The Second Gentleman and Jazz

[tomvwash]

Nice magazine piece:

Doug Emhoff, First Jazz Fan - The Atlantic

[Sam Sherry]

At one point the indicator of, 'What will anybody say yes to?' on American opinion polls was the box for, "I am interested in developing my interest in jazz music." It regularly garnered a 4-5% positive response (on polls with a notional 5% margin of error).

The positive news is that there are millions of people in the US who like jazz. People who say, 'Jazz is dead' ignore that fact.
On the other hand, if there are one or two or three million people in the US who like jazz and listen to jazz that is a tiny fraction of the general population.
In short, it's a big, swingin' party but there's a lot more people having fun over at the Cowboy Carter spread.

[DawgBone]

I'm not going to sign up for the Atlantic just to read a piece about the least liked VP of all time's husband liking jazz. Who cares? Considering his cackling, annoying, low charisma wife he is probably more of a blues guy anyways, lol

[Stringswinger]

I'm not going to sign up for the Atlantic just to read a piece about the least liked VP of all time's husband liking jazz. Who cares? Considering his cackling, annoying, low charisma wife he is probably more of a blues guy anyways, lol

LOL! The Atlantic has been a propaganda rag for the Democrat Party for quite some time. Too bad, like the New York Times and Washington Post, it used to be a beacon of good journalism.

Considering Kamala Harris' unpopularity, I would bet that our "Second Gentleman" will never be a "First Gentlemen". And nor should he ever be. When Harris was DA of San Francisco County, her office withheld exculpatory evidence from defense attorneys, a serious ethical violation that may have resulted in innocent people being incarcerated. Bill Clinton was disbarred in Arkansas for committing Perjury. Rudy Giuliani was disbarred in New York for his role in trying to overturn the 2020 election. How is it that Kamala Harris still has her California law license?

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

LOL! The Atlantic has been a propaganda rag for the Democrat Party for quite some time. Too bad, like the New York Times and Washington Post, it used to be a beacon of good journalism.

I’m glad Doug Emhoff loves jazz. But I bet his son’s happy that dad liked Coltrane more than Pharoah Sanders.

Sadly, there’s almost no true journalism any more. Reporting must be impartial if it’s to serve as a foundation for individual thought, discourse and decision making. But writers, reporters, screen personalities, pundits, and other sources of “news” have become little more than proponents of their own beliefs and those of their employers.

Interpretation should be reserved for editorials, clearly identified opinion pieces, etc. Journalism demands balance in content unless the work is clearly described and presented as being skewed to a defined viewpoint. Television figures who focus solely on their preferences and highlight their likes and dislikes with facial expressions, mockery etc while claiming to be reporting the news have abandoned journalism and do no one a service. This is now the norm for left, right, middle, and off the wall.

[Doctor Jeff]

The difference between the right and the left publications and TV is that left-leaning outlets will post articles--sometimes many--on the shortcomings of the Democratic guy. (Just check headlines on WaPo, NYT, etc.)

The right...not at all. (Checked Fox News today just to be sure. Yep. 100% pro-Trump, 100% anti-Biden.)

But since we mentioned chief executive and spouse taste in music...any guesses on Trump's interest in or knowledge of music? Supposedly he likes Lionel Ritchie, Elvis and recent Broadway musicals like Phantom of the Opera. And Melania likes (loves!) Steven Tyler and Aerosmith, Elton John, Sia and Miley Cyrus. Most of whom don't love her back.

As far as the Pences...well Mike Pence likes “contemporary Christian, country, classical and anything by Earth Wind and Fire.” Though EWF went to court to keep him from playing September at campaign appearances.

Right-wing politicians at least in the States have predictably HORRIBLE taste in music.

You can say what you want about Democrats, but their music sense is better. Obama probably had the best musical interests of post-war presidents. Look at who performed for them, at White House events, at the Kennedy Center honors. In fact, Trump skipped the Kennedy Center events for most of his presidency, and most honorees refused to perform if he attended.

[RLetson]

A gentle reminder: "journalism" is not a single, monolithic body of practice. It includes straight reporting, analysis, commentary, editorializing, all the way out to plain old propagandizing (e.g., Fox News evening programming). One would certainly prefer that the news section of an outlet stick to just-the-facts, but my education and experience (including a couple decades practicing non-daily-news journalism) tells me that even straight reporting includes elements of subjectivity, selection, and a range of linguistic machineries that prevent it from being "objective" in the naive sense.

