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  1. #1

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    My new pet peeve: people who can't play, making videos

    I belong to several guitar groups on FB (yes, I still use it) and a lot of them contain people's homemade videos of them playing (or should I say 'attempting to play') various tunes. Some even preface the tune (?) with "this is something I'm working on" and proceed to play something totally unrecognizable for a couple minutes. This morning I saw a gentleman trying to play a well known Miles Davis tune and the only way I knew what it was was because it was stated in the post! I'm thinking, in this age of modern miracles of being able to make movies of everything in our lives, many think they are star quality and get an ego boost out of seeing themselves on the little screen. This is OK, but PLEASE learn to play the material first - the rest of us have other things to do in life than listen to you practice 32 bars of some chord progression that you made up that Aunt Gertie thinks is cool.

    Personally, I'm old and ugly and don't belong on video in any form and be well advised that if I ever do post something, either video or just an audio clip, I hope that I have good enough taste to learn the material first.

    Please don't get me wrong - this rant is definitely not aimed at anyone on this forum - no bad stuff here.

    On another note: I've found that, with the advent of You Tube, I've found that I spend far too much time watching other people play music that I should be playing and working on. Sometimes, it just seems easier to watch and listen to someone else play it. Same with XM Radio - I hear a great Woody Herman arrangement of a tune and think "what's the point of even trying to do anything with it - you can't improve on perfection".

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  3. #2

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    +1
    ... but I like videos made by profesional musicians...ofcourse not all of them.
    Jazzingly
    Kris

  4. #3

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    A thing i dislike about Youtube is how much it dominates the music scene nowadays. Most of my students spend a lot more time watching mediocre videos rather than listening to great music. They have the idea that these youtube players/salesmen are the real thing, and are often shocked when introduced to real recording artists.

  5. #4

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    That phrase, “This is something I'm working on”, should be taken as fair warning. Real artists in any medium produce finished works.

  6. #5

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    Many people use social media for social purposes. They aren't looking to advance a career. They see posting as the equivalent of playing a song for friends at a gathering.

  7. #6

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    There are should be a new Community Guidelines rule when you report a video on FB or YT, something like 'butchering a musical piece', so it could be reviewed by stuff and taken down. That will teach 'em!

  8. #7

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    I think life's too short to get upset by crap. I just don't watch it.

  9. #8

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    huh, ya'll must be using youtube for different purposes than I

  10. #9

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    I think it’s cool. You learn a lot from making videos. If only; I don’t know this tune.

    OTOH I do wonder about the level of self reflexivity of many posters on some of these FB threads. I don’t mind it too much though haha.

  11. #10

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    I’m really not as upset by these videos as much as I am of the genre of people playing solos along with the record.

    Make your own bloody music. Grumble grumble.

  12. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    I’m really not as upset by these videos as much as I am of the genre of people playing solos along with the record.

    Make your own bloody music. Grumble grumble.
    yeah, what a waste of time that could've been better spent typing about music


    scnr

  13. #12

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    Men in shorts are concerning. If you intend to play sitting down, to a camera level with your knees, you should wear proper trousers.

  14. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by djg
    yeah, what a waste of time that could've been better spent typing about music
    scnr
    In seriousness, I would love to be in a position to play more music but I can’t at the moment. I shouldn’t be on this forum as much as I am it’s a poor substitute but it helps.

    2020 has been a very difficult year for all musicians.

    I hardly feel like a musician at all at the moment, truth be told. And I’m not. The forum helps.

    Anyway here’s hoping 2021 is a bit brighter.
    Last edited by christianm77; 12-10-2020 at 08:49 AM.

  15. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Skip Ellis
    My new pet peeve: people who can't play, making videos

    I belong to several guitar groups on FB (yes, I still use it) and a lot of them contain people's homemade videos of them playing (or should I say 'attempting to play') various tunes. Some even preface the tune (?) with "this is something I'm working on" and proceed to play something totally unrecognizable for a couple minutes. This morning I saw a gentleman trying to play a well known Miles Davis tune and the only way I knew what it was was because it was stated in the post! I'm thinking, in this age of modern miracles of being able to make movies of everything in our lives, many think they are star quality and get an ego boost out of seeing themselves on the little screen. This is OK, but PLEASE learn to play the material first - the rest of us have other things to do in life than listen to you practice 32 bars of some chord progression that you made up that Aunt Gertie thinks is cool.

