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  1. #76

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    Forgive me for yet another post of this, but over on one of the threads dealing with the new Fender Tone Master line of amps, the question was asked how the 1 Watt setting on the TM Twin Reverb sounds. I mean, well, 1 watt... but then you have the whole pre-amp behind it, and 2 12" speakers... so I decided to do the Donna Lee thing through the TMTR set on 1 Watt and rather than record direct, I parked a Shure SM57 in front of it.

    Funny, I was thinking more about the amp than the solo, and I think I might have played it better not really focusing on it!

    I actually am pretty impressed at how this amp sounds even set on a measly 1 Watt.


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  3. #77

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    Coming along nicely, LS! And you are right; the recorded sound at 1 watt is mighty jazz-worthy!

  4. #78

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    Quote Originally Posted by citizenk74
    Coming along nicely, LS! And you are right; the recorded sound at 1 watt is mighty jazz-worthy!
    Thank you. It was also a different guitar, the VOS1959 rather than the modern ES175. I love them both, but they play and sound different.

  5. #79

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    Yes, a clambake here on the Omnibook "Donna Lee" head and solo, but I survive it without cracking up and bailing on the solo. Lots to improve here, but I feel like there may be a pocket around here somewhere...

    Only sycophantic cheers and syrupy affirmation please. Participation Trophies are welcome.

    Seriously, observations and advice are always welcome.

    Of the 3 people who follow this thread...


  6. #80

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    I think you've learned all there is tto be learned, about that tune and that solo.
    Abandon it for awhile and concetrate on making/ keeping/ fitting into groove.

    BTW, you picked up the worst solo to learn. It sounds half assed even when Bird plays it. You will not learn much from it, except, maybe, to place prepared licks at random/ poorly chosen places.

  7. #81

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    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone
    Yes, a clambake here on the Omnibook "Donna Lee" head and solo, but I survive it without cracking up and bailing on the solo. Lots to improve here, but I feel like there may be a pocket around here somewhere...

    Only sycophantic cheers and syrupy affirmation please. Participation Trophies are welcome.

    Seriously, observations and advice are always welcome.

    Of the 3 people who follow this thread...

    As for the feel, there are still some “dum de dum de dum” eighth notes (especially slurred notes), as opposed to when you nail it with the more even 8ths that are locked into the swung up beat. An example of when you nail it is around :50, which interestingly and possibly importantly is where you appear most relaxed.

    I really think the tension in your body is slowing you down. If I had to guess, I would wager that you are fretting the strings way harder than you need to.

    Take a small section and play it, but only touch the string with your finger as if you were playing a harmonic. Do that til all the tension is gone (because what is there to be tense about if there no strength needed?) Then try to fret the note so that it is buzzy. What you might find, maybe not, is that it’s difficult to not press hard enough. At that time it could point to the amount of over exertion you may or may not be using.

  8. #82

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vladan
    Abandon it for awhile and concetrate on making/ keeping/ fitting into groove.
    What do you think he’s been doing this entire time?

  9. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by corpse
    What do you think he’s been doing this entire time?
    I think he's been trying to learn the notes and their placement, so to match one particular recording.

  10. #84

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    What does he do to work on groove after he abandons it?

    To be honest, I don’t think there’s anything better to do than what he’s doing as long as he’s making adjustments in the right direction.

  11. #85

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    Quote Originally Posted by corpse
    What does he do to work on groove after he abandons it?

    To be honest, I don’t think there’s anything better to do than what he’s doing as long as he’s making adjustments in the right direction.
    I feel uncomfortablet to talk like this about 3rd person who is actually present. I told him what I had to say. If he wants more detail, he can ask and maybe I will answer, maybe not.

    To answer your question and address your comment ...
    He should do whatever makes him sound better in regard to grove.

    Reading your post above (your last post before you turned to talk to me), we could agree on some issues.
    I think, probably we have different idea about what the right direction to goal is. Maybe we have different idea about goal it self. I can say, we have different idea about 1/8th note swing in this particular tune, based on how I understood that post of yours.
    I also think there's no need to discuss it further.

  12. #86

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    Quote Originally Posted by corpse
    As for the feel, there are still some “dum de dum de dum” eighth notes (especially slurred notes), as opposed to when you nail it with the more even 8ths that are locked into the swung up beat. An example of when you nail it is around :50, which interestingly and possibly importantly is where you appear most relaxed.

    I really think the tension in your body is slowing you down. If I had to guess, I would wager that you are fretting the strings way harder than you need to.

    Take a small section and play it, but only touch the string with your finger as if you were playing a harmonic. Do that til all the tension is gone (because what is there to be tense about if there no strength needed?) Then try to fret the note so that it is buzzy. What you might find, maybe not, is that it’s difficult to not press hard enough. At that time it could point to the amount of over exertion you may or may not be using.
    Yes the part you reference is actually 2 16th notes on the upbeat of 1 followed by an 8th not triplet on 2. I had just been playing it as a sloppy 5 note sweep and only recently have developed enough control to start playing it correctly. Parker's handling of it is really slippery. It's interesting to be playing a notated form of an actual performed solo, one of the classic solos of the whole bebop era that saxophone players have been learning ever since Bird played it. I guess they didn't think it was "half-assed" but rather a standard-setter for bebop vocabulary and style. So I'm using the notation to try to get to the played feel, allowing of course for the differences between the guitar and the saxophone.

    What' strange is that I don't feel any tension in my body at all. I think you and earlier Potlatch read some tension into the fact that my 65 year old academician's "stoop" can look tense, but I"m not aware of being tense. I am aware of breathing while I play, and after an hour of this, I have no discomfort in my hands, back, neck, or anywhere else. I'll pay more attention to that, but that's my sense right now. That I prop on my pinkie makes some think I'm tense, but I've done that for 50+ years and see no value in trying to change it in the twilight of life before I slip into senility or death.

    I'll try the idea of pressing with less force. If I can pick up just a little more ease, it will likely make a difference at this tempo.

  13. #87

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    Sorry if I was off base, I do try to always disclose on here I’m not very experienced in teaching.

    I probably read too far into the video because the tension thing was one of the biggest and fastest improvements I’ve had back in the day— Maybe I automatically think that’s everyone’s problem.

  14. #88

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    Hey I appreciate it and sometimes we (I) am not self aware enough to detect it. I will try to figure out how I can be more relaxed because that’s such a big part of a good flow. On this solo just getting the notes right can consume all else so one reason I’m staying with it is to get it so part of me that I can be relaxed. Crazy maybe but I’m my own teacher, band, and audience most of the time so I do what I want.


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  15. #89

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    You are a good teacher for yourself it seems. I have no idea why multiple people have told you to stop.

  16. #90

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    Me neither but Vladan is a serious musician and I respect his viewpoint though I don’t think he and I have ever agreed on anything! He might just think taking a break from DL and then coming back to it could help. He might be right but I’m not tired of it yet!


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  17. #91

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    Oh, Mr. Stone, I have one more thought. Consider that my opinion was your best feel was on 16th notes. Many Players think in half time and sixteenth notes. Hal Galper teaches this, but I know mostly from talking to horn players. Of course, no one right way to swing. Except mine. Just kidding.

  18. #92

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    Your progress is audible, and that last octave sweep had some serious sass! You're doin' good, Big Guy!

  19. #93

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    I can hear you improving, so that's a valuable thing.

    Bear in mind learning is not linear. Changing tasks to something else totally different - for instance working on chordal technique - might have knock on effects to the other aspects of your playing. Don't be afraid to move on and come back to something.

  20. #94

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    In line with corpse's advice, you may try playing the head and solo while tapping your foot at half and then quarter the rate to get a more relaxed feel with a greater sense of flow. This is particularly important to experience at faster tempos. Check out this video where Joe Lovano demonstrates the differences:


  21. #95

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    As I keep on working with this, I'm using it to "jazz demo" various pieces of gear. This is my 2015 L5ces and the Quilter Tone Block 202, recording direct.

    Also: I realize in m. 15 I'm dropping the 2 notes on beat 4. I've separated this phrase out for further work and for the moment playing it "partial."

    I gotta say I am very impressed by the Quilter Tone Block 202. My only complaints are with the user interface and dual-purpose switches that put me in a bind from time to time, forcing choices I would rather not have to make.