The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
Reply to Thread Bookmark Thread
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Posts 26 to 33 of 33
  1. #26

    User Info Menu

    Hm. This got a bit more interesting now.


  2.  

    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #27

    User Info Menu

    Lol. I have done this before on another Forum.

    Weird how everyone has a different definition for Perfect Pitch.

    I met a girl who had it - she was not a Musician she remarked that she took Piano Lessons before and had Perfect Pitch- I was in my late Teens I think- was there for Romantic Reasons lol.

    But the Perfect Pitch interested me - I tested her..she was annoyed by this- she could name any Note accurately within about 1/2 or MAYBE 2 seconds-

    Just like you or I could name different Colors or identify 2 digit numbers on a Flash Card !

    After a minute or 2 she was done- annoyed not into Piano or Music...and don't remember her being real into me either lol.
    I remember the Perfect Pitch more than the rest of the Encounter - haha - I don't think I ever went out with her again

    She had the type of perfect pitch that can* NOT be learned- once she heard the Notes and knew their names they were recognizable instantly-

    Just like you at one time learned the Color and name for the Color ' Blue ' you recognize it nearly instantly-
    you don't have to think ....red...yellow...orange...purple...- it' s Blue.

    I will not debate this...not worth it..it was pretty amazing ..she really had the gift though.

    I'd rather have what I have now because obviously
    Perfect Pitch does not mean someone can Play -

    She did not like to Play ...probably was made to take Piano Lessons when very young.

    But true Perfect Pitch is rare...if the Piano was tuned
    one Semitone off she would have called Bb an A ...

    *Not possible to learn- this could be wrong.
    Perhaps they were exposed to ( usually Piano ) at a young age and this heightened Sense of Recognition
    along with what the Notes are called develops ?

    Interesting Other Thought- I JUST remembered I tried to play a few simple chords to see if she could name each NOTE IN A CHORD- she was done, annoyed, and would not do it lol or talk about it any more !

    Even at that age I was thinking -" wow- If she could instantly hear each note in chords " and I was very untrained .

    The Old School thought on this was - "it's a gift you are born with "etc.

    So I was repeating that - and it could be wrong.

    Also - a lot of the Debate on that other Forum was how useful this would be for Guitar so legit conversation but ....
    Last edited by Robertkoa; 06-06-2017 at 08:54 AM.

  4. #28

    User Info Menu

    I think everybody has already agreed that perfect pitch is what it is and don't feel like debating.

    But the last part of the vid was interesting and new to me - that 0-3 years letting an infant to hear complex music instead children's songs could lead to perfect pitch and easy path to music later in life (if they'd like to of course). I wonder how successful this method actually is.

  5. #29

    User Info Menu

    Last time I brought this up, it became a whole hullabaloo. This topic tends to bring out strong opinions, for whatever reason.

    I learned perfect pitch as an adult (early 20's). I studied privately with Alla Cohen in Boston, and that's all we worked on. She has a book on it, but I can't vouch as to whether it would be as effective as lessons. I also can't speak about Bruce Arnold's perfect pitch course (though he is a great teacher and his relative pitch courses are based off Charlie Banacos's approach).

    I'm not a researcher, so I can't speak about the science behind it. All I have is my personal experience to go by. And I can understand skepticism. Maybe I always "had it" and just needed some guidance to find it. Maybe I'm just a fluke. Regardless, I can do things I couldn't do before: identify pitches without a reference, sing any of the 12 pitches first thing in the morning, etc.

    I certainly don't think you need it to be a great musician, and inversely, I don't think everyone who has it is a great musician (I'm certainly not). I decided to try to learn it because I was interested in a lot of avant-garde composition and improvisation, and figured this was just more straightforward. But great relative pitch is more than enough.

    "Can I hear a piece of music and instantly transcribe it or play it back?" Not exactly.

    Take something fast and complex, like a Charlie Parker solo. If you were to stop it at any point, I could tell you what the note was. But to grasp the whole solo? No way. It's like if someone were to tell you a string of random numbers -- chances are, you won't be very good at recalling them. Counter-intuitively, something like Webern is MUCH easier for me to hear, even if the pitch relations are so abstract, because it's so sparse.

