Re: Practising Chords

[Exousia87]

Hi,

I've been to 3 jazz lessons and these are some examples of a maj7 chords I learn.

eg. Cmaj7
(1)

X||---|---|---|---|---|
..|| R |---|---|---|---|
..||---|---|---| 7 |---|
..||---| 3 |---|---|---|
X||---|---|---|---|---|
..||---|---| 5 |---|---|

(3)
5th Fr.
X|---|---|---|---|---|
..| 3 |---|---|---|---|
..| R |---|---|---|---|
..| 5 |---|---|---|---|
X|---|---|---|---|---|
..|---|---| 7 |---|---|

(5)
8th Fr.
X|---|---|---|---|---|
..| 5 |---|---|---|---|
..|---| 3 |---|---|---|
..|---| 7 |---|---|---|
X|---|---|---|---|---|
..| R |---|---|---|---|

(7)
10th Fr.
X|---|---|---|---|---|
..|---|---| 7 |---|---|
..|---|---| 5 |---|---|
..| R |---|---|---|---|
X|---|---|---|---|---|
..|---|---| 3 |---|---|


They are all Cmaj7 chords of different inversions as they moved down (--->) along the fretboard.

There are also dominant 7, min7, m7b5 and Dim7 chords of the same type. I was given the task to practice in a Cycle of Fifths pattern at a steady tempo in Freddie Green quarter note swing style. An example will be this:

eg.
l F7 l Bbm7 l Eb7 l Abm7 l-------l (3) l (7) l (3) l (7) l
l Db7 l Gbm7 l B7 l Em7 l--------l (3) l (7) l (3) l (7) l
l A7 l Dm7 l G7 l Cm7 l-----------l (7) l (3) l (7) l (3) l

I've listed this exercise particularly as I find that from A7 to Cm7, the chord fingerings gets a little difficult to go about changing smoothly. Immediately, my "common sense" will think that, ok, lets practise A7 to Cm7 chord changes smoothly. After practicing for some time, I tried challenging myself to go about a "l Am7 l Dm7 l Gm7 l Cm7 l" way. But my muscle memory is too used to the original progression and i couldn't go about it smoothly for the sudden change.

I humbly seek anyone in this forum for help so that i could come up with a practice method where i can change from any of the maj7, dominant 7, min7 , m7b5 and Dim7 chords smoothly. Additionally, I would like to receive any comments or ideas on what I should focus on while playing the chords. Thank You.

[I've been thinking about the "1, 2, 3, 4" finger independence exercise kind of approach to work on the chords. Where I will be playing the different permutations of changes from one chord to another. Do you think it will work in the long term? Thank you.]

[srs]

i think you just have to put in the time and energy and do it. be inquisitive and come at it with numerous stratagies. there isn't one and only one correct way, and once you've mastered it it will be second nature. of course the next hurdle awaits. you have to enjoy the journey.

[Reg]

Are you aware of this concept of learning this set of inversions... same set of strings. I would think you would start on the root position chord first. Have you already learned the more used sets, or is this where your starting? This set of inversion, while part of the great journey of fret board awareness, are rarely used except in solo, duo or trio playing, generally. And when used, most would muffle the low note, the more muffled the worse the interval created with root of actual chord. Anyway, simply be aware of notes of chord your playing and how there stacked, always start from root position, helps train ear to hear more clearly of what your playing... in your example there all Cmaj7 chords, hear them as that. So play your chord progressions and simple hear the actual chord, or harmonic area. All your doing is arranging the notes to fit style of comping. The lead note is always most important, next the bottom and then the inner voices. Eventually when you comp, you simply play lead lines voiced below... at least that's how many do... Best Reg

[rabbit]

Just to encourage, it can take me a long time to learn
a new chord 'grip' or even a new combination of old ones.

Practice them slowly, performing them as perfectly as possible
(don't get an ulcer over this) and speeding up only gradually
so as not to practice mistakes.

Also, you'll be able to move all of those pitches (the examples you provided)
from the sixth string to the first for a new set to learn & use.

[JohnW400]

Start closest to the nut and look for the common tones between the changes

ex.

Dmi7 to G7 to Cma7 to A7 would be

5x353x
3x343x
3x241x
3x222x

Look at all the common vocies between the voices

In the exact Cmi7 to A7 both share G as the common tone

3x131 to 3x222x

[FatJeff]

It takes time and repetition. Simple as that. I agree that some grips are more easily usable than others, but you should know them all for completion's sake, even if you don't use them all the time.

You will also find as you go along this road that some of the harder ones to finger suddenly become the easier ones when you convert them to 9ths (raise the root note 2 frets and you'll see what I mean).

[Exousia87]

Hi all, Thank you for your encouragement and helpful tips.

To Reg: Yep this is my starting set of chords. Didn't know that these chords are rarely used though. These exercises did help me to enhance my fretboard awareness as I am weak in that.

With regards to this:

The lead note is always most important, next the bottom and then the inner voices.

I've heard about lead note but I ain't familiar with the concept yet. I think its important that I analyze the chords this way..Hmm..do you have any idea where I could find information on that??

To Rabbit:

Also, you'll be able to move all of those pitches (the examples you provided)
from the sixth string to the first for a new set to learn & use

.

Does it mean that the current chord pattern given I could move them down from the 6th string to the 1st? Currently what I do know is by moving towards the guitar body along the fretboard, I can find the inversions of the original chords. Do you mean that by moving the chords down the string from the 6th string to the 1st string I can find different chord patterns again??

To JohnW400:

Thank you for the informative exercise. I will give these common chord tones changes analyzing a shot.

To srs & FatJeff:

Thank you for your comments and encouragement.

[rabbit]

Sorry, Exo, I wasn't careful enough to be clear.

I meant that you could use the note appearing on the first
(high 'E') string instead on the sixth (low 'E'.)

Altering the examples you've given
(read as low 'E' string to high 'E' string, left to right):

xx2413
xx5557
xx9988
xx10-12-12-12

I often look at the top four strings as a separate guitar.
Lotsa chords there, especially when you start dropping roots & fifths,
but that is for later. Good luck!

[Exousia87]

Ah...I see, I get what you mean now rabbit... Thank you.

[SwingSwangSwung]

Jump to 2:58 on this video for a good technique on mastering awkward chord changes....

[wolflen]

in learning the inversions of 4 note chords..re-visit basic triads..each set of 3 strings...note that within a 4-5 fret reach you can find the I IV & V chord of any key in different inversions .. same for the ii ii & vi chords...practice finding the same inversion shapes on different sets of strings ... try that in as many keys as you can...they try playing the entrie scale in triads using this method...

G-xxx433 C-xxx553 D-xxx232
G-xx543x C-xx555x D-xx423x
etc
you can use any chord forms within the fret range ... you begin to see not just one inversion of a chord but the entire scale in a 4-5 fret space...expanding this approach to 4 note chords ... after this sinks in...yes it will take some time...you will see that you have access to several keys in 4 note chords within any 4-5 fret reach...

if you get to watch joe pass or ted greene vids..they play with minimal finger movement in some passages..yet they are playing many different chords in a very limited fret area...

play well

wolf

[nic]

As mentioned it's really a matter of a lot of practice. I read about one tip that really helps. "Hover all your fingers over the notes and press them all down at once." Do this very slowly at first.

Also, always look for a finger that stays on the same string as you change chords. If you can just slide the finger to the new fret without lifting it then the other fingers find their new spot quickly.

[SteveCarter]

Here's an exercise I came up with for my students at Berklee, more than 30 years ago. I still use this exercise my self.

Use the new voicing that is giving you trouble, and any other chord. For this example I'll just call them A and B.

Set a VERY slow tempo. One beat one play chord A. Immediately lift your fingers and start setting up chord B. Wait for beat 1 of the next measure. Play chord B and immediately lift your fingers and start setting up chord B. By "setting up" I mean positioning your fingers over the strings.

So you play:
A rest rest rest B rest rest rest A rest rest rest etc.
Think of the chord as a stacatto quarter not followed by four quarter rests.

