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  1. #1
    out there. I've tryed two which i was'nt to happy with. One was from Chordmelody.com a 4 years course, i purchased the 1st year..not much to it. I also purcashes the guitarcollege course, i did buy their therory for the road CD"S which is pretty good, but not thrilled with the books.
    Thx
    ken

  2.  

    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    There are several courses by Jamey Aebersold and I think Berklee College in Boston has courses you can take online (although they may be a little pricey)

    Quote Originally Posted by guitarplayer007
    I've tryed two which i was'nt to happy with. One was from Chordmelody.com a 4 years course, i purchased the 1st year..not much to it.
    Bear in mind that jazz is a complex subject, so many courses are going to start at square 1. This may be disappointing to someone with a more advanced understanding of theory. You might have to weed through the first year basics to get to the real meat that you're looking for.

    John

  4. #3
    I'm not really intersted in the Berklee Method, any others that you know of are well thought out and move you along on a guided path
    Thx
    ken

  5. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by guitarplayer007
    I'm not really intersted in the Berklee Method, any others that you know of are well thought out and move you along on a guided path
    Thx
    ken
    Hi ken,

    I gave you a couple of book titles on another forum..
    But the one that helped me most was the Warren Nune series. This opened the door to me, on using scales and the modes. If it got me going it will help you. As far as I know the books are still available. Just Google 'Warren Nunes' I would guess.

    Good Luck

    John

  6. #5

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    Imo nothing replaces a good teacher, especially with something as nuanced as jazz. You can go the other route, but it will take longer.

    If I were going to take the route you are describing, I would arm myself with 4 things. The Real Book, Band In A Box, a good chord book, and a good book of jazz licks.

    The rest is listening, reading, transcribing, and just a heck of a lot of time practicing.

  7. #6

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    Hi Derek,

    Thanks for your reply...

    I started to learn guitar in 1958.
    Computers? What were they?
    Band-in-a-Box? No computers so again, what was Band in a Box?
    The Real Book? Didn't come along until about 1987 in the UK and then only in printed form

    Good books on Jazz chords and licks? They weren't even known as licks. They were called riffs, lines or fill-ins.

    Backing tracks were unheard of. I had to make my own. As over-dubbing was something you couldn't do outside of a professional recording studio, I bought two second-hand, reel to reel tape recorders. I hooked them up, to make my own practice, bass and guitar backings. The only books I had to begin with were Mickey Baker's Jazz Course, the Ronnie Lee Books and the Ivor Mairants book 'Modern Chord progressions' (Much like Ted Greene's book of the same name.) All those old books I still have and they are obviously valid today. If you could buy them. I don't see anything in Ted Greene's book that isn't in the books I mention. (Well, maybe lots more chords, or to be correct inversions.) His books of 'Jazz licks' go a lot deeper of course and I bought those too when they came on the market.

    I couldn't afford a teacher. I was in the armed Forces when I began and for 10 years I didn't have much time to practice either. The only thing I had was a halfway decent guitar, patience and a fairly good ear. Plus of course I knew the melodies to lots of Standards.

    So I think I did pretty good all things being equal. I am no Joe Pass, but I can get along in pro company without trouble, even with the bad habits I can't shake now! Even so, I wish a quarter of the resources we have today, had been available to me when I was a beginner.

    Cheers.
    Happy playing
    John

  8. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chordwayze
    even with the bad habits I can't shake now!
    The one main drawback to being self-taught imo; I Feel your pain.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chordwayze
    Even so, I wish a quarter of the resources we have today, had been available to me when I was a beginner.
    Amen. It's a great time to be a young player at this, there are a lot of resources out there, although you still have to listen and transcribe like Derek said. Reading, I am convinced, is quickly becoming a lost artform, not that I approve of that, just an observation.

    Best regards
    John

  9. #8

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    How bout Play What You Hear or Guitar Made Simple by Chris Standring. I havent tried it but apparently they are good jazz courses. its at the top of the forum. maybe you should check it out

    And Wolf Marshall has a 101 Jazz Licks book if you want some licks.
    Last edited by aPAULo; 10-13-2007 at 08:40 PM.

