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  1. #1

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    I got some weird tips from an old jazz pro, can anyone help me sort this out?

    I went to an open jam, it's run by a guitar player who has been a pro for decades and played with lots of big names. The reason I went to is to improve my playing. Specifically, I would like to be able to read a chord chart for songs I don't know (or don't know well) and play decently well in a high pressure situation. I already am booking gigs and doing just fine at my gigs, but I want to be able to take sideman gigs where they throw tunes at you, and this is my path to getting there. I've been working on it for a few months now, and I am getting pretty good at taking a tune I don't know well, playing good comp chords for it, and playing a solo that people enjoy.

    I know the sound of most jazz tunes, I have listened to this stuff for decades on the radio. But that doesn't mean I know how to play them.

    OK so I get up there and I'm setting up my stand and IrealPro. The guy running the jam gets on the mic and says something about how you shouldn't be reading these tunes, they should already be in you. So I put the stand aside and played without it. Hey it's his jam so I want to be respectful. The horn players called a tune I didn't know, but it was rhythm changes. I did take a quick look at the chart before they started to see if there's any curve balls, but then I put it behind me so I was not reading during the song.

    It went fine, I had a good solo and some good comping. The old pro guy comes back and says "well that was really nice, you sound good." And I said thanks and sorry for the charts at your jam, I'm just trying to work on my reading. He says that's not reading, it's just chords, reading is the little black dots with the squiggly lines. I figured this guy is better than me, I'll just let that condescending remark go and see if I can get any useful tips out of him.

    I told him I can read, i generally use it for transcribing and I showed him some transcriptions I'm working on. But I'm trying to read songs I don't know under pressure.

    His advice was "if you don't know the song don't play."
    Which is odd to me because I literally just played a song I don't know and he said it sounded good.
    Also I wasn't about to drive an hour each way just to sit there and not play when I know with about 75% certainty that I can get through most rhythm changes type tunes.

    Next piece of advice on transcribing- "dont transcribe full songs, just take a few measures that you like."
    This is useful and I will try it. People have told me this before.
    Usually I transcribe 32 bars or so, it has been a huge help in my playing. Possibly the greatest tool I have. I would be a bit hesitant to stop this altogether.

    Next tip was "When are you ever gonna need to read? Benson didn't read....etc. Use your practice time carefully."
    Ok good tip, I will take that intro consideration.

    "Don't use charts, this music should be in you."
    This one I really think is bullcrap. If I knew 1200 standards by heart I would not be at an open jam, I'd be playing a paying gig somewhere. I didn't go to music school and do not have the luxury of learning 1200 standards for a genre of music that will never be earning me a living. There has to be an on-ramp for intermediate players to get to the next level, and I think charts are useful for that.

    I told him I transcribe George Benson and Grant and it's been very helpful. He says "I know George Benson, I used to hang out at his house for weeks at a time and get tips from him."
    OK so that's cool and all, but not gonna help me get to the next level. Those of use who live in the real world and are not room mates with George Benson might benefit from transcribing a bit.

    But still, I wanted to show respect and see if he had anything useful. So we sat down and he critiqued a few of the other players and talked about "honest playing." This was pretty useful because I could pick up on it. On the way home I did re-listen to one of my gigs and see if it sounds honest. This was useful and worth the effort of listening to this guy clown me me in front of an audience about reading charts.

    Next tip was "try to get the energy of the room, when I'm playing I'm pulling notes out of the air."
    Master level guys really are full of bad advice and it's stuff like this that makes jazz hard to learn. I'm trying to play rhythm changes and not screw up the form. If I'm not careful I could easily skip an A section and throw off the whole band when there's 3 A sections in a row. That's where my head is at. I gotta stay humble cause I'm not a great player. I need to try hard and focus to avoid mistakes. It would be nice to be pulling notes out of the air and have hundreds of standards memorized, but again, if that was the case I wouldn't be playing for free at an open jam on a Monday night.

    These old master level guys try to say a bunch of Yoda stuff to everyone else at open jam, what's up with this? I think they're just feeding their own ego. It's not good teaching.

    In any event I was grateful that he took the time to attempt to teach me something, I just need some help defragging it and getting the most I can out of it.

