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  1. #501
    Quote Originally Posted by pauln
    Why isn't Jazz popular? Wanting to perform Jazz, maybe that is not the relevant question.

    Our trio performs standards, Swing to Bop, Blues, Bossa, Latin, and our originals in those forms. It takes more effort and footwork deliberately finding, continuing to collect, and cultivating our audiences, pockets of Jazz popularity.

    The right questions to us are, who are the people for which the Jazz we play has always been popular, the people who expect and like this great old Jazz? Where do these people gather who despise loud noise bands and just want to expensively drink and dine in conversation while enjoying our trio play their favorite timeless Jazz tunes?
    Yep, that's the quest! Carry on...

  2.  

    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #502
    Quote Originally Posted by PDeville
    Yes, that statement about dancing to music is accurate, However, the other reason is melody.
    Why do people love singers, even bad pop singers? It's the familiar human voice. The melody is easy to hear.
    Most all those standards from 1920-60s have nice pretty melodies to accent the Broadway
    performances and to provide a few orchestrated melody notes for opening a scene in a Hollywood film.
    People who were not musicians would hum those "standard" melodies after seeing the films several times. (I saw this as
    a kid with my father and his friends).

    But honestly, but very few people want to hear a sax blaring 8th notes at 300 bpm over the Donna Lee changes.
    That was a novel, radical style of playing in the late 1940s that was already getting tiresome by 1960 (or before).

    If you enjoy more complex music, then you probably play an instrument and find the complexity interesting and also some sort of technical challenge.

    But most people find it simply annoying, and I don't blame them.
    They don't know about complex chords changes and don't want to know. Why should they?
    A standard melody may have 30 notes. Now, you want them to hear 1000 improvised notes played at 300 bpm and "appreciate" it? Oh, and play 8 choruses of solos as well. People love that. NOT.
    It's TEDIOUS NOISE to probably 99.8% of the human population.

    I always loved this: "Is this still the same song?" Haha!!!
    Jazz doesn't need to be popular.
    Great observations. I can't disagree with any of it.

    If only people would reward basic sports ability, I, too, could be in the NBA.

    We don't reward excellence because we cannot recognize it. Except in sports. Meritocracy & objectivity rule the day.

    Most people can't understand Shakespeare or Einstein. Jazz is the equivalent.

    That said, I'm a sucker for a great melody. I'm a sax player, and my ilk is generally guilty of "way too many notes."

    I subscribe to the Dizzy Gillespie vibe:

    "It's taken me my whole life to learn what notes NOT to play."

  4. #503
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidKOS
    There does seem to have been a big influence of aerobics, jazzercise, martial arts, break dance, etc. that went into the hip-hop genre of dance.
    Sure, nothing evolves in a vacuum. This is true for jazz as well, but its still a distinctly different genre from say the blues. My point was dance is a central focus of rap/hip hop. Its is own style where professional dancers can have their entire career in that space alone. So I don't think its accurate to say rap/hip hop isnt dance music.

  5. #504
    Quote Originally Posted by Troubadour_1991
    Sure, nothing evolves in a vacuum. This is true for jazz as well, but its still a distinctly different genre from say the blues. My point was dance is a central focus of rap/hip hop. Its is own style where professional dancers can have their entire career in that space alone. So I don't think its accurate to say rap/hip hop isnt dance music.
    Well, semantics aside, it isn't dance music in the sense of dancing with a partner.

    I know what you're referring to. It, (like the *music* that it is attached to) is "all about me." I analogize it to contortionism.

    I see these guys in NYC with their loud amps in Times Square, monopolizing the area (and the cops let 'em do it, while shutting me down for using a tiny amp for background with my sax). I'll give them credit as gymnasts.

    Much Hip Hop / Rap is about 93 BPM, too slow for much dancing. Good for showing off various gestures, etc.

    And some of it is vulgar, like Cardi B. Not sexy. Just slutty.

    In fact, the entire Hip Hop / Rap thing isn't sensuous at all. Its robot rhythms and choppy "lyrics" (which ares also vulgar, glorify the ghetto for money and are dangerous on many levels) aren't sexy at all. No flow. No sway. Just metronomic, obscene nonsense.

    I *suppose* you could call it "dancing" if you want. Certainly more than Rap can be called "music," so I'll give you that.

    And no guitar (or sax) solos. Boo!

  6. #505
    Our appreciation of music is subjective. I'm sure most fans of hip hop would strongly disagree that there is no flow. Each artist has there own cadence and rhythmic feel. It might sound all the same to you if dislike the genre. Just like a nice scotch would taste like crap to someone who doesn't drink. Or how many people think jazz is a bunch of random notes and mental masturbation.

  7. #506
    Quote Originally Posted by Troubadour_1991
    Our appreciation of music is subjective. I'm sure most fans of hip hop would strongly disagree that there is no flow. Each artist has there own cadence and rhythmic feel. It might sound all the same to you if dislike the genre. Just like a nice scotch would taste like crap to someone who doesn't drink. Or how many people think jazz is a bunch of random notes and mental masturbation.
    Sure, "beauty is the eye of the beholder," but to place fake robot drums, obscene, gratuitous, shamelessly commercially exploitative words designed to monetize suffering, presented without melody, singing or instruments at the same level as Jazz, Classical, Rock etc., is, in my view, roughly analogous to people paying to see ME play golf instead of Tiger Woods.

    If only it were that easy!

    Fore!

  8. #507

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saxophone Tall
    I lived a half a mile from Paramount Pictures for the last 15 months. They said "no sound stage" for 10 years. Zimmer isn't a musician and his stuff is boring, just like the movies it decorates. Carl Stalling, he ain't! It's ALL fake. Very little studio work now for actual musicians on ANY instrument (save the major cats who've had what's left sewn up for years).

    A guy in the same house played video games 15 hours a day. He fancied himself a metal guitarist and had some of the toys. He sucked the Grand Wazoo. He couldn't play his way out of a paper bag. He was arrogant, too, and said that I couldn't play and "had no talent." (I practiced my saxophone, which I have played for 48 years, outside the house. Also piano, 52 years. I don't lack ability on either.). So I asked him: "what are the notes in a C major scale"? His answer: "I don't know, and I don't need to know any of that shit. F---k off."

    This guy was also using his computer to "write" some video game music..... YIKES!
    Sounds fabulous. I miss California. I need to get out of Las Vegas.
    I promise not to be a squatter if they lower the cost of rent.

  9. #508

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saxophone Tall
    Carl Stalling, he ain't!
    Ah, the great Carl Stalling!

  10. #509

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    Quote Originally Posted by Christian Miller
    Bwahahahahhahahahahaah

    i would have gotten away with it too, if it hadn’t been for you pesky kids
    Laugh all you want; as soon as we clear up which UFOs abducted Neatomic, we'll be coming after you.

  11. #510
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevebol
    Sounds fabulous. I miss California. I need to get out of Las Vegas.
    I promise not to be a squatter if they lower the cost of rent.
    Don't hold your breath. They were building a 37 million dollar, might hold 200 people at best luxury apartment across the street from me ... for homeless people.

    Clearly, the city has ZERO idea how to deal with housing.

    The only way I could afford to live there is in a glorified "rooming house." Cheap rent, but a bunch of misfits and weirdos in the house; they came and went. I was "Covid stuck" there for 15 months. Back on the East coast now. Back in La La Land when the weather craps out!

  12. #511

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saxophone Tall
    Don't hold your breath. They were building a 37 million dollar, might hold 200 people at best luxury apartment across the street from me ... for homeless people.

    Clearly, the city has ZERO idea how to deal with housing.

    The only way I could afford to live there is in a glorified "rooming house." Cheap rent, but a bunch of misfits and weirdos in the house; they came and went. I was "Covid stuck" there for 15 months. Back on the East coast now. Back in La La Land when the weather craps out!
    So you're a coastie. That's what they're called in Milwaukee. It's pretty funny.
    I've been plotting my revenge in Las Vegas the last 4 years. I think I'm ready for California again.

    If it's not about gangsters and pimps, I don't want to hear it. I know how to speak Californian. Say 'back in the day' a lot.

