and the masters keep answering in ways that leave you perplexed beyond belief. This is what listening to teachers like Joe Pass, or Benson, Metheny, or even Reg was like for me when first learning jazz. It sounded like they were trying to transmit something that was beyond conceptual reasoning. The teacher gives you gold but the student keeps asking more and more questions that miss the mark.

    "The art of learning" by Josh Waitkzin is also a book I would recommend checking out. He was a chess prodigy and went on to give up chess and pursue martial arts, but he found that he excelled at martial arts extremely fast by using the learning philosophy he adopted from learning chess. The biggest piece of advice I took from the book is something he calls "making smaller circles". It's the same thing Kenny Werner is talking about. Taking something small and mastering it to the degree of mastery where no thought is needed.

  7. #6

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    Great interview with josh here, highly recommend Tim Ferriss podcast



    Also check out "the one thing" by Gary Keller a great book on getting granular.

    Last edited by 55bar; 02-18-2016 at 04:09 AM.

  8. #7

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    I always mention Mihaly Csikszentmihaly's book on creative "FLOW" when talking about Werner.

    There's some leg work that needs to be done before one can get to this pace, but eventually, if the task is right, the action itself can get you there. Really cool stuff, and I've experienced it (more with painting, but with guitar as well)

  9. #8

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    I like Kenny's teachings. There are some people who would get a lot from his stuff, and I particularly enjoyed his video on jazzheaven.com, which I would highly recommend.

    Effortless Mastery, IMO, is useful for someone who does lots of practice but feels hemmed in by it all. I have felt this way in the past.

    (I have heard other musicians describe it as 'Effortless Mediocrity' though, not sure if it's right for everyone.)

  10. #9
    Thanks mr.beaumont ill check that book out

    The science that is emerging with flow states and the default network mode is very interesting stuff.

    Hey Christian 77,
    Thanks for the recommendation for kenny's jazz haven video. I have lage lund's and enjoyed it quite a bit

    I think youre right that effortless mastery is good for people who feel hemmed in by practicing. I felt very overwhelmed and pressured over the years to study and study, which got in the way of playing and the enjoyment of music. It makes sense that we call it playing, ie fun. Not working the instrument. It also seems like a good plan to make sure your playing/practicing with a healthy mindset before you even start. I can imagine a lot of people at music schools could benefit from Kenny's teachings.

    As far as people claiming "effortless mediocrity", I think youre right again, the book might just not be for them. If you had gave this book to me five years ago it would have ended up in the trash. I wouldnt have been able to relate to the material. It seems natural for peple to pressure themselves more and more to produce results, for somene who has never experienced this it can be hard to understand what it's like. The spirtual jargon would hav turned me off as well.

    Float tanks/sensory deprivation tanks are another interesting device/way to help us as musicians. I read a short brief of a study that had 15ish jazz musicians go in a float tank for 90 mins once a week for a month. After the 4 weeks they all (I believe it was all of them) claimed far more technical and creative proficiency.

  11. #10

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    this kind of stuff fascinates me to no end..the amount of self discipline required to learn your craft (the arts-ANY art) is never ending..and at a certain point should be considered and experienced as a reward and an opportunity to learn something new..about music and more important..about ourselves..

    I love puzzles..one of my fave is the "whats wrong with this picture" ok..at first glance it may seem nothing at all..but to really see whats wrong..we need to "slow down" focus and concentrate on ALL the details of each part of the picture..breath slowly but deeply..listen to our inner voice..really "see" each detail in the picture...Ahhh..there are two 7's on the wall clock..Ahh..the coffee table has only three legs...the cat has only one ear..the doorknob is missing..the table lamp is ON but its unplugged..and so on...

    in meditation it is much like that..as you slow down you begin to see "whats wrong" AND what is right..and at a certain point of "practice" the difference is less and less and you stop being the judge..now your just an observer..but your still aware of yourself being an observer..and go a bit deeper and that awareness has some "gaps" in it where you were not aware..ok..where did "I" go???..from this point on it gets "real" interesting...and you may try to recapture that feeling..insight again and again..but now you realize that your not an observer any longer your now a "seeker" .. looking for ways to solve the puzzle of "where did I go"..and then we ask seeker questions..wait..where did this I come from..whats an inner voice..and who tells it what to say..and who is hearing it..is it the same being or two different beings..ahh..see..interesting eh...

    so we have discovered the chromatic scale..12 tones...they make up all of western music experience..and if that's all there is..how can we play a "wrong" note..is this a "whats wrong with this picture" puzzle..lets see..lets take a major pentatonic scale..with notes 1 2 3 5 6..and create some four note cells...1365..ok how many different ways can we play these four notes..four you say..really..you sure about that..and suddenly you notice the cat has only one ear...

  12. #11

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    Anyone spent time with this book? I hear about it a lot elsewhere but not much on this forum. It focuses on getting out of your own way.

    It's very much not my style, but I think that might be a good thing.

    The meditations are a little cheesy, but once I actually gave it a try, it does seem to make me feel more at ease and better overall. Of course, I might achieve the same benefit from just sitting still and taking deep breaths for 15 minutes.

    As much as it goes against my nature, I know deep down that things like meditation and even yoga would benefit me. I have a lot of tension/stress/anxiety issues.

    So I guess from either the playing side or the health side, I would be interested in hearing other members' experiences.