    Personally, I'm old and ugly and don't belong on video in any form and be well advised that if I ever do post something, either video or just an audio clip, I hope that I have good enough taste to learn the material first.

    Please don't get me wrong - this rant is definitely not aimed at anyone on this forum - no bad stuff here.

    On another note: I've found that, with the advent of You Tube, I've found that I spend far too much time watching other people play music that I should be playing and working on. Sometimes, it just seems easier to watch and listen to someone else play it. Same with XM Radio - I hear a great Woody Herman arrangement of a tune and think "what's the point of even trying to do anything with it - you can't improve on perfection".
    Of course nobody’s putting a gun to your head and making you watch. We unaccomplished players have a range of legitimate reasons for posting. You don’t like kindergarten level music, stay out of the kindergarten.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

  16. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    Mate I know you were being flippant but let me know why I find this a bit hurtful, though I know it wasn’t intended.

    I would love to be in a position to play more music but I can’t at the moment. I shouldn’t be on this forum as much as I am it’s a poor substitute but it helps.

    2020 has been a difficult year for all musicians.

    I hardly feel like a musician at all at the moment, truth be told. And I’m not.

    Anyway lots of people have had a far worse time in 2020. I’ll take this as an indication that maybe I should be more careful what I say to people sometimes. I need to be kinder.

    Anyway here’s hoping 2021 is a bit brighter.
    if i understand you correctly there are issues that prevent you from playing your instrument. that's an awful shame and i sympathize. i have spent months in hospitals since summer of 2016, and was unable to leave the house for extended periods of time. 2020 was supposed to be a comeback year.

    but learning parts or a complete solo is part of many player's education and posting something on youtube is nothing more than being proud of a job well done. many just use youtube as a study journal. why would you find this more offensive than the posers, the clickbaiters and the second-hand lick salesmen that are all over the place? you can't take someone like beato seriously and then piss all over someone like dutchbopper (or me for that matter). sorry, if you find that hurtful.

    if there was never a word spoken on youtube about music again, the world would be a better place.

  17. #16

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    I hope you're not talking about me! Music has taken a big dump. Videos are a wonderful way of counteracting the dump for lack of places to play and even losing the purpose to play. Relax. The internet is a big place.

  18. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by djg
    if i understand you correctly there are issues that prevent you from playing your instrument. that's an awful shame and i sympathize. i have spent months in hospitals since summer of 2016, and was unable to leave the house for extended periods of time. 2020 was supposed to be a comeback year.

    but learning parts or a complete solo is part of many player's education and posting something on youtube is nothing more than being proud of a job well done. many just use youtube as a study journal. why would you find this more offensive than the posers, the clickbaiters and the second-hand lick salesmen that are all over the place? you can't take someone like beato seriously and then piss all over someone like dutchbopper (or me for that matter). sorry, if you find that hurtful.

    if there was never a word spoken on youtube about music again, the world would be a better place.
    Ah sorry I had no idea you’d posted any videos like that. I can only respond thus:



    So understand the spirit in which it is intended, which is tongue in cheek. So I’m guilty of being thoughtless....

    That said; regarding the videoing yourself playing a solo; this has become a YouTube genre and tbh I do find it a bit annoying now.

    Why? Not because it’s a bad thing to do, exactly the opposite in fact; but because as Bruce Forman pointed out when criticising this type of thing, no one wants to see how the sausage is made.

    TBF to all those including myself that do post videos like this, it is very hard to get the same interest in original music that you do in covering someone else’s especially if it is a technically impressive feat.

    He suggests we all keep our practice private, and while I can’t say I always follow that advice (to say the least), I think he has a point. He changed my mind about it anyway.

    OTOH we live in the world of social media and the personal and public overlap in really a very weird way.

    (Also I don’t take Beato very seriously
    not sure where you got that idea.)

  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    Why? Not because it’s a bad thing to do, exactly the opposite in fact; but because as Bruce Forman pointed out when criticising this type of thing, no one wants to see how the sausage is made.
    no one?


  20. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by djg
    no one?

    hmmmm....

    well, cookery shows exist too don’t they?

  21. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    hmmmm....

    well, cookery shows exist too don’t they?
    ah, what do i know. but i dont agree with forman's statement. i'm a sausage maker, there are few things as enjoyable as watching a sausage expertly being made. and doesn't he have a podcast that is strictly devoted to the art of sausage making? this is all very confusing. and i dont even eat meat...

  22. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by djg
    ah, what do i know. but i dont agree with forman's statement. i'm a sausage maker, there are few things as enjoyable as watching a sausage expertly being made. and doesn't he have a podcast that is strictly devoted to the art of sausage making? this is all very confusing. and i dont even eat meat...
    Haha

    But you got me thinking; I do think music is more like cookery ....

  23. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    Haha

    But you got me thinking; I do think music is more like cookery ....
    i do as well and have made that comparison many times. the cooking pan is an illusion

  24. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    That said; regarding the videoing yourself playing a solo; this has become a YouTube genre and tbh I do find it a bit annoying now.

    Why? Not because it’s a bad thing to do, exactly the opposite in fact; but because as Bruce Forman pointed out when criticising this type of thing, no one wants to see how the sausage is made.
    My dad made an almost indescribably good sausage, blended from a range of meats, some wild, spices, herbs, and even a bit of partial freezing and other mysterious steps. He would give it as Christmas gifts to select friends and family. People would actually come for visits overnight to "see how the sausage is made." Stupid me I took it for granted and never learned "how the sausage was made."

    The intolerance for beginners and hobby players who never get to play for audiences except in their homes and who want to reach out to a somewhat wider circle via YouTube are doing no harm, regardless of how many there are. They can simply be ignored by those not in that circle.

    I continue to want to know how the musical sausage is made, so I watch and even make such abominable video clips. Nobody is compelled to watch them and they can "ignore" me all they want. I am not surprised that my clips only get watched by people with some interest in or link to my feeble playing efforts, or other fellow aspiring sausage makers.

  25. #24

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    Bruce Forman; debunked!

  26. #25

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    Right, I’m off to watch some kids playing Holdsworth solos note for note on Instagram. And weep.

  27. #26

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    First, if I may be so bold, I think Skip is writing about "not-so-good aspiring Jazz" players uploading videos that are not very good. I also question these players a little, unless they are doing it as part of a study group or something. I would hope that they at least upload their best take or at least have reached a point where they can show some "decent" progress with the song before they start uploading, unless it is their intent to realistically show where they are at. Then, they probably should not say "excuse the mistakes," since mistakes are a part of learning.

    Second, is Christian talking about people playing along with a recorded version of the song or with backing tracks. I think those are 2 different topics.

    I find that when I hear someone playing with a recorded version, trying to match it note-for-note (especially some rock song), it can be a bit trying as well if they don't do a good job.

    But what the heck, life is too short and if that makes them happy, more power to them. Doing something harmless like this to help one's attitude is better than languishing in depression or anxiety - especially for an extended time. Before I upload, it will darn well be what I am trying to say or I will keep practicing until it is "presentable" enough (unless its some sort of study group or something).

    My thoughts.

  28. #27

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    You are right of course AlsoRan, but I figured this was a thread for grumping.

  29. #28

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    The problem is that a lot people/non musicians/ looking at "the music products" ...who tell them what is good or bad?

  30. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by Litterick
    Men in shorts are concerning. If you intend to play sitting down, to a camera level with your knees, you should wear proper trousers.
    yes that is the thing that offends me way more than any playing. Male crotch shots, yuk!

  31. #30

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    What the HOLY CRAP STEVE!!! This is NOT a political topic. CRAPP!!!!!! This pisses me off.

  32. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by kris
    The problem is that a lot people/non musicians/ looking at "the music products" ...who tell them what is good or bad?
    Why does it matter? Do you want a Board of Censorship and Quality Assurance that grades videos so people know if someone somewhere things one is "good" and other "bad"?

  33. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone
    Why does it matter? Do you want a Board of Censorship and Quality Assurance that grades videos so people know if someone somewhere things one is "good" and other "bad"?
    ... and don't forget the "ugly" !
    Yes, pun ! but not only.

  34. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by henryrobinett
    What the HOLY CRAP STEVE!!! This is NOT a political topic. CRAPP!!!!!! This pisses me off.
    Seems like guys in California are always pissed off about something. We have unemployment, economic devastation and Covid-19 in Nevada too.

  35. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone
    My dad made an almost indescribably good sausage, blended from a range of meats, some wild, spices, herbs, and even a bit of partial freezing and other mysterious steps. He would give it as Christmas gifts to select friends and family. People would actually come for visits overnight to "see how the sausage is made." Stupid me I took it for granted and never learned "how the sausage was made."

    The intolerance for beginners and hobby players who never get to play for audiences except in their homes and who want to reach out to a somewhat wider circle via YouTube are doing no harm, regardless of how many there are. They can simply be ignored by those not in that circle.

    I continue to want to know how the musical sausage is made, so I watch and even make such abominable video clips. Nobody is compelled to watch them and they can "ignore" me all they want. I am not surprised that my clips only get watched by people with some interest in or link to my feeble playing efforts, or other fellow aspiring sausage makers.
    Absolutely. Many of them never had the opportunities that I had.

  36. #35

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    Do this. Don't show your face if you can avoid it;



    He's rockin' a Fender Bassman amp. That sound fills me full of lust. I want to go to bars and get in all kinds of trouble.
    I love Youtube.

  37. #36

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    It's in my best interest not to post videos. Some stuff on Soundcloud is OK. I haven't given up all hope yet about performance culture. Maybe I should. IDK. I'd have a problem with people videoing at some place where I was playing.
    Get that @$ing cell phone out of my face. This isn't that kind of club.

    Security! We got a trouble maker here..

  38. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by henryrobinett
    What the HOLY CRAP STEVE!!! This is NOT a political topic. CRAPP!!!!!! This pisses me off.
    OK OK. I said I was sorry.

  39. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone
    Why does it matter? Do you want a Board of Censorship and Quality Assurance that grades videos so people know if someone somewhere things one is "good" and other "bad"?
    It is impossible...this is youtube...music freedom.

  40. #39

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    I record a lot of videos of me working on tunes on my iphone then upload them to my google drive and then to my youtube account but I keep most all 99.99% private so only I can view them or send a link to a friend if I want to. But I only add tune after tune of the greats to my playlist, I don't even much know anything else exist on youtube except the artist I look for to add their music to a playlist. SO all this other hoopla doesn't exist in my little world and being a mediocre player at best I keep to myself

  41. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone

    The intolerance for beginners and hobby players who never get to play for audiences except in their homes and who want to reach out to a somewhat wider circle via YouTube are doing no harm, regardless of how many there are. They can simply be ignored by those not in that circle.
    Yes.
    The intolerance, a bad vibe.

  42. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by Litterick
    That phrase, “This is something I'm working on”, should be taken as fair warning. Real artists in any medium produce finished works.
    True, though they also make rough drafts. Anne Lamott stressed the importance of "shitty first drafts" to the creative process.


    Posting them on Facebook is another matter... For that, though, since it is worthwhile to record oneself (to mark progress later), if that's what it takes, then I'm not bothered. (But I'm not going to sit through a lot of it, either.)

    We all suck to begin with.

  43. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by BFrench
    I record a lot of videos of me working on tunes on my iphone then upload them to my google drive and then to my youtube account but I keep most all 99.99% private so only I can view them or send a link to a friend if I want to.
    I've heard other people say they do this too. Very convenient. And private. (Private as you wanna be!) And a convenient way to share. The only way to collaborate from a distance is to send sound files back and forth. Maybe a guitar riff (only), or a bassline, or a drum groove. It's all bits and pieces until it comes together in a whole that seems organic and natural but like sausage and laws, you might not enjoy seeing how it was made.

  44. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by henryrobinett
    What the HOLY CRAP STEVE!!! This is NOT a political topic. CRAPP!!!!!! This pisses me off.
    I deleted the post.

  45. #44

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    There are a lot of videos from music shops.
    Most of them looks the same-guitar with efects/distortion.
    Rock music market?
    Best
    Kris

  46. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by kris
    There are a lot of videos from music shops.
    Most of them looks the same-guitar with efects/distortion.
    Rock music market?
    Best
    Kris
    That's my pet peeve. I was looking an amp. Would you please just play the clean sound.

  47. #46

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    '................................ the posers, the clickbaiters and the second-hand lick salesmen that are all over the place? you can't take someone like Beato seriously and then piss all over someone like dutchbopper.'

    Can someone please explain what this is even supposed to mean?

  48. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackcat
    '................................ the posers, the clickbaiters and the second-hand lick salesmen that are all over the place? you can't take someone like Beato seriously and then piss all over someone like dutchbopper.'

    Can someone please explain what this is even supposed to mean?

  49. #48

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    Man came into the bar... yeah I remember... real oily customer. Said he was a second hand lick salesman on YouTube....

    *record scratch*

    wait a second; aren’t all the licks we learn off records second hand???

  50. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevebol
    That's my pet peeve. I was looking an amp. Would you please just play the clean sound.
    Amen, Brother Steve...

  51. #50

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