    Damn, can't they go down just 2-3 hundred on the rent? $1,500 in Oceanside is going to drain me.
    I promise not to squat. I have a nice pad but it's gone up to $1,200. Plus, it's f@cking Las Vegas.

  13. #512

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    Just noticed this was posted a few days ago .. Luckily the younger crowd on youtube ignore all the doom and gloom of this forum and just have fun with jazz


  14. #513

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    Quote Originally Posted by Troubadour_1991
    Sure, nothing evolves in a vacuum. This is true for jazz as well, but its still a distinctly different genre from say the blues. My point was dance is a central focus of rap/hip hop. Its is own style where professional dancers can have their entire career in that space alone. So I don't think its accurate to say rap/hip hop isnt dance music.
    I was agreeing with you - now "hip-hop" is one of the styles of dance a pro needs to be able to perform...along with tap, jazz, modern, ballet, pointe, etc.

  15. #514

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    Quote Originally Posted by Christian Miller
    The video I posted above is by one of the leading musicians of this scene. I think it’s cool. I’m trying to work out if she plays the guitar, cos if that’s a guitar solo it’s 1) super hip and also 2) not even her number 2 or 3 instrument. Talented musician in any case.
    Allan Holdsworth would have appreciated her approach to music. I wonder how she'd handle a Synthaxe?
    Last edited by olliehalsall; 06-03-2021 at 03:40 PM.

  16. #515

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    Can we get back on topic?

    JAZZ ISN'T A GENRE

    I went from a band that hired schooled musicians, I'd call them jazz musicians, to different kind of band. A residency band. Guitarists have it easy in some situations. You can be of value in R&B if you know how to stay out of the way.

    Is jazz a genre?

    "We crave definitions for our art, and when we can’t describe or compare it, many get frustrated. Hence, the Jazz Police."

    I can't form an opinion just because I played a few gigs with schooled musicians.
    It's a good question. Is jazz a genre?

  17. #516

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    "You see, when you try to take something as creative as jazz and fit it into a box, it becomes unattractive to people."


    "Unfortunately, over time a conservative contingent has dominated the jazz scene and branded it with a definition that is stuck in the 1950s. To their mind, jazz died in ’68 when
    Miles went electric"

  18. #517

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    I'd call Buffalo where I grew up, a fusion town. I guess it would be 'new school'? I'd have to practice it but I can play it. Some guys wanted to jam one time.
    We jammed a little. They were cool. Don't you want to do this? If I did I would definitely be writing music.
    Old school is bop.

    No, way. I tried. I can't play that stuff. Remembering heads, Donna Lee at 300 BPM.

    A guy who's very underrated and influencial is Steve Lukather.
    Last edited by Stevebol; 06-02-2021 at 11:59 PM.

  19. #518

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    Jazz. A music in permanent recession. The only musicians who will play for a paid gig and then go and play for free. A musician's music. A music where the goal recedes further into the distance the closer you think you are to it. A music played by gods and aspired to by mere mortals. It will never die because real creative talent will always seek its challenge. That inevitably means it evolves in new directions, but nurturing the entertainment value keeps it afloat. That's important too.

  20. #519

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    Hm. Turn more popish things into jazz. Like this:

    I think it sounds fresh and fun.

  21. #520

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    Quote Originally Posted by emanresu
    I think it sounds fresh and fun.

    Yeah .. fun ... At times it feels like jazz has lost it's sense of humor, which Lucas Brar definately has .. There was a time, when jazz was fun, was there? Entertainment, quotes. a bit of fooling around and a light hearted approach to it all?


    I like that he is bringing that to the forefront

  22. #521

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    Jazz is.

  23. #522

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    Quote Originally Posted by carvingcode
    Jazz is.

  24. #523

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    Quote Originally Posted by emanresu
    Hm. Turn more popish things into jazz. Like this:

    I think it sounds fresh and fun.
    not really popish though, think these guys do a better job:


  25. #524

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    Why Isn't Jazz Popular?-popish-plot-jpg

  26. #525

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    Popish jazz is when you don't have the jazz police, so much as a confession box.

    'Father, I played Stella in the key of B flat, and played the first two chords as Em7b5 A7b9.'