  10. #9

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    I just realised, there were computers in 1958 of course. Trouble was in those days, the computing power on my desk right now, would have taken up three or four large sized rooms; and all that just to type 'The quick brown fox... etc..'!

    I have some great books full of 'licks', and Ted Greene's studies on scales have always been a Godsend.

    Nowadays, I just play to enjoy myself. I practice every day and I still try to learn new stuff. But Christmnas is around the corner, so I have to dust off one or two of those old Christmas standards!
    Happy Playing

    John

  11. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Curran
    you still have to listen and transcribe like Derek said. Reading, I am convinced, is quickly becoming a lost artform, not that I approve of that, just an observation.

    Best regards
    John
    Derek & John,

    I assure you, I wish I could 'sight-read'. It could be that one doesn't know the fretboard and doesn't completely understand what written music says.

    The fact is, I have my 'anchor' notes on the fretboard and I use these to find my way around, without 'looking at the frets'. However, stick music in front of me and my fingers lose their way! I can read music well enough to work out a new melody, chords and all, and then I memorise it. (Isn't this what John Williams does?) I can't read it well enough to take it in, and apply it to the fretbpoard on demand. (John Williams can!)

    I can do this okay with chord symbols, because here there isn't much to read and assimilate and I know the chords and where they are. (Most of them anyway!)

    We all manage as best we can and I comfort myself in the knowledge that Django Reinhardt could barely read or write, let alone read music. In the field of jazz, he was certainly not alone in his shortcoming with sheet music.

    Now to Chris Standring and home study.

    I have heard some of his playing and seen some of his teaching. I think a student would do well with his approach.

    I would certainly advise anyone to stay away from the adverts that proclaim: 'Amazing Secrets' that let you play like a Master in no-time-at-all!

    The secret is simple. Hard work and study and not necessarily in that order!

    Happy Playing
    John

  12. #11

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    I remember when my public school disallowed calculators when they became affordable ($75+) because they thought we would become dumb at math.

    The computer that ran my college computer department relied on cards my first year. Yeah, technology has come a long way. The original question was about a complete home study method.

    To ignore such tools today is self defeating imo. Basically, we want good time (nothing else matters if this is missing), a large vocabulary of chords, the ability to navigate the fretboard, and be able to play comfortable in any key, and play well with others (learned in kindergarten?).

    I think all of this can be accomplished by self study, but you would have to be pretty self motivated. Personally, I need the accountability lessons provide.

  13. #12

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    "If I were going to take the route you are describing, I would arm myself with 4 things. The Real Book, Band In A Box, a good chord book, and a good book of jazz licks."

    One other computer based tool I use all the time is The Amazing Slowdowner.

    It alows me to slow down those fast passages to a crawl until I can understand them and get them in my head. It alows you to set start and stop points and loop phrases. The built in eq is good for bringing the instrument your trying to hear to the front of the mix.

  14. #13
    What books do you recommend for good jazz licks?
    thx
    Ken

  15. #14

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    I have not used the Amazing Slow Downer, but it sounds like a great tool, particularly for transcribing.

    As far as licks books go, there are four that I really like and use. First is Jody Fisher's Jazz Licks Encyclopedia
    Corey Christainsen's In The Style Of series. I have Charlie Parker and Grant Green.
    Les Wise's Bebop Licks for Guitar
    Tony DeCaprio's Gateway to Improvisation - more advanced

    These all teach licks/phrases in major, minor, dominant, then ii V, minor ii V, turnarounds, and endings. It is a pretty simple thing to begin to string phrases together to form coherent musical statements.

    Much like we learn words to string together when we are learning a new language, jazz has a language to be learned. I tend to fall back on my blues/rock background when I am playing something I am not familiar with, and it really shows.

  16. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gramps
    One other computer based tool I use all the time is The Amazing Slowdowner.

    It alows me to slow down those fast passages to a crawl until I can understand them and get them in my head. It alows you to set start and stop points and loop phrases. The built in eq is good for bringing the instrument your trying to hear to the front of the mix.
    Yea i have something similar to that. its free and its called Audacity. You can download it on download.com for free. You can slow down passages w/o changing the pitch.

