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  1. #51

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    Yes, that's the slim volume he wrote before the Harmonic Mechanisms. The rhythm guitarist with Chic says he worked a lot with that book. It has wider applications than jazz.

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop View Post
    Yes, that's the slim volume he wrote before the Harmonic Mechanisms. The rhythm guitarist with Chic says he worked a lot with that book. It has wider applications than jazz.
    While I studied with Ted Greene, he was studying with GVE..Ted said..look triads or any chord actually are just frozen moving voices..and indeed they are..
    play well ...
    wolf

  4. #53
    Okay, I'm halfway through Harmonic minor scales. And while practicing I notice that I don't actually memorize the function of the triad (Dm, C dim, Aaug etc), however it's writter above the triad, so I think it's there for some reason. Should a student memorize the names of these functions a well? I also noticed that it's easy to deduce the function from the top note - it the top note is D then it's D triad.

  5. #54

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    I think you should memorise everything - positions, fingering, notes, function. I said above, for the major keys I find it helpful to remember:

    Major

    minor-minor

    Major-Major

    minor-diminished

    But knowing which is the vi chord, or the ii chord, etc, is also important.

  6. #55
    Hey guys,
    I've come back from 2-weeks holiday, where I didn't have a guitar to practice. But I didn't waste my time there. I did a lot of vizualiation stuff. When I was relaxing I vizualized the fingerboard and "played" the triads up and down the neck. While I played the triad I also named the notes, the triad and the step, like this: (in C major scale) f,a,d - d minor - 2nd step, g,b,e - e minor - 3rd step etc.
    It helped me not forget what I practiced at home, and also helped memorize things like names of triads and steps. By the way, in his interview George said that he vizualized a lot.
    Now I'm back and ready to continue my study of Harmonic Mechanisms.

  7. #56

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    Let us know if the visualization stuff worked.
    "Ahhh - those Jazz guys are just makin' that stuff up!" - Homer Simpson

    "Anyone who understands Jazz knows that you can't understand it. It's too complicated. That's what's so simple about it." - Yogi Berra

  8. #57
    Hey guys,
    I'm happy to let you know that I finished going through Harmonic minor scales in first inversions. Some things start to clear up. Visualization stuff actually worked, like I said in the previous post. The only thing when I visualize the scale I don't use the string set transfer as in the book, I move up the neck from the lowest note to the highest on 4/3, then again from the lowest to the highest on 3/3, then the same on 2/3 and finally on 1/3. It takes longer than usual playing exercise but helps memorize the neck better.
    Cheeeers!

  9. #58

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    Hello,

    I have been working a little bit on georges van eps harmonic mechanisms for guitar, and I am trying to figure out why the open triads he uses in the book are not the regular open triads. Is it just to work something unusual with big strings skippings?

    And also why the regular open triads positions are missing, it seems weird in such an exhaustive book...

  10. #59
    Hey guys,
    It's been a while since my last post, and you probably thought that I gave up on Harmonic Mechanisms, like most people do. But I didn't. I continue working with Harmonic Mechanisms and I am very happy that didn't give up. I've progressed slow in the last few months, right now I'm finishing second inversion triads in melodic minor. I notice how I start recognizing triad names when I play them. Also I notice how my technique improves and how I started utilizing different triads over the same bass note in my regular playing.
    How have you guys been doing?

  11. #60

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    Quote Originally Posted by jetaman View Post
    Hey guys,
    It's been a while since my last post, and you probably thought that I gave up on Harmonic Mechanisms, like most people do. But I didn't. I continue working with Harmonic Mechanisms and I am very happy that didn't give up. I've progressed slow in the last few months, right now I'm finishing second inversion triads in melodic minor. I notice how I start recognizing triad names when I play them. Also I notice how my technique improves and how I started utilizing different triads over the same bass note in my regular playing.
    How have you guys been doing?
    when you begin to move the voices in each "chord shape" and see how they develope (morph) into other "chords" thus creating both harmonic AND melodic movement..you then have many "mini" progressions that revolve around each chord you play..see Ted Greens' vids and web site (he studied with GVE) this type of playing is close to "classical" guitar playing technique applied to jazz - standards and pop tunes -

    use some of the chord forms from the mel minor in a minor blues and see what developes..
    play well ...
    wolf

  12. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by wolflen View Post
    when you begin to move the voices in each "chord shape" and see how they develope (morph) into other "chords" thus creating both harmonic AND melodic movement..you then have many "mini" progressions that revolve around each chord you play..see Ted Greens' vids and web site (he studied with GVE) this type of playing is close to "classical" guitar playing technique applied to jazz - standards and pop tunes - use some of the chord forms from the mel minor in a minor blues and see what developes..
    Thanks, with every exercise behind I start to see more and more. I've heard about Ted Greene a while ago, and I even tried to study some of his materials. I know that he studied with George. That's why I decide to study Harmonic Mechanisms first before going any further.I don't know if it's been mentioned before but while watching Ted Greene's video on Baroque Improv part 2, in 7:16 he says to Steve Herberman: "You should make sure that you have all your harmonized scales together. You can have that if you've gone through George's books". So I'm pretty sure that by George's Books he means Harmonic Mechanisms, and Steve is known for having worked with these books.I know that Steve visited this thread, so, Steve if you still visit this forum can you confirm this?
    Update on HM: finished all scales for Second Inversion. Start Root triads, page 40.

  13. #62

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    After almost 40 years of studying... I know so little about the guitar. Jeez. Ted was amazing.
    Beauty is as close to terror as we can well endure. -Rainer Maria Rilke

  14. #63

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    Is this topic still alive? I am thinking creating a youtube channel and recording all exercises to motivate myself and others to study. Do you think I would have copyright issues? And do you think this could be a good ideia?

  15. #64
    Hey,
    Yes the topic is alive. I post my progress now and then. It's a good idea to make a channel. I had a similar idea but lack the time. I don't think you will have copyright issues.

    ????????? ??? ???? SM-J730FM, ?????????????? Tapatalk

  16. #65

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    Not at all meaning to burst you bubble, Tgv10, but I've recorded 30 videos of them already: GVEps – ArchtopGuitar.net

    But I don't doubt for a second that you would do them very differently, and it's always good to hear different approaches, understandings, and interpretations. I look forward to seeing what you do.

  17. #66

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    Hello Jetman would be interest if you put some videos. I think there are few videos on the internet about these books. Hello Rob I've seen some of your videos on youtube, you are the only one who has videos about the books and inspired me to make some videos. Keep posting Rob.
    My goal was to record the exercises as they are and maybe later make a mix of everything. Maybe I will get some suggestions and come up with new ideas. I have already seen an interesting ideiain this topic which is to do all exercises in the same key. My main goal is to apply the exercises to songs like Kurt Rosenwinkel, Jonathan Kreisberg, Joe Pass and others. My channel will be my motivation and what will force me not to give up. It would be easier if there were more videos from this book and from others.It won't be easy but I will try to record.
    It won't be easy but I will try to recordIt won't be easy but I will try to record

  18. #67

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    I'm not sure this early book of GVE will give you much to play with in the music of Rosenwinkel, etc. The exercises are more for swing-style chord soloing, Alan Reuss style, maybe. GVE's three Harmonic Mechanisms books will furnish you a lot more ideas for advanced playing - see the work of Steve Herberman for a modern take on GVE. But I'd be absolutely delighted if you prove me wrong :-)

  19. #68

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    Re-reading a few of the posts above, we seem to be talking about different books: the slim Guitar Method versus the three-volume Harmonic Mechanisms. I was talking latterly about the former book. Sorry if I set us at cross purposes. I now think you mean to record the exercises from the three-volume Harmonic mechanisms. If that's the case, I wish you all the best! That's a tall mountain which few manage to climb to the summit. But it's doable, so get stuck in!

  20. #69

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    Yes, I'm talking about the three volumes of harmonic mechanisms. It won't be easy and I don't have lot of time to practice but I will see how far I can go. There is so little information about them and I think they should have a lot of important information. It take a lot of time but I believe It will be worth It.

  21. #70

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    Where will you start? GVE said they are not to be started at Page 1, but just jump in to things you find interesting.

  22. #71

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop View Post
    Where will you start? GVE said they are not to be started at Page 1, but just jump in to things you find interesting.
    Somebody in another thread made this recommendation :
    Read the explanatory info - pages 1 - 28. Then work through pages 29 - 63 before going on to the other volumes.
    That is my plan if I ever get started.
    There's no money above the fifth fret.

  23. #72

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    I am thinking of doing the exercises in the same key. I had the opportunity a few years ago to do the first exercises in a row and could not absorb anything. If I do one key will help me gain some facility in the key and will repeat the exercises in the other keys later which I think is much better. The great purpose of the book is not to memorize the exercises but to memorize the triads and to be able to apply them in various ways, horizontal, vertical, diagonal, all inversions, open triads, closed triads. Make music with the information. The hard part is being able to apply them in various keys with facility. If all the songs were in C major was not difficult, the problem is that we have few bars a ii-V-I in C major or other keys, and it changes to a melodic or harmonic scale or maybe just a chord and is difficult to master everything. Summing up after understanding the exercises in the same key and know which notes are part of the others keys is all easier. After doing some exercises in C major just change a note and we have F major, another note and Bb major and so on. With time we begin to dominate the other keys. I'm still thinking if I include the natural minor, harmonic minor and melodic minor scales with the major scale. I have to try it to see what is better for me. The most important thing is to make music with the little we know, we only really learn when we start trying to improvise with what we learn instead of waiting to know a lot, because we will forget some things if we do not use the information.

  24. #73

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    Work in progress, I will record all the triads in the first inversion in all major keys.

  25. #74

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    Read up on the way GVE discusses moving fingerings from one chord to the next. It improves efficiency (speaking as someone who's gotten through about two pages of exercises). There are some videos of GVE in action to see how he applied this in practice.

    (this one keeps cutting away annoyingly but has some good shots of his hands).

    and other videos: george van eps - YouTube
    Beauty is as close to terror as we can well endure. -Rainer Maria Rilke

  26. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Tgv10 View Post

    Work in progress, I will record all the triads in the first inversion in all major keys.
    Hey,
    Why are you playing with a pick? I believe it's supposed to be played with fingers.

  27. #76

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    I have to read again the first few pages of the book to see what GVE says about finger movement, I read the first few pages a few years ago. I'd rather play with the pick, I think it's optional, watch Kurt Rosenwinkel improvising on the tune Reflection.


  28. #77

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    Note that Van Eps is tuned down a full step, which was a wise move given the ungainly monstrosity that was the Gretsch 7-string.