    One thing I know for sure is I'm not giving up my charts next time. That is my elevator to the next level and I'm not letting people take away my learning tools with their unrealistic ideas. I'm gonna start challenging these guys and if they kick me out of the jam that is fine with me. I think that might be the ultimate lesson in this whole thing. The Real Book and IrealPro have taken me from someone who just plays in my living room all the way to playing 9 paying gigs last month. I've played some really excellent solos over songs I don't know at jam sessions while using charts, some of the best stuff I've ever played. I use Ireal, the Real Book, Drum Genius, and Jamey Ambersol backing tracks for practicing and I am NOT giving them up to start "pulling notes out of the air." Am I wrong here? I am open to some outside opinions.

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  3. #2

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    Every jam has different rules. That said, the history of this music is that the pros would jam after hours and deliberately try to throw off people who couldn't keep up. This is in the 40s so they didn't have sheet music or apps obviously. They combined challenging harmonies/chord changes with extreme fast or slow tempos, and the rhythm section deliberately avoided playing "rhythm". That's a gross simplification, but that is essentially the history of jazz. As far as I can tell, some jams still run on a variation of these parameters, some don't.

  4. #3

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    There's a scenario that goes like this. To be a jazz musician you need to know several hundred, or more, tunes which you can play instantly in any key. You go to a jam or gig and the leader calls out those tunes and you play them. If you don't know one, you figure it out on the fly.

    There are a couple of problems with that scenario. One is that, at least in my experience, those casual gigs are not all that common. People don't want to hear old standards all that much. The people I know who play them often have them arranged -- so it's reading. Even the musicians may be tired of playing that stuff. When they do happen, there may well be a band book, with a copy for each player.

    Trying to do a no-chart gig with more modern tunes is something for the tunehounds (who learn every new song as it comes out and never forget one) and most people can't do that.

    What I see is that most casuals do use some charts.

    Jams may be run without charts, because there's a tradition that says they should and it keeps some of the weaker players out.

    But, what's it to him if you pull out IRealPro - if you can play well enough?

    I recall a jam where a well known player, a pianist, decided that the jam needed a leader, which it didn't, and that it should be him. Somebody offered the use of a book (6 copies of the same book, which would have been enough) and the self-appointed "leader" yelled out "No books!" and then called all the tunes. He'd whisper some changes to the bassist (a terrific musician with big ears) and let everybody else fend for themselves. Some of the tunes were complicated and unfamiliar. My thought: if you're the one yelling "no books" you shouldn't be the one calling the tunes. But, that's jams. Sometimes done sensitively and courteously, but not always.

  5. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by JazzIsGood
    I got some weird tips from an old jazz pro, can anyone help me sort this out?
    You've already done it yourself:

    These old master level guys try to say a bunch of Yoda stuff to everyone else at open jam, what's up with this? I think they're just feeding their own ego. It's not good teaching.
    If you don't mind a piece of advice from me: Trust your own judgement and don't waste time on time-wasters.

  6. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by oldHaus
    Every jam has different rules. That said, the history of this music is that the pros would jam after hours and deliberately try to throw off people who couldn't keep up. This is in the 40s so they didn't have sheet music or apps obviously. They combined challenging harmonies/chord changes with extreme fast or slow tempos, and the rhythm section deliberately avoided playing "rhythm". That's a gross simplification, but that is essentially the history of jazz. As far as I can tell, some jams still run on a variation of these parameters, some don't.
    I think you are right this is the tradition from a long time ago. I have not encountered this scenario myself. Every jam I've been to has a few students, people of various skill levels, and rarely do top guys play jam sessions. I think now it's looked upon as something that is more for students or hobbyists. This same old pro recently told a friend of mine who is a very good player "you shouldn't be playing jam sessions so often, you're ruining your brand. People are not gonna call you for real gigs." The closest thing I've seen is "house band" type jams where they have a few pros who sit in on bass or drums just in case no one shows up that plays those intsruments.

    I guess the bottom line is that things have really changed, it's hard to know what you're walking into. The lines are kinda grey now. I will take this as an opportunity to choose my own destiny and do things my way whenever possible.

  7. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by JazzIsGood
    This same old pro recently told a friend of mine who is a very good player "you shouldn't be playing jam sessions so often, you're ruining your brand. People are not gonna call you for real gigs."
    I'm wondering how this is supposed to work. Do pros go to sessions to check who's playing there so they'll know not to call them? Or do they have spy cameras there?

    Quote Originally Posted by JazzIsGood
    I will take this as an opportunity to choose my own destiny and do things my way whenever possible.
    That's what I do. Regrets? I've had a few.

  8. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar

    Jams may be run without charts, because there's a tradition that says they should and it keeps some of the weaker players out.