And the system that we call "journalism" includes an element called "audience" that is outside the power of the "journalist" to control. Half of the problem presented by, say, Fox News or Newsmax is that the audience is there voluntarily, just as the congregation of a tent revival meeting or a performance of Rent is.

Given that environment and the nature of the human beast, the effort to make sense of the world via mass media will always require an educated, skeptical, grounded person. (Disclosure: Before spending those decades of magazine writing, I was an English teacher, and part of that gig was trying to turn young people into educated, skeptical, grounded citizens. Ironically enough, part of my toolkit came from a Jesuit philosophical/theological education. Apologetics, anyone?)

[Stringswinger]

Right-wing politicians at least in the States have predictably HORRIBLE taste in music.

You can say what you want about Democrats, but their music sense is better. Obama probably had the best musical interests of post-war presidents. Look at who performed for them, at White House events, at the Kennedy Center honors. In fact, Trump skipped the Kennedy Center events for most of his presidency, and most honorees refused to perform if he attended.

Well, there is this:

5 Politicians Who've Genuinely Embraced Hip-Hop Culture

Perhaps this is why Bowman lost his re-election bid?

[DawgBone]

[Doctor Jeff]

Well, there is this:

5 Politicians Who've Genuinely Embraced Hip-Hop Culture

Perhaps this is why Bowman lost his re-election bid?

I would say that Bowman lost because he was too far to the left for his constituents. His vocal criticism of Israel didn't sit well in a state that is home to the city with the world's largest Jewish population. (Don't know the particulars of his district, though because of redistricting the borders included more affluent suburbs.)

I doubt supporting hip-hop would hurt a politician in NY State. Supporting bro-country, OTOH, would be the kiss of death up there.

[Stringswinger]

I would say that Bowman lost because he was too far to the left for his constituents. His vocal criticism of Israel didn't sit well in a state that is home to the city with the world's largest Jewish population. (Don't know the particulars of his district, though because of redistricting the borders included more affluent suburbs.)

I doubt supporting hip-hop would hurt a politician in NY State. Supporting bro-country, OTOH, would be the kiss of death up there.

Doc, you and I both know that Bowman lost his race because the pro-Israel lobby spent a record amount of money to defeat him (and I am glad they did, it is time for all members of the "Squad" to be hounded out of Government, IMO)). Country music does quite well in upstate New York, so I would bet in that region, bro-Country might help where hip-hop might not.

My real world experience as a professional jazz musician is that people of all political stripes can have good taste in music as well as bad taste. Your comment that Democrats have better music sense than Republicans is absurd, but you can believe whatever you want.

[Spook410]

For those frustrated with spin in the media, this source may be of interest. Haven't followed it for more than a day or two but it's certainly a fresh take on current news and the bias we're seeing on both the left and right.

Breaking News Headlines and Media Bias | Ground News

[Doctor Jeff]

Doc, you and I both know that Bowman lost his race because the pro-Israel lobby spent a record amount of money to defeat him (and I am glad they did, it is time for all members of the "Squad" to be hounded out of Government, IMO)). Country music does quite well in upstate New York, so I would bet in that region, bro-Country might help where hip-hop might not.

My real world experience as a professional jazz musician is that people of all political stripes can have good taste in music as well as bad taste. Your comment that Democrats have better music sense than Republicans is absurd, but you can believe whatever you want.

You’re right—I shouldn’t paint all people who vote a certain way with a broad brush. Hell, I voted for a Republican senator last election. (Though his musical predilections remain a mystery.)

Let’s just say that Republicans have been electing leaders with increasingly horrible taste in music, at least since Richard Nixon. Reagan gets a bit of a pass because of his friendship with Sinatra, though his actual musical interests were fairly pedestrian. (He said that his favorite band was The Beach Boys. Saying that in the 80’s was not a sign of great discernment. His favorite classical piece was Tchaikovsky’s first symphony. Etc.)

But hey, prove me wrong.

[palindrome]

Sort of contemporaneous:

[DawgBone]

You’re right—I shouldn’t paint all people who vote a certain way with a broad brush. Hell, I voted for a Republican senator last election. (Though his musical predilections remain a mystery.)

Let’s just say that Republicans have electing leaders with increasingly horrible taste in music, at least since Richard Nixon. Reagan gets a bit of a pass because of his friendship with Sinatra, though his actual musical interests were fairly pedestrian. (He said that his favorite band was The Beach Boys. Saying that in the 80’s was not a sign of great discernment. His favorite classical piece was Tchaikovsky’s first symphony. Etc.)

But hey, prove me wrong.

You seem angry bro.

