How do you learn a transcribed solo?

[Reg]

Some points about learning notated music...

Your either reading or memorizing someones music. If the notation's correct with all the articulations etc... great, a few listens and reading through should work.

This is based on.... you have the reading skills which reflect your guitar skills, you can't read what you can't technically play.

Most don't read well... (for whatever reason(s) ), so basically this option doesn't work. So now the only option you have is memorizing and using the notation as a memory aid for form or some reason to look at the music.

So the singing approach is cool, as long as you have singing skills, Generally again most don't... I didn't say a lousy voice, I'm talking about the skills of singing, just like the skills of playing guitar. But I would guess most use the singing really as a memory aid or device for helping to remember the notated music. (and yes great practice for learning to hear what your playing... or playing what your hearing).

So sometimes... down the line, if one chooses, you get to the point where you have both options... or not. But you also get to the point to where you can basically play almost anything by ear. So the memorization thing can work in a few ways.

Personally... sure I've trained my ears, I can hear what I'm playing as well as what's notated on the page, but the memorization thing, I've personally never had the time to listen and play over and over... to the point where I've beat the music into my head, I'm not saying this is wrong or bad, there are probably great benefits from this approach, I've just never had the time. Even when I play or perform by ear... I'm structured, I naturally organize the music somewhat into a lead sheet... in my head. Is there any difference between memorizing a tune, melody and changes as compared to a transcribed solo... again just some thoughts.

[targuit]

Jay,

Are you saying that the program notate what you are playing in real time. That would be really cool.

Yep! A long time coming. I've had the Godin LGX-SA (synth access), a Roland GR-20 guitar synth, and an M-Audio Uno USB interface to use with Sibelius for a while, but could never get it to work properly to my disappointment. Instead I focused on improving my keyboard skills for live "real" time note entry. Ultimately, I was able to use my Yamaha keyboard synth for that purpose - which is a great thing in itself and I'm pleased. But, thinking about selling the Roland synth and the Godin LGX for the cash to buy a half decent archtop, I tried one last time to get the system to work after a driver update. And it did to my great surprise. The latency that disillusioned me with using the synth live is not an issue when creating midi files, so that great problem virtually disappears. It is like the software is taking dictation. No ghost notes and excellent tracking. And of course the playback sounds exactly like the notes I played except I can orchestrate a vibes, string, harmonica, piano, horn, woodwind....track. Opens up a load of possibilities both for home studio recording as well as capturing one's inspirations and exploring harmonies, working on solos...down to writing exercises for students or even simply transcribing tunes in real time. Saves me a lot of time. And if I use my Sibelius tracks for recording with my Korg digital recorder, I can use my Yamaha synth voices which are superior to the Roland's. This also allows me to transfer the midi tracks directly into the Korg as accurate backup rhythm, bass, string...tracks, leaving me to record guitar and vocal tracks "live". That makes a big difference in my demo recordings, as I currently do not have a computer DAW for editing.

The annoying thing is that I had tried to Google responses to solve the problem, called Roland and Sibelius "tech help lines" - all to no avail and that is over years of wasted or lost time. But on the plus side my keyboard skills would not have progressed as much if I had not been forced to work on them harder.


To get back to the thread subject of "learning transcribed tracks" - someone has to do the transcription in the first place. To put this in perspective, I will soon get Transcribe as a software program. Normally I don't bother slowing stuff down, but with this new capability to use the guitar for note entry, by slowing down Joe Pass's version of But Beautiful with Transcribe, creating a good transcript of his actual performance note-for-note could be valuable. And as for learning jazz devices - I was listening and trying to play along with video of jazz performance from a 1995 Festival where Larry Coryell was playing with Birelli Lagrene - great stuff with complex guitar solos over ATTYA. But not straight up and too complex to do without slowing it down. This now is possible and vastly simplified. So it is also a tool to learn the solo after you transcribe it.

Jay

[targuit]

Btw, this reminds that in the discussion about how to learn a transcription solo, did anyone yet mention the value of slowing the transcription tempo down? Doing your own transcriptions makes this easy. And that is a great way to learn the music. Not to mention transpose keys and the like.

In addition, there are alternate solutions to turning your normal electric guitar, such as an archtop, into a "midi" guitar without major alterations with a new tech device that essentially does what I am doing but without the need for a guitar synth or Roland GI - 20 (midi) device. I forget the name but there are demo vids on YT. I'll try and find it. This tech solution was not available at the time I got the Roland GR-20 synth.

[monk]

targuit,
The idea of real-time playing input with a guitar synth and notation program would be invaluable to me as a teacher. What did you do to to your set-up to make it work for you. Driver updates, etc.
Thanks,
Jerome

[gtrplrfla]

Hello again, Jay,

Is the "But Beautiful" version you referred to, from Joe's "Catch Me" album ? If so, this link will take you there.

Incidentally, I have an old standard notation transcription somewhere in my archives and could mail you a copy if you wish. PM me as I don't know how to post it and it's probably against site rules, too.

[targuit]

I use a legacy Sibelius G7 program.

The chain from guitar to computer is:

Godin LGX-SA electric guitar with hexaphonic thirteen pin pup into Roland GR-20 guitar synth with MIDI IN and OUT to M-Audio Uno USB interface into Gateway PC running Windows 7 Home into the Sibelius G7. A bit cumbersome. You have to pay attention to setting the string sensitivity with the Roland as well as turning off the signal to the Roland so the signal goes through without triggering the synth. Sounds hard but it is just the way you turn the Roland power ON that accomplishes the bypass, which is overrided each time you turn it off. (In other words it goes back to normal synth operation - you have do the bypass thing each time you power the synth up to use it for MIDI note entry.)

Btw, the newest Roland guitar synth does not require a USB interface to work in the proper manner. And there is the Roland GI-20 which is just the midi signal without the synth voices. I have not tried the newest synth. But there is a new technology that will enable any (electric?) string guitar to work for MIDI control - I think it's called 'MIDI Guitar' but I cannot remember. The video is on YT.

It is a long desired objective, and makes me reconsider selling the synth and the Godin. I kind of soured on using the synth live and for recording directly - too much latency. But I can use the MIDI files recorded in Sibelius and import them to my Korg D1200 digital recorder. Latency problem solved.

Jay