    But, what's it to him if you pull out IRealPro - if you can play well enough?

    I recall a jam where a well known player, a pianist, decided that the jam needed a leader, which it didn't, and that it should be him. Somebody offered the use of a book (6 copies of the same book, which would have been enough) and the self-appointed "leader" yelled out "No books!" and then called all the tunes. He'd whisper some changes to the bassist (a terrific musician with big ears) and let everybody else fend for themselves. Some of the tunes were complicated and unfamiliar. My thought: if you're the one yelling "no books" you shouldn't be the one calling the tunes. But, that's jams. Sometimes done sensitively and courteously, but not always.
    I think you may have solved this mystery for me, when you said the intention is to keep the weaker players out.

    I can see the point here, as jamming with all weak players is a bad vibe. Chances are the weaker players will want charts and the stronger players (on average) will be OK without charts. In my case those rules don't really apply but it's probably a reasonable assumption.

    That second story about the guy who yelled "no books" gets back to my point about ego. Some people play jazz to feed their ego. Maybe we all have a little of that myself included. It's nice when organizers of jam sessions can keep it in check. Most of the time it's enjoyable to go even if the players are not as good.

  9. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Laurence Finston
    I'm wondering how this is supposed to work. Do pros go to sessions to check who's playing there so they'll know not to call them? Or do they have spy cameras there?



    That's what I do. Regrets? I've had a few.
    Ya know the more we examine these ideas, the more they fall apart.

  10. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by JazzIsGood
    I can see the point here, as jamming with all weak players is a bad vibe.
    I love beginners. A beginner is a person who doesn't think he or she knows everything already and is willing to learn. You can always tell the really good people in a situation where there are teachers and learners because they're the ones who take the time to help the beginners. "Master" isn't really a good term, a real "master" is someone who keeps the spirit of being a beginner his or her whole life.

    Sessions aren't my thing.

  11. #10

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    this advice he gave you :

    "if you don't know the song don't play."

    this advice sounds goods according to me.

    It's a jam, everything can happen so the minima is that every player knows the tune they are playing cause if everything can happen, I prefer to limit the risk to fail while playing for an audience.

  12. #11

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    Everyone has their idiosyncrasy's.

    If you hung out with..... (any big name pro player)..... they might give you some odd sounding (to you) advice. They may know what works for them - but that data may not seem to useful to you.

    You gotta do you.

    Then there's the entire thing of a lot of great players are not very good at explaining what they do. Or at least in technical type terms....... so they pull notes out of the air, cuz the energy is groovy tonight.

  13. #12

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    A while back I moved from Boston, a big jazz town and full of progressive and harmonically sophisticated players and relocated to Philly where there was a mindset steeped in bebop. There were a lot of old timers who played with the cats of the era. They set the tone at the jams.
    I never saw books out, except once. A kid from Jersey came to the bandstand. 'brought out his real book and when they called a tune, he flipped to the page and played fine, certainly played the changes well. But he felt like he was playing from a book and that dimensionless playing was contageous. His time didn't have the same breath, swing and phrasing that kinda defined the vibe of the jam. They were polite to him but you could tell they were more relaxed (grateful?) when he left the stand. I felt they felt he was playing the changes, but not the music...if I might clumsily describe it as such.
    I enjoyed playing with those guys. It was scary because they played so WELL, but I realized it wasn't playing well but comfortably. THAT was what I'd come to Philly to learn. I didn't know how but I persisted.
    One time they called a tune and I politely nodded, thanked them and signaled I'd sit this one out; I didn't know the tune. They all said "Stay where you are. You know this. There's nothing new here you haven't played. Just listen and play." Well the first couple choruses were scary. I comped sparsely (there was an organ/keys player who was the leader of the jam) and identified sections that had a twist...tried to decode them and marked those areas as "danger zones" and when it was my turn to solo, I was strong where I was secure, shaky and spacious but swinging where I couldn't figure it out. I identified some notes that worked, worked around them and got through it. BUT I learned tons about the structure of that tune and how to play the band, and the room, and my ear, without looking at a safety net.

    I changed my entire attitude that day. So glad the cats were supportive. That's the tradition that brought me up.

  14. #13

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    Thank you for sharing your stories. I’m very interested in jam sessions in various contexts.

    I’m in Japan, and what the OP described is unusual, even rude. But it does depend on who is there and what is the culture, context or ecology of the session. So, an after hours jam session for pros in Tokyo is quite different than sessions in some of the smaller regional cities.

    Where I live, a small city in Western Japan, there are 4-5 places within about a half hour drive that hold regular jazz jam sessions, from once a week to once or twice a month. Some are mom and pop shops and some are venues on the touring circuit for regional musicians. All are pay to play, ranging from 500-2000JPY including drinks. Most are at night, though a few are daytime on the weekends.

    Participants are primarily amateurs and hobbyists, sometimes students, and even a few beginners. Ages range from college students to retirees. One session is hosted by a pro pianist who runs it as a participatory jazz appreciation event, offering advice after each tune. Another is hosted by a pro bassist who invites his students (mostly retirees learning to sing ) to get some experience. One local trumpet teacher brings his students. And so forth. I’ve never seen anything resembling cutting. The overall spirit seems to be, at least in these places, for the shared love of jazz.

    Repertoire is similar to the Real Book, using the Jazz Standard Bible. Mostly Great American Songbook standards, with some funk and fusion. Reading totally OK, though of course whoever calls a tune and plays the head should know it well enough. Format is similar; intro, head, solos, fours, head, outro. Depending on who is there, players rotate. Sometimes rotations are managed by mom or pop or a pro, other times self managed. No house bands that play a set. Some busy nights there may be a few guitarists, a couple of pianists, a bassist or two, drummers and horns and vocalists, while other nights only a handful of people with one comping instrument. One place has a house pianist, while in the mom and pop shops either mom or pop or both, play instruments and fill in until some one else shows up.

    On occasion, regional, national or international pros who are in town for a holiday or family event join sessions. Some hail from this part if Japan and played at one or another of these places before going pro, and may stop by a session to play with the next generation. Over the past month, I had an opportunity to play with several touring and recording pros at these sessions, one a noted drummer now based in NYC.

    Overall these are, a fun, friendly, positive and welcoming jam session experience. I’ve been participating for about five years, at least once a week, and have improved, but my goal is mostly having fun playing jazz with others. At 60+ I have no aspirations to play for a living, though some of the younger players do. Sessions can often be an opportunity to meet players, or form or join a band. I’ve been asked to sit in on pro gigs, and had an invitation to go on a regional tour. Day job and family time would make full time performing impossible for me, though I am very thankful for the invitations and opportunities.

  15. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by JazzIsGood
    His advice was "if you don't know the song don't play."
    A lot of masters thought that tune is the melody, not it's harmonization and you can't perfect a tune that has already become a standard. For someone like Ed Bickert, there was a difference between soloing over "Tenor Madness" and "Blue Monk". It wasn't just blowing over the Bb blues changes but the head set the tone and the theme of the improvisation. That is not to say that they didn't play chord specific lines, but you can often hear in their solos that they were guided by the melody in some form or fashion.

    For people who aren't old enough to have grown up listening to the standards on the radio as pop tunes (like myself), the changes tend to take precedence over the melody. But I find that the better I know a tune, the more I hear the melody in the back of my head during my improvisation which makes me play differently than a tune I don't know as well. However given that the context is a jam session, not a paid standards gig, I find that the expectations of familiarity with the melody can be more relaxed.
    Last edited by Tal_175; 01-04-2023 at 12:14 PM.

  16. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by JazzIsGood
    Next piece of advice on transcribing- "dont transcribe full songs, just take a few measures that you like."
    This is useful and I will try it. People have told me this before.
    Usually I transcribe 32 bars or so, it has been a huge help in my playing. Possibly the greatest tool I have. I would be a bit hesitant to stop this altogether.
    I have in the past transcribed and learned solos. Like you, I'd also limit the transcription to one chorus of the solo. I don't think I got much benefit out of it in terms of learning language. I'd forget them after a couple of months. I got more out of transcribing, analyzing and internalizing shorter phrases and working on applying them on different harmonic situations, altering them etc.

    Just curious, what is your process of learning language when you memorize a full chorus of a solo? What exactly do you get out of it in the end? (other than ear training).

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tal_175
    A lot of masters thought that tune is the melody, not it's harmonization and you can't perfect a tune that has already become a standard. For someone like Ed Bickert, there was a difference between soloing over "Tenor Madness" and "Blue Monk". It wasn't not just blowing over Bb blues changes but the head set the tone and the theme of the improvisation. That is not to say that they didn't play chord specific lines, but you can often hear in their solos that they are guided by the melody in some form or fashion.

    For people who aren't old enough to have grown up listening to the standards on the radio as pop tunes (like myself), the changes tend to take precedence over the melody. But I find that the better I know a tune, the more I hear the melody in the back of my head during my improvisation which makes me play differently than a tune I don't know as well. However given the context is a jam session, not a paid standards gig, I find that the expectations of familiarity with the melody can be more relaxed.
    Gary Burton used to say that one of his pet hates was student bands racing through the head to get to the part where they would blow generic stuff over the changes & ignore the tune.

    Monk was someone who always referenced the tune...

    GB also said people who complemented his choice of tunes (as opposed to how fast he played or
    commented on his 4 hammer grip) were the ones who got it..

    edit - speling...
    Last edited by dot75; 01-06-2023 at 07:17 AM.

  18. #17

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    All of his advice was good.

    Just keep in mind, you can't take every bit of advice from everybody. So take what made sense and roll with it.

    Re jams and not knowing the tune-- definitely don't play. You'll get a lot more respect from other players by just respectfully laying out.

  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tal_175
    I have in the past transcribed and learned solos. Like you, I'd also limit the transcription to one chorus of the solo. I don't think I got much benefit out of it in terms of learning language. I'd forget them after a couple of months. I got more out of transcribing, analyzing and internalizing shorter phrases and working on applying them on different harmonic situations, altering them etc.

    Just curious, what is your process of learning language when you memorize a full chorus of a solo? What exactly do you get out of it in the end? (other than ear training).
    My process is like this-
    First i transcribe it, I guess that's good for ear training but honestly I have not gained much from this part.
    Next I gotta practice it quite a bit to be able to play it really well. I try to get it to sound very close to the record. If there's a few parts that are very slurry or have dead notes on the record I will skip those because I can have a tendency to get obsessed and spend too much time trying to figure out some tiny nuance and it becomes a bad use or practice time.
    Once I can play it, I will play those 32 bars hundreds of times. I will use it as a warm up every day or play it in the middle of practice when I'm getting stale on something else.
    There were times when I was less advanced that I would actually play some of these passages at gigs (a few bars, not an entire chorus). I have stopped doing that cause it's not really a genuine way to play.

    I find that after 1 month or so, the sound of my playing has really changed and improved. There's some kind of subconscious molding of jazz sensibilities that happens when you play something hundreds of times. I think the tiny parts like little slides and small movements get internalized. I can't describe it exactly, but I know everything sounds better.

    When my playing gets stale and boring, I spend a week transcribing something new and it gives things a fresh new start.

  20. #19

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    For me it's kinda of a grey area in this "don't play if you don't know the tune." Maybe that's why I am confused.

    For example, I have played Donna Lee like 5 times. At some point I worked on it for like half an hour. I have heard it at least 100 times. I know Donna Lee in terms of being familiar with it. I know what it sounds like. I think I get the vibe of it pretty good. I don't know the head at all, I don't know the chord changes all that well, but I know them somewhat, maybe like 50%. If I take a quick look at a chart it comes back to me. I can play it pretty good in a jam context (I can comp and play a solo). With no chart I would not attempt it. It's pretty fast and there's some very specific changes you need to nail. If I can reference a chart real quick it sounds good. I don't stare at a chart the entire tune following and playing block chords with the root in the bass. That's what people might be picturing. Maybe I'm getting stereotyped as someone who is gonna quietly chop quarter notes on blocky chords and then play a lame solo where I just arpeggiate the chords. I have seen lots of those guys and clearly the advanced guys want to keep them out.

    I do lay out sometimes and yes people do like that. I mainly lay out on the "kick the new guys ass" stuff when they are fucking with other people. Like when they call Giant Steps on some kid who just got a trumpet for Christmas, I just lay out. I could probably get Giants Steps together but I feel it's a useless and annoying tune. Takes a lot of work for something that doesn't sound good.

    So what do you say about playing on tunes where you know it half way?? I know about 80 tunes well, and another 150 or so I know half way.

    (ENTER OLD GUY JAZZ GURU) YOU CAN'T KNOW TUNES HALF WAY, YOU MUST STAY HOME AND LEARN EVERY TUNE BY HEART AND NEVER JAM AGAIN UNTIL YOU KNOW EVERY TUNE.

    Again I feel that approach is unrealistic and closes down the path to improving. Of course I'm gonna eventually know all these tunes but I'm not gonna hide in a cave for a decade until that happens.



    Quote Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
    All of his advice was good.

    Just keep in mind, you can't take every bit of advice from everybody. So take what made sense and roll with it.

