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Here is a comping on Rhythm Changes lesson by Peter Bernstein:
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03-20-2020 07:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Tal_175
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Originally Posted by neatomic
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I discovered a great Dean Martin album (Dream of Dean) a few years back with him and a small trio, but mostly featuring a very smooth guitar who I later discovered was also Barney Kessel and it got me to searching for other CDs like this as I love the minimalness and beauty of just a singer and guitar.
Another is "the Intimate Ms Christy" with June Christy and Al Viola and is one worth getting. The Julie London CD in this list is another I don't have so thanks for that!!
There are a couple Sammy Davis albums, one Bossa style with Laurindo Almeida and another electric guitar only with Mundell Lowe that are both just Sammy and guitar and both very good.
Would appreciated any leads on other CDs out there like that? Thanks in advance!
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Originally Posted by Sundeep
Julie Is Her Name (Vols. 1 & 2) - Julie London with Barney Kessel(1) and Howard Roberts(2)
After Hours - Sarah Vaughan with Mundell Lowe
Sarah + 2 - Sarah Vaughan with Barney Kessel
Portrait of Sheila - Sheila Jordan with Barry Galbraith
Folk Songs A La King - Morgana King with Chuck Wayne
I'm sure there are plenty of other titles that escape me for the moment. Beverly Kenney Sings For Johnny Smith is a quartet date from the same period but Kenney and Smith provide the main interest.
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Yea... better examples of comping. personally as much as I love Peter's playing...his comping is... ? not his thing.
I mean It's a style than many guitarist use... somewhat like a default stay out of the way and fill in the middle. Which after the first few choruses... almost gets in the way.
I believe most guitarist don't comp that well because they generally start from the root... and never really leave.
By that I mean they embellish the notes on top of that root, rather than embellish using organized harmonic relationships. When you approach comping like soloing from an embellishment style... it gets harmonically muddy.
If your going to try and improv while comping... the improve needs to have clean harmonic lines of relationships and development. It not like soloing improv, where your out front and can use the rest of the players as a pedal like effect.
You can use established lick like comping patterns, because they have a harmonic established references. Think like Chord Patterns.... they already have established harmonic references.
The other side is the rhythmic thing.... you need to be aware of the tunes style or feel which is the Harmonic Rhythm.... the rhythm pattern of the tune being played... has and implies harmony for those attacks.... those attacks create the strong side of Harmonic rhythm. If your going to create a different harmonic line or chord movement that's not part of that Harmonic rhythm....The Weak side....that's where you bring it in, usually also with organization...but do what you can.
If you aren't in to the harmony or theory thing... at least get the rhythmic thing together.
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Do you have a recommendation for a record Reg?
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Sure ... most of the great pianist. sorry lol
maybe old John Pisano... here's an example with Joe Pass. Needs to be at least 30 years ago....
I think Fareed approach is good.
Burrell
kessel
Bird
Ellis
Early Bensen
Malone
Me
In general... not guitarist.
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Originally Posted by Reg
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Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar
Both the bossa nova and swing sections of the comping are very groove based. We've been making a distinction between improvized accompanyment vs rhythm guitar. This sort of falls in between. I guess the more you limit improvization in the accompaniment, the less chances there is to get in the way of the soloist.
But sometimes getting in the way makes the whole arrangement sound more interesting to the audience. Is the only goal of the rhythm section make the job of the soloist easier or is it to elevate the performance for the audience? Of course it's tempting to say that, "both, because they are the same things" but is it? May be sometimes the soloist just have to concentrate more and plow through adventurous comping.
PS. Joe Pass is using the middle position of the pickup selector. I really like that position on my ES 175 as well.
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I enjoyed Pisano’s comping here, uber supportive. I have to confess I don’t know his playing, so will check out more stuff.
I sometimes play with people who get in the way. Reflecting on it, I wonder if it’s good that I have to go away from my usual situation and play in a different way and might end up sounding more interesting even as I find it a bit annoying.
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Originally Posted by christianm77
There's a pretty fine line sometimes between 'reactive' and 'proactive' comping. I suppose it's like any conversation - go with the flow and occasionally drop in new ideas/thoughts to keep the ball rolling. Some personalities are suited to the role. For instance, one of the most selfless guys I've met and had the pleasure to play with on the scene is Los Angeles guitarist, Larry Koonse. It's no surprise that Larry (who also has impeccable technique) is on countless albums accompanying singers.
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Here's a vid of gig... I was subbing on, the mandolin player is a friend. They're a memorize approach band, obviously that's not my approach, but I have fun in any setting...
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Yea... better examples of comping. personally as much as I love Peter's playing...his comping is... ? not his thing
I really like the way he does it... of course I like your vid and example with Joe Pisano too
But what Peter does responds to my time feel in general... I always had a bit loose and probably for someone 'muddy' time feel... I like when it is on the edge of being lost.
I am not pro of course and do not play a lot with others so I do not feel competent as you are from player's point of view...
But as a listner I really enjoy Petre's comping and interacting with soloist.. I enjoy it asa musical result of... how it all procedes musically
It is probably even the most important thing about it
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Hehe I thought Reg was trolling.
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Hey Jonah...Yea I like pushing buttons, get it out etc... And I love Perter's playing also... who doesn't. He a great musician, one of the better ambassadors of guitar..... But I don't like just playing I V types of harmony with embellishments either...I like the subdominant areas.
That loose, muddy or somewhat lost feel is great for soloing.... but generally not that great for accompanying. There is a difference of what's implied by harmonic and rhythmic combinations.... when used with embellishment approach basically the use of relative min. and b9 and using different relative relationships and functional movementt from.
What make a Blues to you... is it I V or I IV ? (I'm not just pushing buttons... really).
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Originally Posted by Reg
I think maybe the important thing is that I guess Peter (and possibly me) refers to it in a different way...
I actually hear a lot of blues there..
I think it is important that for him it probably does not matter.... I mean he does not hear as you analyzed that.... I suppose
He would understand this of course but he does not relate to that...
his comping sounds to me like a 'counterpoint thick melody' and I feel like he just thinks of it as of melody... all conviction comes from that melodic statement of a phrase and rythm is related to that melodic statement... if one hears it that way there is no problem with time which is always there .. to me this kind of elusive playing determins time even better becasue it does not show it litterally - it feels behind it... and this is what music is about imho
but generally not that great for accompanying.
there is not general rule... for real music ... maybe there is one for a working session pro player to fit industry standards.. but real achievemnets in music are not about fitting industry standards...
again I hear he sounds good in comping in real music context... and to be honest I do not care whether his bandmates feel comfortable with his compoing or not... this is social stuff... some probably do, some do not... those who do - play with him.. those who don't - don't...
. I care about great performance
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Guys, you NEED to check out Matt Munisteri - a MONSTER player/musician in all respects. Listen here :
There is plenty more with him and "The Earregulars"
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Originally Posted by Reg
Nice...dug the guitar and mando work...don't recognize that mando...almost looks like a Collings with a matte finish bit with a floating type pick-up..who is playing mandolin?
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Totally underrated, but his chord voicings and compositions are exceptional. I'm not a big fan of his improv solos.
Listen to him comp for the bass solo.
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Holdsworth owns his own Universe.
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uys, you NEED to check out Matt Munisteri - a MONSTER player/musician in all respects. Listen here :
He is some kind of HIPP representative in jazz field for me (with all the pros and cons of it)))
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Originally Posted by alltunes
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Originally Posted by GuyBoden
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Originally Posted by Reg
Has anyone played or had a Supro Amulet ?
Today, 04:44 AM in Guitar, Amps & Gizmos