    Would this still be considered transcribing and if you do have a computer and a program like this, would u guys recommend using it or transcribing w/o it?

  17. #16

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    Audacity is very popular for slowing down and for recording to your PC. I use Cubase but have heard great things about Audacity and you can't beat the price.

    Transcribing is learning a piece of music and writing it down. It's a great way to become a better musician, especially if you apply what you learn to everything else you play.

    Derek, Thanks for the tips on those books. I'll check them out.

  18. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by derek
    To ignore such tools today is self defeating imo. Basically, we want good time (nothing else matters if this is missing), a large vocabulary of chords, the ability to navigate the fretboard, and be able to play comfortable in any key, and play well with others (learned in kindergarten?).

    I think all of this can be accomplished by self study, but you would have to be pretty self motivated. Personally, I need the accountability lessons provide.
    Derek,

    I never suggested I would ignore these 'tools'. I don't ignore anything new if it is relative to me and what I need to do. I.e. if it is practical and does what it 'says on the tin'. (Yes I do have Band-in-a-box, electronic tuners, books of scales and chords etc. and I use them.)

    I merely wanted to point out that when I began playing guitar we didn't have these tools and aids. If we had, then I would have learned much of what I now know, much sooner.

    I am 68 years old now and as I said, I began playing in the fifties. Believe me I am still playing.

    I should also mention Joe Pass. From what I read and hear, he didn't have much in the way of formal training. He readily admitted, he played what he heard, and related that he was instructed by his father to sit and listen to these tunes on the radio, so he could learn them. Joe decided to commit entirely to a career in music. I didn't, but I daresay he learned from others. Again, like me he didn't have these modern aids to learning.

    Is that dedication, commitment and motivation enough?

    Happy Playing and take care.

    John

  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by guitarplayer007
    What books do you recommend for good jazz licks?
    thx
    Ken
    If you read music, then any of George Van Eps's books are first class.
    But it is all in notation, and includes reams on Fingerstyle Jazz.

    Eps was 'Father of the Lap-Piano', and few players rate with him in that department. Chet Atkins of course, who could play most styles. Joe Pass, Martin Taylor, Howard Morgen, and of course Lenny Breau. Mark Knopfler is close up there too for sheer musical ability. There are others, but these are my favourites and of course, that is only my opinion.

    Happy Fretting
    John

  20. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by aPAULo
    Yea i have something similar to that. its free and its called Audacity. You can download it on download.com for free.
    Cool! Gonna download it. Thanks aPAULo.

    Quote Originally Posted by aPAULo
    Would this still be considered transcribing and if you do have a computer and a program like this, would u guys recommend using it or transcribing w/o it?
    There's nothing wrong with slowing the tunes down, I used to use a tape recorder. But it still requires that you use you ears to find the notes and that's the important part.

    john

  21. #20

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    [quote=Chordwayze;3455]Derek,

    I never suggested I would ignore these 'tools'. I don't ignore anything new if it is relative to me and what I need to do. I.e. if it is practical and does what it 'says on the tin'. (Yes I do have Band-in-a-box, electronic tuners, books of scales and chords etc. and I use them.)

    I wasn't suggesting you were saying to ignore this stuff. Sorry if I came across that way. So many of the guys we admire, like Joe Pass, didn't have these tools, and my point was, if they did, would they ignore them? I doubt it.

    Yeah, I have 4 (I think) teaching vids of Joe Pass, and he comes across as a bit of a hayseed when it comes to theory. However, in practice, he used all sort of things that he didn't seem to have language for. My favorite player.

  22. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by derek
    However, in practice, he used all sort of things that he didn't seem to have language for. My favorite player.
    I've often noticed that players who are really great at communicating through their instruments seem to struggle at communicating verbally. Wonder if there's a connection?....

    john

  23. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chordwayze
    However, stick music in front of me and my fingers lose their way!
    I would not feel so all alone. There's an old music biz joke that goes like this:

    Q: How do you get a guitar player to turn down?

    A: Put a chart in front of him.



    john