  13. #12

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    There comes a time where meditation will be just practical and with no baggage of any crazy cuckoo crap.
    But pills are more lucrative. So it might take a bit.

  14. #13

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    I don't doubt this. If you have any other experiences with meditation that you'd be willing to share, I'd be interested. I'm willing to look a little cuckoo if it makes me feel better and maybe lowers my blood pressure a bit.

  15. #14

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    All I've done is to meditate for 20 minutes before work. When it goes well, that time it feels like being inside a fluffy white cloud. Later I do 2-3 minute more when in need of a reset.
    That's all. It's so helpful in stressful periods. Night and day difference.

  16. #15

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    That sounds like something I could get into. Do you use any specific 'method'.

    I don't know much about this stuff. I've just done the first 2 that come with the book so far. I'm assuming there are similar things that aren't music specific.

    Or do you just sit and breath and try to clear your head?

  17. #16

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    My parents took me to a cult-meditation thing when I was 14. They gave me a "mantra". I bet any old word wold do.
    But there is not much to it. Just relax, attention to the word or the breathing and wait for the fuzzy feeling. Then keep it for a while.
    I really can't say anything else. Never even cared to look for more. Works like that enough for me.

  18. #17

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    I read a bit of it a number of years ago and had a decently positive impression. It´s not a bad idea at all to discuss the inner-goings on of a musician. One thing that stuck with me that you shouldn't base your self-worth on music, your latest gig, solo etc. There's also a book called The Inner Game of Music that's apparently a bit similar.

  19. #18

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    The guy that wrote it did a clinic with our college jazz ensemble, trying to peddle his books to us.
    He went over the book with us. I said, "no thanks".

  20. #19

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    A few years back at a bluegrass camp, I took an elective workshop on performance anxiety presented by Jeff Scroggins, a truly amazing and gifted banjo player and bandleader. He began the class by sharing his personal struggle with stage fright and performance anxiety. He had entered the competition at Winfield years earlier as a way to help gain exposure and boost his nascent career, but prior to his appearance he was so overwhelmed by anxiety that he became physically ill. Luckily he regained his composure and had a successful performance, but he realized that if he was to have a productive career as a performing musician (that he would be able to enjoy) he would need to overcome his stage fright. He discovered Effortless Mastery and used the meditation techniques within it to gain that control. He was one of the most humble, sincere and encouraging lecturers I’ve had the pleasure of meeting and hearing. I bought the book on his recommendation and found it to be quite insightful. I would recommend it to anyone struggling with anxiety or stage fright.

  21. #20

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    I feel like I've given it a fair shot a couple times over the years, and it hasn't seem right for me. I have a couple friends that claim his book was transformative. I would point out there is another older thread dealing with this that have a few links folks might be interested in. The book's been around a long time and is much discussed on jazz blogs.

  22. #21

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    Kenny is a mofo who plays with the best, it sure helps with the credibility of his concepts.


  23. #22

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    I put this book in the category of works that deal with flow states, mediation and so on. I don’t think there’s anything in here which is original or unusual to those who are familiar with the topic, but what is unusual is the focus towards musicians.

    One of the most useful concepts I got from this book (at least I think it was this one) is - separate playing and practice. The former should take place in an state of meditation the latter should take place in a state of conscious awareness.

    the more I lean into this idea, the more enjoyable I find music.

    Yoga is also good.

  24. #23

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    I haven't read the book.

    I won't argue or dismiss anyone who finds something that they feel improves their quality of life or a specific aspect of it in some way. We can all use all the help we can get. But I'm also prone to questioning my own beliefs and so I've had a quick look into 'Effortless Mastery'.
    Something that's described as 'effortless' but takes nearly 200 pages to impart? I'll volley that back with the explanation (among a few possibles) which is that publishing is the same as many fields, in that you need to play the game or you won't even get the time or day from a consumer, so, 'effortless' is a mild term compared to 'hack' or the horrific 'one weird trick'.
    The other thing is that even if it's indeed truly effortless I probably wouldn't find it so; I guess we're all built and equipped differently.

    For what it's worth I've found a combo of working out, Stoicism, writing a diary every day (going back decades now) and every morning about five minutes spent on this balance/proprioception exercise works -


    - and even if confirmation bias is fooling me to some extent, like I said, we can all use any help that we can get.

  25. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by emanresu
    My parents took me to a cult-meditation thing when I was 14. They gave me a "mantra". I bet any old word wold do.
    But there is not much to it. Just relax, attention to the word or the breathing and wait for the fuzzy feeling. Then keep it for a while.
    I really can't say anything else. Never even cared to look for more. Works like that enough for me.
    That sounds like transcendental meditation. They charge around a 1000USD for the information you just gave. I hope they won't unleash their expensive lawyers on you

  26. #25

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    I think we are finding out that some minds are so susceptible to anxiety and stress. For whatever, these folks need to do something to relieve the pain.

    Maybe meditation is a way to reduce or eliminate it for a while.

    When I was bedridden and recovering from a surgery, for the first time, I felt stress that my coping skills could not fully handle (and I have been in war zones).

    I am in a much better state now, but I do recognize that the day may come where I will be in bad health again. I am considering learning to meditate as a way to prepare for future trying times. Maybe yoga, as someone mentioned. I am going to have to do something to make my coping skills stronger - something besides drugs (legal or illegal) - in preparation for that day.