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  1. #51

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    Hi Paul,

    I just signed up to this forum (after reading along for about a year), to thank you for sharing all the insights. I really appreciate it! The WDR BB app is awesome, too. This really makes me want to start playing in a big band again

    Btw. when I started playing in a big band for the first time around 2007 I took inspiration from the Tyler Strat you were playing at that time and slapped a tortoise pickguard on mine as well.

    Grüße aus Stuttgart!

    Big Band Guitar-img_6520-jpg

  2.  

    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #52

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    Here's a track off 'East Coast Blow Out' recorded in 1989 with Scofield, Jim McNeely, Marc Johnson,
    Adam Nussbaum and WDR Big Band:


  4. #53

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    Paul, do you have any recollections about working with Phil Woods and John Riley on the Ellington album they recorded with the WDR Big Band in 2008?

    I just finished PW's autobiography, and it isn't mentioned there.
    TIA

  5. #54

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    All of these Ellington recordings were done before my time - probably in the early-90's...
    I guess they were re-released on CD in 2008.

    Quote Originally Posted by sgcim
    Paul, do you have any recollections about working with Phil Woods and John Riley
    on the Ellington album they recorded with the WDR Big Band in 2008?

    I just finished PW's autobiography, and it isn't mentioned there.
    TIA
    Last edited by DaShigsta; 02-20-2021 at 07:14 AM.

  6. #55

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    Quote Originally Posted by Webby
    Oh, just because I thought of that now: What is the best playing instruction you ever read on your part?
    I think the best one I ever read was "play something better than this" over some written out Funk-comping-riff.

    Paul
    Hey Paul,

    this one is hilarious and makes my current top three list !
    As played and video/audio recorded yesterday. The arranger shall remain nameless.
    I posted this spot on my IG...

    later, Paul


    Big Band Guitar-img_0968-jpg

  7. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by Half-trick pony
    Hi Paul,

    I just signed up to this forum (after reading along for about a year),
    to thank you for sharing all the insights. I really appreciate it!
    Hi HTP, thank you for your kind feedback ! Nice someone is sharing my interests...

    The WDR BB app is awesome, too. This really makes me want to
    start playing in a big band again
    Yes, if you have access to a rehearsal big band et al go for it !
    You know that we're down to only three full-time (publicly funded) big bands in Germany.
    The situation here is still much better than in other parts of Europe or elsewhere.
    But apps like ours or Mintzer's, even YT videos can help to keep your chops up
    if you have access to charts which interest you.

    Btw. when I started playing in a big band for the first time around 2007
    I took inspiration from the Tyler Strat you were playing at that time
    and slapped a tortoise pickguard on mine as well.
    Don't even remind me !
    I stupidly sold the Tyler (ML Classic) in a moment of insanity.

    Grüße aus Stuttgart!
    Grüsse aus der Kölner Südstadt !

  8. #57

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    Another one from the archives (2009):

    A Michael Abene chart of Bill Evans' 'Rattletrap'

    WDR Big Band feat. Bill Evans, Dave Weckl, Mark Egan. Guitar Solo at 08:34


  9. #58

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    Nice playing Paul,
    Best
    Kris

  10. #59

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    Thanks for watching !
    My solo was a clear case of selfdefense knowing I was up before Weckl and Bill Evans did their duo thingie...

    Quote Originally Posted by kris View Post
    Nice playing Paul,
    Best
    Kris

  11. #60

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaShigsta
    Thanks for watching !
    My solo was a clear case of selfdefense knowing I was up before Weckl and Bill Evans did their duo thingie...
    You more than held your ground. I'd be pissing my pants.

  12. #61

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaShigsta
    Thanks for watching !
    My solo was a clear case of selfdefense knowing I was up before Weckl and Bill Evans did their duo thingie...
    There was a 1970's football manager (can't recall who) who's pre match instructions to the players included

    'Remember lads, always get your retaliation in first'

    Nice playing...

  13. #62

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  14. #63

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaShigsta
    Thanks for watching !
    My solo was a clear case of selfdefense knowing I was up before Weckl and Bill Evans did their duo thingie...
    After seeing you playing that fat bodied Gibson (L-5?) in most of the other clips, I wasn't prepared to see you wailing away on that solid body!
    Which came first for you, playing jazz or playing rock? You must have cleaned up in those German studios. When you were in Japan, did you ever hear of a bass player/composer named Marvie Asakawa? I did a bunch of gigs with him in Brooklyn, and he knew more US Standards than I did.
    And I've lived here my whole life!

  15. #64

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgcim
    After seeing you playing that fat bodied Gibson (L-5?) in most of the other clips,
    I wasn't prepared to see you wailing away on that solid body!
    That guitar is a Super400CES, which I only use when the repertoire is 'old' enough.
    Depending on the style of music 90% of the time an archtop won't cut a gig/recording
    since you won't get the time and space to deal with multiple intruments.
    On average I'll get about one minute of personal soundcheck time before a recording
    or a performance so you better have your xxxx together. ;-)
    The guitar on the Bill Evans recording is a Teuffel Niwa.
    But my main go-to workhorse guitar since 10+ years is a heavily pimped Godin Passion RG-3
    which is really versatile contrary to popular belief.

    Which came first for you, playing jazz or playing rock?
    You must have cleaned up in those German studios.
    I started playing guitar in 1966 so it's clear what the main influences of the day were...
    Which kid listened to 'Jazz' at that time ?!?

    Looking back I spent most of my professional life from about the late 70's as a (also classically trained)
    studio guitar player although I have played live extensively, but always preferred the recording environment.
    I joined the WDR Big Band as a permanent member in 1999 and will end my tenure in a few months.
    I think I won't miss playing with horn sections after 22+ years...

    When you were in Japan, did you ever hear of a bass player/composer named Marvie Asakawa?
    I did a bunch of gigs with him in Brooklyn, and he knew more US Standards than I did.
    And I've lived here my whole life!
    No, never... I googled the name, but only came up with a singer named Asakawa Maki.
    Is that his real first name ?

    I lived in Brooklyn for a minute in 1989... close to BAM on the street where Spike Lee used to have an office.
    Many musicians lived in the neighborhood... great hang & good times !

  16. #65

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    Here's a pretty tune called 'Como Un Bolero' by the great Paquito D'Rivera with solos by him on clarinet,
    myself on Sadowsky Electric Nylon guitar and Claudio Roditi on muted trumpet.
    The arrangement is by Bill Dobbins, Mark Walker drums, Oscar Stagnaro bass and Pernell Saturnini percussion.


  17. #66

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaShigsta
    That guitar is a Super400CES, which I only use when the repertoire is 'old' enough.
    Depending on the style of music 90% of the time an archtop won't cut a gig/recording
    since you won't get the time and space to deal with multiple intruments.
    On average I'll get about one minute of personal soundcheck time before a recording
    or a performance so you better have your xxxx together. ;-)
    The guitar on the Bill Evans recording is a Teuffel Niwa.
    But my main go-to workhorse guitar since 10+ years is a heavily pimped Godin Passion RG-3
    which is really versatile contrary to popular belief.



    I started playing guitar in 1966 so it's clear what the main influences of the day were...
    Which kid listened to 'Jazz' at that time ?!?

    Looking back I spent most of my professional life from about the late 70's as a (also classically trained)
    studio guitar player although I have played live extensively, but always preferred the recording environment.
    I joined the WDR Big Band as a permanent member in 1999 and will end my tenure in a few months.
    I think I won't miss playing with horn sections after 22+ years...



    No, never... I googled the name, but only came up with a singer named Asakawa Maki.
    Is that his real first name ?

    I lived in Brooklyn for a minute in 1989... close to BAM on the street where Spike Lee used to have an office.
    Many musicians lived in the neighborhood... great hang & good times !
    Thanks for listing the guitars you use. I play a lot of shows, and versatility is the most important thing in an axe for those gigs.
    I probably got Marvie's name wrong, it's been a long time since I played with him, and my memory of Asian names is pretty lousy. I'm only sure of my two fave filmmakers, Takashi Miike and Sion Sono.

    I figured you had to have had an early background in rock. A lot of those things you did in that solo used rock techniques that I couldn't do if my life depended on it! Charlie Mariano had a fusion band once, didn't he?

  18. #67

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgcim
    Thanks for listing the guitars you use. I play a lot of shows, and versatility is the most important thing in an axe for those gigs.
    I probably got Marvie's name wrong, it's been a long time since I played with him, and my memory of Asian names is pretty lousy.
    I'm only sure of my two fave filmmakers, Takashi Miike and Sion Sono.
    If it's electric guitar I can hang with a good strat-type guitar (plus pedals) and get most of the things done.
    Occasionally I get asked to add nylon- or steelstring acoustic.
    In general there are not many archtop sessions anymore unless it's a revival type of thing playing Big Band music.

    Miike Takashi and Sono Shion are among my contemporary faves as well...

    I figured you had to have had an early background in rock. A lot of those things you did in that solo used rock techniques
    that I couldn't do if my life depended on it!
    Charlie Mariano had a fusion band once, didn't he?
    First amp I had was a fat German tube radio so you know where I'm coming from...

    Charlie was a member of Eberhard Weber's group and on all the early ECM recordings
    and was playing 'World Music' way before it got fashionable.

  19. #68

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaShigsta
    If it's electric guitar I can hang with a good strat-type guitar (plus pedals) and get most of the things done.
    Occasionally I get asked to add nylon- or steelstring acoustic.
    In general there are not many archtop sessions anymore unless it's a revival type of thing playing Big Band music.

    Miike Takashi and Sono Shion are among my contemporary faves as well...



    First amp I had was a fat German tube radio so you know where I'm coming from...

    Charlie was a member of Eberhard Weber's group and on all the early ECM recordings
    and was playing 'World Music' way before it got fashionable.
    Tony Scott was another cat who went from Bird to 'World Music' very early, also. I wonder if Charlie and Tony hung out together in their world travels?
    You and John Marshall made a very good choice in moving to Germany. They really seem to have retained their respect for the profession of being a musician, compared to most countries. A trumpet player friend of mine recently married a German chick, and is planning to live there for the rest of his life, after his sick mother passes. Even when he goes there on vacation, he's able to pick up gigs playing 'legit' trumpet.

    Sono is the only director who is capable of making films that last close to three hours (and more), and are so well written that you feel like you never want them to end. IMHO, he has yet to even make a mediocre film. Miike has made so many films (over 100!), that his consistency is not as great as Sono's, but his best work (Audition, Ichi, the Killer, Happiness of the Katakuris) is so astounding, that it makes up for any duds.
    The Koreans have also been making great films for the last 20 years, but it took all that time for the US to finally recognize their greatness.

    My gigs (pre-pandemic) were all played on non- archtops, a Parker with piezo pickups to get acoustic sounds, and a Borys Jazz Solid, the guitar that Paul Bollenback uses.

  20. #69

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    Thanks for sharing!

    Love the big band stuff. One of my regrets is not playing in the jazz band in my early music days.

    I wish I had known about your outfit when I lived in Germany in the 90’s. I lived in the Kaiserslautern area, and found the musical environment there at the time a bit unimaginative. Electronic dance music was big at the time.

    But there was no Facebook or much Internet forum activity, so it was hard to find out about stuff going on in nearby towns. Maybe there was a jazz music scene in Kaiserslautern in the late 90’s? If so, it was under the radar, to me anyway.

    BTW I saw Basie with his band in 1979–still a force to reckon with on stage. He came to my college, and my friend convinced me he could get us free tickets by claiming to be on the concert committee. It didn’t work, so we had to pay $8 to get in. :-)

    Anyway, I’m glad your stuff is out there and there’s still an interest in high-quality big band music. Keep playing!
    Last edited by Doctor Jeff; 03-06-2021 at 10:08 AM.

  21. #70

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgcim
    You and John Marshall made a very good choice in moving to Germany.
    They really seem to have retained their respect for the profession of being a musician, compared to most countries.
    Hey sgcim,

    Here's a cool arrangement of Monk's I Mean You off of Abdullah Ibrahim's record 'Bombella'.
    I solo first (Super400CES), then I get to comp for John Marshall's solo. The piano laid out for this part of the track.


  22. #71

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    Great stuff! Did you use a pick on your solo, or was it half pick and fingers? I know you're playing those stab comps with fingers, because they're all sounding at once. It's really the most pianistic way to comp on the guitar, and sounds very effective on both John's solo and yours, which were both great. It was nice to hear JM on flugel, the blend between the flugelhorn and the guitar was perfect. Do you guys tune to 440 over there? Your axe sounds perfectly intonated, and even the minor seconds in your solo sound in tune.

    I liked JM's entrance with a quote of "When Lights Are Low". Nice arr. with effective use of 5ths
    I didn't miss the piano at all!

  23. #72

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaShigsta
    Hey sgcim,

    Here's a cool arrangement of Monk's I Mean You off of Abdullah Ibrahim's record 'Bombella'.
    I solo first (Super400CES), then I get to comp for John Marshall's solo. The piano laid out for this part of the track.

    nice playing all around!

  24. #73

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgcim
    Great stuff! Did you use a pick on your solo, or was it half pick and fingers?
    I know you're playing those stab comps with fingers, because they're all sounding at once. It's really the most pianistic way to comp on the guitar,
    and sounds very effective on both John's solo and yours, which were both great.
    Thanks for listening closely !

    No, it was just fingers. For the lines it was a combination of p i m a... p i always matching the pick down- and upstroke.
    The 4-note chords are pima, 5-note pima w/added pinky (c), 3-note chords are ima, mac, pim, pma etc
    This is my take on 'no-nails electric finger style guitar'.

    It was nice to hear JM on flugel, the blend between the flugelhorn and the guitar was perfect.
    Do you guys tune to 440 over there? Your axe sounds perfectly intonated,
    and even the minor seconds in your solo sound in tune.
    When it comes to Bebop/Hardbop JM is a master... And he survived Buddy Rich !
    We usually tune to 442 in our band... The classical guys tune even higher over here.

    I liked JM's entrance with a quote of "When Lights Are Low".
    Nice arr. with effective use of 5ths. I didn't miss the piano at all!
    In 20 years+ I've learnt to co-exist peacefully with piano players without laying out
    as a general rule when they comp. Although it is always nice to have all that space without a piano interfering.
    Of course - speaking of blend - I will comp differently for different instruments.
    Choosing the right range and voicings is the key...
    Last edited by DaShigsta; 03-11-2021 at 07:06 AM.

  25. #74

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaShigsta
    Hey sgcim,

    Here's a cool arrangement of Monk's I Mean You off of Abdullah Ibrahim's record 'Bombella'.
    I solo first (Super400CES), then I get to comp for John Marshall's solo. The piano laid out for this part of the track.

    Great solo!

    As someone currently attempting pure fingerstyle jazz guitar (I’m practicing a lot of classical atm) it’s nice to hear it done so swingingly.

  26. #75

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
    Thanks for sharing! Love the big band stuff.
    One of my regrets is not playing in the jazz band in my early music days.
    Thank you !

    Listening to big band music or playing in a big band is an acquired taste and a matter of opportunity.

    I wish I had known about your outfit when I lived in Germany in the 90’s.
    I lived in the Kaiserslautern area, and found the musical environment there
    at the time a bit unimaginative. Electronic dance music was big at the time.
    But there was no Facebook or much Internet forum activity, so it was hard to find out about stuff going on in nearby towns.
    Maybe there was a jazz music scene in Kaiserslautern in the late 90’s? If so, it was under the radar, to me anyway.
    There was always a healthy jazz scene in Germany since the late 50's and at least 4 state subsidized
    radio big bands. There still is the HR Big Band and the SWR Big Band (at that time) in the Kaiserslautern area.
    Atm Germany has more than 130 functioning classical orchestras.
    As with any niche cultural activities you gotta look for them. And EDM came to stay...

    BTW I saw Basie with his band in 1979–still a force to reckon with on stage.
    He came to my college, and my friend convinced me he could get us free tickets
    by claiming to be on the concert committee. It didn’t work, so we had to pay $8 to get in. :-)
    Good for you ! I never had the chance to see him live...

    Anyway, I’m glad your stuff is out there and there’s still an interest
    in high-quality big band music. Keep playing!
    We all need to keep playing AND listening... ;-)

  27. #76

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    Great solo!

    As someone currently attempting pure fingerstyle jazz guitar (I’m practicing a lot of classical atm)
    it’s nice to hear it done so swingingly.
    Thank you !

    I started out with classical guitar and renaissance lute in the 70's and my liberating Heureka moment
    happened when I realized NOT to use RH nails on the electric guitar.
    Like with reading/sightreading/LH fingering on the guitar it's a lifelong process...

    PS: Apoyando and Tirando sound so much better on the electric guitar without nails methinks...

  28. #77

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaShigsta
    Thank you !

    I started out with classical guitar and renaissance lute in the 70's and my liberating Heureka moment
    happened when I realized NOT to use RH nails on the electric guitar.
    Like with reading/sightreading/LH fingering on the guitar it's a lifelong process...

    PS: Apoyando and Tirando sound so much better on the electric guitar without nails methinks...
    Yeah, sound might be a little thin on electric (Bossa rhythm sounds crispy though!). But I'm mostly doing it on nylon atm.

    As you probably know, forum member Rob MacKillop actually plays classical without nails; he's written some in depth stuff and research about it IIRC...

    Anyway I'm rather enjoying having nails ATM. They'll get shredded soon when I start playing gypsy jazz gigs again lol.

    One question - do you do much left hand slurring or is all picked? I slur a lot in my pick paying (conscious decision) and this has helped out my finger style playing no end haha. (I guess that's what you call not actually getting better at finger style haha?)

    Also, have you tried renaissance lute technique on guitar?
    Last edited by christianm77; 03-11-2021 at 09:11 AM.

  29. #78

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    I've said for years, if I could somehow get retractable nails, like a cat, that'd be awesome.

    Man, lots of good music in this thread.

  30. #79

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    One question - do you do much left hand slurring or is all picked? I slur a lot in my pick paying (conscious decision)
    and this has helped out my finger style playing no end haha. (I guess that's what you call not actually getting better at finger style haha?)

    Also, have you tried renaissance lute technique on guitar?
    It all depends what the music is asking for. In general I use LH slurs combined with RH 'picking' using pima
    depending on the phrasing situation. For example: doubling horn lines is different than say doubling piano or bass lines.
    Solo guitar or guitar trio playing gives you the whole scope.
    If you have a look at the beginning of the septet video there's a close up of my RH
    where you can briefly see the renaissance lute RH positioning. Or the I Thought About You video is pure renaissance lute RH.
    Watching/listening to Paul O'Dette in '76 changed my life. p - i (down - up, thumb inward) for single lines,
    which is called fighetta plus resting the pinky on pick guard just like the old blues players.
    I've been playing this way for 40+ years... I went through a period of a couple of years where I would switch
    between nails and no-nails. That was a pain in the xxx ! So nowadays it's 75% no nails vs 25% using a pick.

    Let me show off a classical piece which I recorded on the Super400 in the early 90's.
    All the fast single note lines (without a lower bass note) were done with p - i:



    Just like what you guys were discussing over in the fingering thread... you gotta 'know' your fretboard and all the LH and RH can do.
    That's a lot of information to process and no system (Caged, 7 or 5 positions etc bla bla) will help you to avoid the real work
    if you want to master it. There are no easy solutions, tricks or shortcuts even though this is not a popular opinion.
    But we're not gonna open Pandora's Box here... I'll shut up now... Hahaaa.
    Last edited by DaShigsta; 03-11-2021 at 10:09 AM.

  31. #80

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    No I love it. Thanks for the thoughts.

  32. #81

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    Do as Pasquale Grasso does: He is using artificial nails on middle/ring finger and pinky.

    Thanks for listening !

    Quote Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
    I've said for years, if I could somehow get retractable nails, like a cat, that'd be awesome.

    Man, lots of good music in this thread.

  33. #82

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    Like a classical guitar Wolverine?

  34. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    Like a classical guitar Wolverine?
    exactly.

    I can't have any kind of "always there" nails, really, with my job...I'm constantly caked in paint and wash my hands like 20 times a day. Nails never stand a chance on me.

  35. #84

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    Like a classical guitar Wolverine?
    Big Band Guitar-b7916ee7-329d-42f1-baec-767329d5ac96-jpeg

  36. #85

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    Oh well... Back on topic:

    Coming on to solo after Michael & Randy Brecker was a challenge, but I was hangin' in there WITH a pick (and long hair).
    Big Band Arrangement by Vince Mendoza feat. Will Lee, Peter Erskine, Marcio Doctor and Jim Beard.


  37. #86

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    Here's one mo' from the opposite end of the spectrum: A nice Duo spot at 50:20 (from the complete concert at Kölner Philharmonie)
    with the great singer Jazzmeia Horn playing The Girl From Ipanema (w/ RH renaissance lute technique on a Godin MultiAc Nylon).

    Last edited by DaShigsta; 03-11-2021 at 02:51 PM.

  38. #87

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaShigsta
    Oh well... Back on topic:

    Coming on to solo after Michael & Randy Brecker was a challenge, but I was hangin' in there WITH a pick (and long hair).
    Big Band Arrangement by Vince Mendoza feat. Will Lee, Peter Erskine, Marcio Doctor and Jim Beard.

    Wow! That built to an incredible climax on your solo. You looked like Masuo back then. That must have been a great feeling with Erskine kicking it like that. No wonder you want to retire; you can't go much further with a big band than that!

  39. #88

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    This was definitely a highlight. We got to rehearse two full days with the Brecker Bros and a whole week with Erskine and Will Lee... Peter is one of the greats and I feel fortunate to have played with him many times over the years. Re: Masuo... I met Hank Jones once and he asked ‘Are you the guy who played with my brother ?’
    I wish I did...
    Actually have to retire... rules & regulations of the public service system.

    Quote Originally Posted by sgcim
    Wow! That built to an incredible climax on your solo. You looked like Masuo back then. That must have been a great feeling with Erskine kicking it like that. No wonder you want to retire; you can't go much further with a big band than that!

  40. #89

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaShigsta
    This was definitely a highlight. We got to rehearse two full days with the Brecker Bros and a whole week with Erskine and Will Lee... Peter is one of the greats and I feel fortunate to have played with him many times over the years. Re: Masuo... I met Hank Jones once and he asked ‘Are you the guy who played with my brother ?’
    I wish I did...
    Actually have to retire... rules & regulations of the public service system.
    Do they at least give you a pension? Next thing you know you'll be telling me they're going to deport you back to Japan!

  41. #90

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgcim View Post
    Do they at least give you a pension? Next thing you know you'll be telling me
    they're going to deport you back to Japan!
    Hey sgcim, I'll be well taken care of...
    Deportation sounds like a great idea ! Would save me a lot of money...

    Here's one (Db-Waltz) from 2002 with the uber awesome Joe Zawinul
    feat. Victor Bailey, Peter Erskine & Alex Acuna. Band led by Vince Mendoza.
    Very first time I got to play with JZ...


  42. #91

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    DaShigsta,

    Was that you on guitar for the big band arrangement of "One Hope" by Knower?



    If so, what was it like playing with Louis Cole and Genevieve Artadi? A couple of the young lion professional jazz musicians I speak with really like Knower. I really like their stuff as well. Very much a fusion of the Youtube age with their sound.

  43. #92

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    PmE,

    yes... It was an interesting project. 4 days of rehearsals, 1 day for shooting videos and 1 live concert. It would have been great to do more... Lois Cole is intense to work with. Great drummer and conceptualist. They found their own original voice. I think Louis was a student of Mintzer‘s in LA. The guitar charts were hard. Almost everything was written out ! Tough but fun...

    Quote Originally Posted by PickingMyEars View Post
    DaShigsta,

    Was that you on guitar for the big band arrangement of "One Hope" by Knower?



    If so, what was it like playing with Louis Cole and Genevieve Artadi? A couple of the young lion professional jazz musicians I speak with really like Knower. I really like their stuff as well. Very much a fusion of the Youtube age with their sound.
    Last edited by DaShigsta; 03-19-2021 at 10:58 AM.

  44. #93

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    This one was ridiculous: The double-stop stuff on B/E strings sound random, but it was all written out... I did ok at about 75%

    Last edited by DaShigsta; 03-19-2021 at 02:57 PM.

  45. #94

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    A deeply satisfying 'textural' guitar part (using vol pedal, delay/reverb, slide)
    for this Vince Mendoza arrangement of 'Grace' sung by the amazing Lizz Wright.

    Last edited by DaShigsta; 03-21-2021 at 05:18 PM.

  46. #95

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaShigsta
    A deeply satisfying 'textural' guitar part (using vol pedal, delay/reverb, slide)
    for this Vince Mendoza arrangement of 'Grace' sung by the amazing Lizz Wright.

    Beautiful chart, performance, vocals, and alto sax solo. Did Mendoza specify slide in the part? I've played a lot of shows, and even the ones with R&B, Gospel,Rock etc...have never called for slide. Very subtle guitar part; very subtly changes the overall perception of the piece.
    I'm gonna have to check out Lizz Wright. Nice to not hear a screamer for a change.

  47. #96

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgcim
    Beautiful chart, performance, vocals, and alto sax solo. Did Mendoza specify slide in the part?
    I've played a lot of shows, and even the ones with R&B, Gospel,Rock etc... have never called for slide.
    Very subtle guitar part; very subtly changes the overall perception of the piece.
    Thank you... Vince didn't call for slide in the guitar part, but encouraged it after the first rehearsal.
    There's a system to how I change registers according to what's happening in the music.
    The horn arrangement already leaves a lot of space for Lizz so it was easy to find my place as
    a string/pad section. Her music always uses the whole range of guitars such as pedal steel, acoustic etc.
    Kind of a post-Cassandra Wilson vibe...

    I'm gonna have to check out Lizz Wright. Nice to not hear a screamer for a change.
    Exactly ! I love her music...

  48. #97

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaShigsta
    Thank you... Vince didn't call for slide in the guitar part, but encouraged it after the first rehearsal.
    There's a system to how I change registers according to what's happening in the music.
    The horn arrangement already leaves a lot of space for Lizz so it was easy to find my place as
    a string/pad section. Her music always uses the whole range of guitars such as pedal steel, acoustic etc.
    Kind of a post-Cassandra Wilson vibe...



    Exactly ! I love her music...
    What's your system to how you change registers according to what's happening in the music? Do you stay in the high register during a trombone solo or soli? Stick to 4/4 comping during a sax section soli? As far as trumpets go, I guess I generally stay in the low register.
    James Chirillo has a whole Freddie Green thing where he just plays quarter notes on the D string to stay out of the way of the piano and the bass on Basie type tunes.
    The pad concept is great for more contemporary vocal things like this, although arrangers are always using the saxes and bones as pads. When they lay out, then using volume pedal, delay and slide are good ideas.
    The main thing is the age old problem of dealing with the pianist/keyboard player. Do you have any specific strategies for that?

  49. #98

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgcim
    What's your system to how you change registers according to what's happening in the music?
    That's too big a topic to be answered in detail here. You can clearly deduct some of the processes
    watching the Lizz Wright videos. Here's another one. The guitar is a bit low in the mix but with cans
    you'll get the idea:


    Do you stay in the high register during a trombone solo or soli?
    No, definitely not... If it's comping for a t-bone solo my top note will be on the B string as a general guideline.
    Also if there's 'space' left during a t-bone 4-part soli section I'd do the same. But as you know more often than not
    arrangers like to double section line soli with guitar which I like because of blend and playability.

    Stick to 4/4 comping during a sax section soli? As far as trumpets go, I guess I generally stay in the low register.
    Unless I have to double a sax section it's piano duty and I shut up... Trumpet section soli I get to double very often
    because I can easily crank up and be heard.

    James Chirillo has a whole Freddie Green thing where he just plays quarter notes
    on the D string to stay out of the way of the piano and the bass on Basie type tunes.
    Yeah... Chirillo ! I met him once when our band played at Birdland in NY in 2000.
    He's got the FG thing down ! That's what you do: use the D-string to your advantage
    as an anchor to the other possible voices above/below... another huge topic !

    The pad concept is great for more contemporary vocal things like this,
    although arrangers are always using the saxes and bones as pads.
    When they lay out, then using volume pedal, delay and slide are good ideas.
    I often use the pad thing especially on jazz ballads when the horn sections don't have fast motion writing.