Now play A on beat one, B on beat three. Once that is good, try to play a chord on every beat: A B A B A B etc.

Chances are that when you pick the tempo, you'll be able to play the chords on beat one easily -- maybe even get bored waiting for the next downbeat. But by the time you get to quarter notes, you'll be scuffling, missing some finger changes. That just means you have to slow down the tempo and start again.

The important part is to *immediately* start setting up the next chord.

Steve

[HD280]

i agree...

[docbop]

Here's an exercise I came up with for my students at Berklee, more than 30 years ago. I still use this exercise my self.

Use the new voicing that is giving you trouble, and any other chord. For this example I'll just call them A and B.

Set a VERY slow tempo. One beat one play chord A. Immediately lift your fingers and start setting up chord B. Wait for beat 1 of the next measure. Play chord B and immediately lift your fingers and start setting up chord B. By "setting up" I mean positioning your fingers over the strings.

So you play:
A rest rest rest B rest rest rest A rest rest rest etc.
Think of the chord as a stacatto quarter not followed by four quarter rests.

Now play A on beat one, B on beat three. Once that is good, try to play a chord on every beat: A B A B A B etc.

Chances are that when you pick the tempo, you'll be able to play the chords on beat one easily -- maybe even get bored waiting for the next downbeat. But by the time you get to quarter notes, you'll be scuffling, missing some finger changes. That just means you have to slow down the tempo and start again.

The important part is to *immediately* start setting up the next chord.

Steve

I've heard of something called the Chord Lab Berklee guitar student have to do is this it or part of it. What types of things are done in the Chord Lab?

[SteveCarter]

I've heard of something called the Chord Lab Berklee guitar student have to do is this it or part of it. What types of things are done in the Chord Lab?

These classes used the Chord Lab Workbooks written by William G. Leavitt. There were exercises applying the chord "forms" (Leavitt's term) that were presented in Volumes 1 and 2 of his method books. There were eight students in each class, and they would just play through these exercises. Things like I-#1diminished-ii-V-I in all keys. The exercises were helpful for laying down the foundation of chord vocabulary, but pretty dull. I'd usually supplement, in my classes, with lead sheets to jazz and pop tunes, and show how to apply the voicings.

There were mid-term and final exams. I've provided a couple of these exams on the Guitar Lessons page on my web site. There are some chord exercises on that page as well, similar to what we did in Chord Lab.

Steve

[docbop]

Thank you Steve for the explanation and looking at the example on your website it's like stuff I worked on with Ted Greene, know voicings by what note is on top.

Great website.

[montes707]

Mr. Carter...thank you for the tips. So just to clarify how to approach them, you would play one chord staccato for one beat at a very slow tempo >>> rest for 3 (whilst getting the next chord ready) >>> play the next chord and repeat; and when you get comfortable you decrease the amount of rest time (e.g. instead of 3 beats of rest or 1 chord = a whole note, you could go 1 beat of rest or 1 chord = a half note >>> until you get to the point that you can play the chords at 1 chord per beat; and then at that point you could finally increase the tempo accordingly and start the process again). Does that sound about right to you?

[SteveCarter]

Mr. Carter...thank you for the tips. So just to clarify how to approach them, you would play one chord staccato for one beat at a very slow tempo >>> rest for 3 (whilst getting the next chord ready) >>> play the next chord and repeat; and when you get comfortable you decrease the amount of rest time (e.g. instead of 3 beats of rest or 1 chord = a whole note, you could go 1 beat of rest or 1 chord = a half note >>> until you get to the point that you can play the chords at 1 chord per beat; and then at that point you could finally increase the tempo accordingly and start the process again). Does that sound about right to you?

That's it.
Here it is in notation:


Hope that helps.

Steve

[montes707]

Thank you for the reply. I'm going to start applying these tips to the chord system JohnW400 has previously posted.

[pierre richard]

learn the theory of chord construction and inversions up and down the neck using the 1st string as the top tone of the chord....then the second string...etc..

play through the cycle of fourths and fifths to learn them a little quicker..not just c,c#,d,eb...etc..

time on the instrument is the path to follow...pierre