    Re jams and not knowing the tune-- definitely don't play. You'll get a lot more respect from other players by just respectfully laying out.

  21. #20

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    Remember that the jazz guru was young once, too, and didn’t know the tunes. He may just take out his revenge on you. Or he is too old to remember himself


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  22. #21

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    As far as knowing the tunes ...

    I think, if you don't have a high probability of contributing something positive to the sound of the group, you should lay out.

    I don't care if you need a chart to do that, or not.

    That said, having a chart is no guarantee that you'll be able to play the tune adequately. It's jazz, and anything can happen. Depends on the group.

  23. #22

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    If you don't know the song don't play
    This might be interpreted to mean a few different things; the most positive is to interpret it as, "Don't play what you don't know" which would allow you to participate in a song, discover any parts you did't know, and just lay out those parts (but trying to grasp what is happening).

    Just transcribe a few measures that you like

    I hear this as maximizing learning to play by ear

    When are you ever gonna need to read? Use your practice time carefully

    Same as above; always be working on playing by ear

    Don't use charts, this music should be in you

    Same as above; play by ear. Music, even complex jazz music, is very highly redundant within a particular tune, and across all tunes. Part of playing by ear is learning to hear the harmonic possibilities of how a tune may go, even one you have never heard.

    Do honest playing

    Same as above, clearly he thinks using external representations (charts) as input data for some kind of jazz music making algorithm (method, e.g., CST) deviates from the spirit of jazz performance

    Try to get the energy of the room, pulling notes out of the air

    Same as above, stressing playing truly live, by ear, in the now


    You should not show up there again with your book/phone daring them to respond. What you could do is ask if "play what you know" is OK with him - (you play and might lay out, rather than not play and sit out).

  24. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by JazzIsGood
    I got some weird tips from an old jazz pro, can anyone help me sort this out?
    Oh god, here we go! 'How can I become a musical superman, dashing off tunes I don't know and leaping from building to building in a single bound?'

    I bet he never said anything of the kind.

    Oh look. No, he didn't --

    His advice was "if you don't know the song don't play."


    it was rhythm changes
    Rhythm Changes. Fair enough..

    The old pro guy comes back and says "well that was really nice, you sound good."
    Excellent. So far, so good.

    Which is odd to me
    Well that's probably why you're not running the gig.

    "dont transcribe full songs, just take a few measures that you like."
    That's right. Steal the stuff that grabs your ear. If you can.

    Next tip was "When are you ever gonna need to read?"
    100% guaranteed he never said any such thing.

    "Don't use charts, this music should be in you."
    Out of context. He meant don't do stuff in public you don't know so you don't sit there peering at a lead sheet.

    listening to this guy clown me out
    You personally, in front of the whole room? Sure he did, the nasty bully.

    "try to get the energy of the room
    That comes when you're experienced and good, yes. After some time, maybe.

    Master level guys really are full of bad advice
    LOL. That's why they're masters, I suppose.

  25. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar
    As far as knowing the tunes ...

    I think, if you don't have a high probability of contributing something positive to the sound of the group, you should lay out.

    I don't care if you need a chart to do that, or not.

    That said, having a chart is no guarantee that you'll be able to play the tune adequately. It's jazz, and anything can happen. Depends on the group.
    Yes I agree with this and generally this is my approach. I don't play if I'm totally clueless, but if the chart seems real easy or I know the tune halfway, I go for it. It's been going OK so far.
    Anything can happen and I might blow some garbage over a tune a month from now for all I know. But I'm not gonna live in fear of that, I'm gonna keep playing and let whatever happens happen.

  26. #25

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    This is a serious question, so please don't take it the wrong way: What is the appeal of going to an event like this? I have to say, it doesn't sound like fun to me and the behavior of the participants doesn't make them sound like people I would want to spend my free time with.

    I could never participate in a session under these conventions; that's why I never have. Not a jazz session, not a folk session, not an Irish session. I know lots of songs but I don't like to memorize. I'll either play from a lead sheet or by ear. When I play by ear, I don't necessarily "stick to the chart". I've never been good at fulfilling other peoples' criteria and it seems that that's what required.

    If I was going to lay out, I'd rather just stay home.

    The whole situation reminds me of some events involving a sort of martial art that I used to participate in. I stopped going because I already attended kindergarten when I was child, I didn't need to repeat the experience as an adult. Sorry if this appears to question the whole principle of sessions; I'm sure for some people they're great.