    The main thing is the age old problem of dealing with the pianist/keyboard player.
    Do you have any specific strategies for that?
    Don't get me started...I could write a book (and I might.)
    It all depends how good the pianist is and if he's willing to listen to what the guitar does.
    Most average piano players are too involved filling in as much space in as little time as possible. Hahaaa...

  50. #99

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaShigsta
    That's too big a topic to be answered in detail here. You can clearly deduct some of the processes
    watching the Lizz Wright videos. Here's another one. The guitar is a bit low in the mix but with cans
    you'll get the idea:




    No, definitely not... If it's comping for a t-bone solo my top note will be on the B string as a general guideline.
    Also if there's 'space' left during a t-bone 4-part soli section I'd do the same. But as you know more often than not
    arrangers like to double section line soli with guitar which I like because of blend and playability.



    Unless I have to double a sax section it's piano duty and I shut up... Trumpet section soli I get to double very often
    because I can easily crank up and be heard.



    Yeah... Chirillo ! I met him once when our band played at Birdland in NY in 2000.
    He's got the FG thing down ! That's what you do: use the D-string to your advantage
    as an anchor to the other possible voices above/below... another huge topic !



    I often use the pad thing especially on jazz ballads when the horn sections don't have fast motion writing.



    Don't get me started...I could write a book (and I might.)
    It all depends how good the pianist is and if he's willing to listen to what the guitar does.
    Most average piano players are too involved filling in as much space in as little time as possible. Hahaaa...

    Very tasty solo on the the LW tune! She dug it, too; she pointed her arm at you.

    As you said, the arrangers mostly use single line guitar to double the lead trombone and trumpet parts. I think they finally learned that we're not going to be able to handle a Thad Jones sax soli, although Mintzer likes the guitar doubling the tenor lines on some of his more modern things.
    Wayne Wright told me he likes to keep the pulse going on sax solis by doing the Freddie Green thing. I never took the Freddie Green thing seriously when I was in college, until I saw Wayne Wright playing acoustic archtop rhythm guitar for a big band. He broke a string in the middle of a tune, and started crawling on the floor to get to his case to get a new string. He put the string back on, and rejoined the band, and it was like some magic layer of rhythmic harmony had been added to the band; kind of like making the bass drums and guitar into one harmonic/rhythmic instrument that gave a golden cushion for the band to play on.

    The piano thing is a tough one to crack. I'm always listening to every note the piano plays, trying to blend as seamlessly as possible.
    Ironically, in the top band I play with, I found it easy to blend with the least talented pianist they used, because he kept everything very simple and predictable. Like you said, the average pianists are much more difficult, because they're always too busy.
    The great pianists are going to be so strong, that you can just let them do their thing and stay out of the way as much as possible.

  51. #100

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgcim
    As you said, the arrangers mostly use single line guitar to double the lead trombone and trumpet parts.
    I think they finally learned that we're not going to be able to handle a Thad Jones sax soli,
    although Mintzer likes the guitar doubling the tenor lines on some of his more modern things.
    Yes, Mintzer, Abene and Mendoza often double tenor lines w/guitar and if it's 'worth the trouble'
    I put in the extra time to be able to play it. We did the last Yellowjackets recording where I got to double
    Mintzer's tenor/EWI parts... That was big fun !

    The piano thing is a tough one to crack. I'm always listening to every note the piano plays, trying to blend as seamlessly as possible.
    Ironically, in the top band I play with, I found it easy to blend with the least talented pianist they used,
    because he kept everything very simple and predictable.
    Like you said, the average pianists are much more difficult, because they're always too busy.
    The great pianists are going to be so strong, that you can just let them do their thing and stay out of the way as much as possible.
    Over the years I devised my own musical concept how to deal with the 'piano situation'.
    The usual line by an arrangeur/composer/conductor is:
    'You'll figure it out (comping) between the two (piano & guitar) of you'...
    Good luck with that !
    If there's a great pianist at work I'll be glad to just listen...

    Let me post this great concert we did with the Yellowjackets in November 2019.
    Russell Ferrante is an awesome musician and one of the best compers out there...
    This is textbook rhythm section playing.

    Last edited by DaShigsta; 03-26-2021 at 07:54 AM.