[Stringswinger]

I am not a huge fan of Ted Nugent nor Kid Rock, though I think that in their respective genres (hard rock and rap), they are as good as any left leaning musicians from those genres. I try not to let a musicians politics influence my feelings about their work. Those who cannot do that suffer from a shortcoming called intolerance. And frankly, as a studied musician who has played professionally for twenty years now, I think that while jazz and classical are higher level music genres than hard rock or rap, but there is art and something to enjoy in all genres of music. Higher level does not make something necessarily better.

Regarding President Trump and the photo with Ted Nugent and Kid Rock, my thought is that with Trump, it is not about what music he (Trump) likes, but it is probably more about which musicians like him.

Jack Webb was perhaps the biggest jazz fan in Hollywood and was probably a bit right wing in his politics. Anyone who thinks that jazz is for lefties is not much of a critical thinker, IMO.

[mr. beaumont]

There's video out there of Kamala exiting a record store, she's asked what she bought, I think it was some Mingus and a Roy Ayres record IIRC.

[Doctor Jeff]

You seem angry bro.

I am angry about people with shitty taste in music yes.

[Doctor Jeff]

I am not a huge fan of Ted Nugent nor Kid Rock, though I think that in their respective genres (hard rock and rap), they are as good as any left leaning musicians from those genres.

You’re joking, right?

Jack Webb was perhaps the biggest jazz fan in Hollywood and was probably a bit right wing in his politics. Anyone who thinks that jazz is for lefties is not much of a critical thinker, IMO.

He married Julie London, had 6000 jazz records and played the cornet. But that was a different era.

Not saying conservatives can’t like jazz or complex music. But times change, and at least judging by recent Republican leaders, there’s a lot more love for Top 40 Country, Christian Rock (now there’s an oxymoron for you), and banal artists or has beens like Kid Rock and Ted Nugent.

[Stringswinger]

I am angry about people with shitty taste in music yes.

A. There are way more important things in life to get angry about than other people's taste in music; and

B. There are probably many people who would find your taste in music "shitty"

[ARGewirtz]

The difference between the right and the left publications and TV is that left-leaning outlets will post articles--sometimes many--on the shortcomings of the Democratic guy. (Just check headlines on WaPo, NYT, etc.)

The right...not at all. (Checked Fox News today just to be sure. Yep. 100% pro-Trump, 100% anti-Biden.)

But since we mentioned chief executive and spouse taste in music...any guesses on Trump's interest in or knowledge of music? Supposedly he likes Lionel Ritchie, Elvis and recent Broadway musicals like Phantom of the Opera. And Melania likes (loves!) Steven Tyler and Aerosmith, Elton John, Sia and Miley Cyrus. Most of whom don't love her back.

As far as the Pences...well Mike Pence likes “contemporary Christian, country, classical and anything by Earth Wind and Fire.” Though EWF went to court to keep him from playing September at campaign appearances.

Right-wing politicians at least in the States have predictably HORRIBLE taste in music.

You can say what you want about Democrats, but their music sense is better. Obama probably had the best musical interests of post-war presidents. Look at who performed for them, at White House events, at the Kennedy Center honors. In fact, Trump skipped the Kennedy Center events for most of his presidency, and most honorees refused to perform if he attended.

I doubt if anyone my age (that would 69) who was even remotely interested in politics can think of politicians and music without conjuring up the image of Bill Clinton playing sax on the Arsenio Hall show back in 1992.

[Doctor Jeff]

A. There are way more important things in life to get angry about than other people's taste in music; and

B. There are probably many people who would find your taste in music "shitty"

A. I get angry about this to keep me from busting a blood vessel over other crap I can’t control, including the political offerings these days.

B. I doubt it, at least anyone with any taste and intelligence. But you know what they say about opinions.

I mean, hey, you and I both love jazz guitar. How bad could our musical tastes be?

[DawgBone]

I am angry about people with shitty taste in music yes.

So basically perpetually angry since most people out there always have and always will listen to absolute garbage music. God give me the grace to accept things beyond my control.

[Bop Head]

[...] I try not to let a musicians politics influence my feelings about their work. [...]

I have met people who said they liked Skrewdriver and similar bands because of the music ...

Jazz was always political regarding the whole Chitlin' Circuit thing with the Green Book and musicians having too sleep on the other side of the railway track. African-Americans artists that prefered to stay in Europe because they were accepted there as human beings and respected as artists.

Jesse Jackson with Cannonball Adderley

[Stringswinger]

I mean, hey, you and I both love jazz guitar. How bad could our musical tastes be?

No argument from me on that!

When you look at our current offerings for political office remember what Frank Zappa said: