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  1. #1

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    Message to the moderator:

    I usually post these type of threads on the sticky thread - Why I think adults can develop perfect pitch - That thread eventually evolved to a biopic journal, where I post my daily perfect pitch and relative pitch activities. In that thread, I have already proven that adults CAN develop Perfect Pitch at any age if they use the right tools and effective practice methods and most importantly, consistent practice. The stuff that I mostly post in that Perfect Pitch thread usually fall into two categories: Play by ear videos and Perfect Pitch Journals. I have decided to divide that Perfect Pitch Thread to two threads with its appropriate titles. Feel free to make this a sticky thread. I have been in this forum for many years and I have no history of doing anything mischievous or violating any rules, that's not what I'm intending to do.

    Thank You,
    Jason Sioco

    Message to the forum members:
    This will be a collection of my daily perfect pitch practice. I have discussed both my perfect pitch and relative pitch lifestyle at this forum jazzguitar.be - I was surprised that my ear training threads were able to strike a chord on the forum members, when in other places on the internet, particularly Youtube it is the exact opposite - there is a scarcity of views, comments, and haters are quick to push the dislike button on my material on Youtube. In my life outside the internet - aside from my mom and dad - no one knows that I am good at perfect pitch. When I search forums on the internet about the most recent threads about Perfect Pitch, I giggle at the fact that those Perfect Pitch Nazis are still stuck with the old adage that only little children can develop perfect pitch and you have to be born with it. Apparently they have no clue that my Perfect Pitch videos existed. If they found my videos, they are going to eat their words. Also Youtube has a crappy algorithm.If you type Perfect Pitch on Youtube, you will see none of my videos anywhere on the search results. While Rick Beato's Perfect Pitch videos and the adults can't develop Perfect Pitch videos are on the very top of the search results. But with all of that, I seem to have some kind of place in this forum. Due to the lack of traffic on my youtube channel, I decided to post my perfect pitch videos here. Feel free to leave a comment. I'll be happy if there is a lot of traffic in this thread.

    To close on this matter of Perfect Pitch:
    This past Christmas, I was discussing to my pastor about Perfect Pitch. My pastor may be a cliche, classic Christian, gospel, and grace pastor; but he's the only pastor I know that can name all the original members of Dream Theater, can play by ear, mastered relative pitch and is an accomplished musician. I talked to my pastor about people on the internet spreading the idea that adults can't develop Perfect Pitch. The discussion that day led to perfect pitch. It was like a Catholic making a confessional with a priest or something XD. He got bewildered as if I am living on a different planet, as if he never heard of that idea before. He calmly said to me: That's not true. You can develop Perfect Pitch at any age. He said more than that. But those kind words gave me more confidence that my success with Perfect Pitch is sustainable and it will only get better and better. So my journey with Perfect Pitch continues.
    Last edited by Jason Sioco; 01-18-2020 at 11:08 PM.

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  36. #35

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    My honest opinion, you could make clip just showing the list, for example:

    "Today I correctly guessed:
    1. DMaj7
    2. Bm7b5
    3. ....
    .
    .
    ."

    It would pass on the same info to viewer in much shorter time. Instead of 15 minutes clip, you could make it 1 minute, or less.
    Would not help your views count, but you'd be less disappointed, because you'd invest less.

  37. #36

  38. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Vladan
    My honest opinion, you could make clip just showing the list, for example:

    "Today I correctly guessed:
    1. DMaj7
    2. Bm7b5
    3. ....
    .
    .
    ."

    It would pass on the same info to viewer in much shorter time. Instead of 15 minutes clip, you could make it 1 minute, or less.
    Would not help your views count, but you'd be less disappointed, because you'd invest less.
    I already did that last year and people in this forum were thinking I was just making up stuff. My vids are cold, hard evidence that Perfect Pitch can be developed at any age.

  39. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Sioco
    I already did that last year and people in this forum were thinking I was just making up stuff. My vids are cold, hard evidence that Perfect Pitch can be developed at any age.
    Well, that is the point, really.
    If you take a closer look, you will see that those clips are not a proof. They reminded me of ... "let's play a game, you have to guess the number I imagined", or "guess how many fingers I hold behind my back".
    People will believe your claims, or not, but there is nothing in those clips that will prove your claims are truthful. Those clips are just another claim.

    Generally, the only thing YT clip can prove is date of upload, and what can be concluded from that fact.

  40. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Sioco
    My vids are cold, hard evidence that Perfect Pitch can be developed at any age.

    Are you willing to come to my home. I'll supply something to eat and a nice dessert ... Then we will set up a cam and a mic. I'll play random stuff and you will sit looking away from my fingerboard and call out the notes/chords for all the forum to see?
    Last edited by Lobomov; 01-23-2020 at 10:07 AM.

  41. #40

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    Really no offense, if this is important to you have at it. I think it's a total waste of time and probably no one cares much but if you can prove this thing which is probably not proveable, that would be interesting.

    But if you told me that if I worked at it an hour a day for a year I could develop perfect pitch I would have to say no way. It's not going to be all that valuable on a day to day basis. It might take a few minutes off doing a transcription or something and have some minor effects on picking out notes when someone else is playing but it really does not seem to offer all that much to the working musician vs the amount of time it would take (and I am pretty sure it's impossible anyway).

    I would be much more impressed if you posted a bunch of videos of you playing music really beautifully, interpreting interesting tunes, etc. You could definitely be a crappy musician with perfect pitch or an amazing musician without it (most amazing musicians don't have it) so not sure what the point is.

    Note: I did actually shell out $100 for the stupid perfect pitch tape course they used to have in the backs of guitar magazines in the 90s. With predictable results. Perhaps I'm just bitter.

  42. #41

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    To Sully:
    I asked from a friend "why the hell you watch pool on TV ffs?", and he responded "I like it".
    See, it's all about what people like or dislike. If they like to do something, who are you to call it a waste of time?
    I agree, that OP should put more into other playing skills also but I wont call it waste of time at all.

    Gotta repeat what I've said earlier in this topic in some other thread. There are levels of perfect pitch skills. The name for this trait is messed up - "perfect". That is so misleading.

    Having trained playing by ear for years now, I actually have something similar going on here.
    Not anything godlike at all. But I can hit the right note on the guitar without previous noodling, no frame of reference. Need to play a certain note, I can "feel" it being there, on the right spot on the neck. Sometimes happens with simple triads also.
    This happens more and more often. Not "perfect" and reliable all times but surely has more to do with this "perfect pitch" thing than relative pitch.
    I'm not after this and never ever tried to practice hitting a note or chord without a frame o reference (key, scale pattern), just that it seems it will happen to improve by itself in time.
    That's why I'm convinced that the topic is not black and white, that's all I'm saying.
    Perfect pitch is not a skill that you either have or don't have.

    If they go give a lecture against it (like Beato), they all talk in absolutes.. like the Sith

  43. #42

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    For me it would be a waste of time because I want to play music as well as I can, and there seems to be limited advantage of using my limited time to develop perfect pitch (which I'm convinced is not something you can learn anyway) vs working on being a good and knowledgable musician.

    Again, if that's what you're into, knock yourself out. Personally I think a lot of things like this are a means to avoid dealing with actually playing music (I have plenty of these diversions myself). My goal is to play well and be around people who play well and make cool music. There's a lot of work in front of me and having perfect pitch would not greatly alter that.

    But personally, if you're not 100% on single tones, I don't think that you're approaching perfect pitch. If I can't reliably recognize colors more than say 80% of the time, I'm not approaching perfect vision, I'm color blind. It absolutely appears to be an absolute binary skill in people who demonstrate the skill.

  44. #43

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    Nailing a note without any frame of reference - what do you want to call it then?

    Give the skillset a proper name then and we all can get along

  45. #44

  46. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by emanresu
    Nailing a note without any frame of reference - what do you want to call it then?

    Give the skillset a proper name then and we all can get along
    No frame of reference? Have you not heard music before?

    I believe Beato covers this in his video, that you can have fairly decent pitch memory if you work on it. For a long time I could sing a perfectly in tune A from some note in You Make Me Feel Like a Natural Woman by Aretha Franklin. I haven't tried it in a long time.

    I don't really think you can empty your head of pitches.

    But again, if you show me pages of primary colors, I'm going to have 100% of them, day in day out. Just like everyone else who isn't color blind. I didn't really have to work on it, someone told me the name of the color and I went from there. Pretty sure that's what perfect pitch is like.

    What you're talking about is like someone who is actually color blind and quizzing themselves on colors and eventually being able to interpret the noise and say what the color is.

    But while colorblindness in an artist would like be a limitation, in musicians it's assumed that you don't have perfect pitch.

    Again though, most great musicians can't do this, so that's why, for me at least, it seems like a total waste of time. Also note: most great musicians didn't try to do this either.

  47. #46

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    You are still missing my point.

    There is no intermediate between perfect pitch and not having it whatsoever. Yet, there are different levels of that skill anyway and nothing to categorize it.
    It's somewhat trainable but you (and not only you of course) always will be telling me "it's not perfect pitch". I'm fine with keeping the "perfect pitch" term for people who have it 100%.
    Btw, saw two people with this 100% perfect pitch arguing "this is A.. aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa" "no! this is "A" .. aaaaaaaaaaaaa" This was funny.

    My question is - what is in between?
    To clarify: I come home from repair shop, pick up the guitar, hear a random major chord, have no clue what it's name, I kinda "feel" it there on the neck there (somewhere in the middle, the triad), play it and its exactly that.
    No guess-work, I played it because I felt like its there. With chords, its rare. With single notes, this happens all the time.

  48. #47

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    Minus near 100% name/pitch recognition I believe the term is excellent relative pitch with good pitch memory.

  49. #48

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    Ponder this, how much time did you spend memorizing the color red? How long did you have to stare at it before you realized it was red? How much color recognition exercises did you do?

    Probably zero, right? You knew what red was and then someone told you the word red and you were done.

    Now if for some reason you weren't able to recognize red, you probably could figure out what was red by deducing it from other colors you could see. Maybe you'd only need to see one other color to recognize red. But maybe only 80% of the time would you guess right that it was red.

    Now what if 98% of the world was like the latter example and 2% was like the former. That's what perfect pitch is like.

  50. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by sully75
    Minus near 100% name/pitch recognition I believe the term is excellent relative pitch with good pitch memory.
    Forget about the relative pitch or explain how you see it is involved with the examples here.
    And also, perfect pitch is all about pitch memory. The difference is how it works and how people have obtained it.

  51. #50
    "Perfect pitch" is somewhat like "chord melody". Maybe not the best way to describe all that it entails, but there's really not any OTHER term, beyond your inventing one, for what's being discussed. Sometimes you simply have to compromise on using a term you think inadequate, just for the sake of communicating with other humans. Does anyone honestly not know what he's referring to at this point?

    Anyway, this whole discussion is kind of derailing the OP. Maybe debating the semantics of "Perfect pitch" might need its own thread. Sounds riveting.