    Memory is a huge part of this. I seriously doubt that I have some "extra-sensory ability" -- only that I've managed to memorize what each of the 12 pitches sound like. So a post like this:

    There are over two dozen temperaments that have been used in the history of music, only a few still well known, with equal temperament the modern favorite (a recent standard, as is the A=440Hz which historically varied the better part of an octave).

    So, the naming of a note from a given pitch must be within the context of a concert pitch standard and a temperament. Both those necessities make the very definition of perfect pitch difficult. Which temperament would be real perfect pitch? Today, we would test with equal temperament, but what about back before that was invented?


    ...while I understand where they're coming from, I think there's a fundamental misunderstanding. Someone with perfect pitch, for whatever reason, managed to imprint in their memory what the note "A" sounds like. Today, that would be A=440. In different eras, it would be a different value. But the mechanism would be similar. Now, if that person also had exposure and experience with microtones, they might also be able to more precisely name them. Ali Akbar Khan could do that, and so could Lou Harrison. I don't have much experience with microtones, so I tend to characterize notes as "A, but somewhat flat" or "kind of halfway between A and Bb." I'm only comparing to what I have on file in my head.

    Although I'm not a researcher, I suspect that superb memory skills have a strong correlation to perfect pitch. You have guys like Pierre Boulez, who conducted entirely from memory, without a score in front of him. You have stories like the young Mozart transcribing an Allegri's Miserere from memory. But at the same time, I also wouldn't be surprised if Mozart would have more trouble with a Stravinsky or Schoenberg piece, something that he couldn't quickly categorize based on musical devices he was already familiar with. Who knows.

    Happy to answer any questions.

  6. #30

    User Info Menu

    Yeah quarter tones are real artform in middle eastern music, very detailed on where a musician places their e half flat or whatever.

    With Mozart, yeah I think so. The music of his tune was constructed out of recognisable modules and patterns somewhat like bebop, say. Also the misere is super repetitious, so tbh I'm surprised it took him two listens. :-)

    But seriously music is a language, and sometimes you have to spell out unfamiliar words and names. The ones you use all the time you recognise at first glance.

    Afaik that's as true for someone with perfect pitch. Rick Beatos blog is good on this. His kid is great on polychords but not everyone with pitch has this capability. It has to be trained.

  7. #31

    User Info Menu

    I recall seeing the perfect pitch course advertised for years. I recall also reading some posts from people who were pursuing it, but never a post of someone claiming that it worked for them.

    On a slightly related topic, my fingers have better relative pitch than the rest of my brain, or something.

    If you sing a melody, I can usually play it instantly without mistakes (well, not many) but if you asked me to name the notes it would take me much longer and I'd make more errors.

    I can deal with melody pretty well, but trying to hear chord changes has always been much more of a challenge. I can do it if it's simple enough. I've worked on it with a little bit of improvement in years of trying.

  8. #32

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by yaclaus
    Hi everyone

    Lately I've gotten the impression that I have some sort of perfect pitch that is very very imperfect. From practicing so much it feels like my working memory can remember the sound of a guitar note or string and then I can adjust to the exact pitch. It has worked with db,eb,c,a,e so far will need to try it a little bit more. I always sing a wee bit on the flat side though. Anyone care to share some thoughts and experiences?

    I can't really identify pitches directly as such maybe guitar notes.
    That is called "Levitin effect" aka "pitch memory":
    Levitin effect - Wikipedia

    You can indeed have that and not have perfect pitch at all, like myself.

    Cheers,

    Alex

  9. #33

    User Info Menu

    Hm, about 8 months have passed since my last post here with constant ear training. Now if I need to play a certain note fresh - just as the 1st thing after picking up the guitar, I can get very close to it on the fretboard. It's not gonna be anything like the real thing, but it does get better it seems. A few times I felt certain that the note there, that I was about to play, was the one what I heard in the mind. What a pleasant surprise. Btw, I have no interest or real time invested in this skill, just occasional curiosity


    edit: This went horribly wrong after writing this post. I take it back. I suck at the pitch thing forever and ever.
    Last edited by emanresu; 12-29-2017 at 09:35 PM.