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  1. #151

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    Thank you for your replay OldGuitarPlayer, but the O.P., me, didn't ask for "what you think of performing live with backing track" but "where I can get good quality backing tracks" that's all. Now if you know where I can get good quality backing tracks please share.

    Thanks,
    Sandro

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #152

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    This is another way to be a solo artist:


    Hey no backing tracks!!!!!

    Sandro

  4. #153
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandro View Post
    Thank you for your replay OldGuitarPlayer, but the O.P., me, didn't ask for "what you think of performing live with backing track" but "where I can get good quality backing tracks" that's all. Now if you know where I can get good quality backing tracks please share.

    Thanks,
    Sandro
    Ok, I'll play along. Please define "good quality" backing tracks for me? If you take the time to check YouTube you will find literally hundreds of backing tracks for FREE!!! Some ranging from excellent to cheezy. I believe your original question has already been answered.

    My video reply was meant to be educational. Meaning that if you cannot entertain a group of people at a campfire with just your guitar than maybe you should rethink your strategy. This is simply my opinion and like I said I do not care if others use backing tracks however if you have to defend your position about "good quality" backing tracks so vigorously than I think we can see the problem. And no...no working professional musician has ever stole any of my gigs because he/she uses backing tracks. I have had to play several hours with just me and my guitar. Because I can.

    Best of luck with your upcoming future restaurant gig!

  5. #154

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    Thank you for your replay OldGuitarPlayer but at this point I give my feed back to all the replay, I took what ever I need from this thread, all the points have been made and all the positions have been defend, perhaps you enjoy this threat too late.

    Sandro

  6. #155

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    Sandro, I have a lot of good quality backing tracks. PM me with some titles and I'll see if I have any of them.

  7. #156

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    It is business. players can be hard to find. then the gig has to pay for the size of the band...if backing tracks are a good tool...players who have good business skills and marketing skills are going to survive. hold outs refusing to flow with the market will not. seams like cats want to keep doing things the old way, gig for cheap. l will be starting with backing tracks till I find a good drummer for the project.. lots of issues with musicians now days. but the pros that wait for my project to be finished will not be paid as good as the ones who are putting in sweet equity.

  8. #157

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    Since backing tracks have long been accepted on recordings, it's no surprise that most people do not object to their use in live settings....
    "Learn the repertoire. It’s all in the songs. If you learn 200 songs, you will have no problem improvising."
    Frank Vignola

  9. #158

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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkRhodes View Post
    Since backing tracks have long been accepted on recordings, it's no surprise that most people do not object to their use in live settings....
    Context though.... They've long been accepted in recordings ... But what recordings? Can you imagine the apocalyptic outcry if someone recorded a "jazz" album w backing tracks? So what's generally accepted by listeners or even the music community by and large is not always accepted in jazz circles.

  10. #159

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    Aren't we talking jazz here?
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  11. #160

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    Quote Originally Posted by pamosmusic View Post
    Can you imagine the apocalyptic outcry if someone recorded a "jazz" album w backing tracks?
    I don't think there would be one.
    "Learn the repertoire. It’s all in the songs. If you learn 200 songs, you will have no problem improvising."
    Frank Vignola

  12. #161

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    Quote Originally Posted by mr. beaumont View Post
    Aren't we talking jazz here?
    Well, we love jazz guitar and that is why we are here, but people who perform in public, even if they play only jazz, know that members of the audience hear other sorts of music and it influences what they want in terms of musical entertainment. (For that matter, most jazz musicians I know enjoy other sorts of music too.)
    "Learn the repertoire. It’s all in the songs. If you learn 200 songs, you will have no problem improvising."
    Frank Vignola

  13. #162

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    Jazz is all music and no a guitar is not a orchestra . you can not do bass, drums ,keyboards, sax and guitar on one. and that is not a orchestra.. you have to face facts . the target audience for solo guitar is small. but a cruse ship will hire you. I will say it another way, marketing class............ and many times the soloist is playing too backing tracks...may times the supporting music is recoded first.......musicians who make backing tracks are getting paid..well if you are cool you will pay.

  14. #163

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    Backing tracks aren't the same as having bass, drums, keyboards, and sax on the gig either.

  15. #164

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    ^^This reply really open my eyes.

  16. #165

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    Ureeeka

  17. #166

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    your right it is not the same as drums keys and bass... I do not have to worry about backing tracks flaking out and not showing up..or showing up and getting drunk. if the sound is good. then great. if find a drummer with a electric set great . do not talk about rods and brushes that will not give the sound I want.. till then will move forward.

  18. #167

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    Quote Originally Posted by EOE View Post
    your right it is not the same as drums keys and bass... I do not have to worry about backing tracks flaking out and not showing up..or showing up and getting drunk. if the sound is good. then great. if find a drummer with a electric set great . do not talk about rods and brushes that will not give the sound I want.. till then will move forward.
    You could bring Band-in-a-Box guitar soloist to the gig too, then you could have the night off.

  19. #168

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    Hi grahambop.
    I have just had a quick look & listened to your soundcloud clips again,
    and they are mightily impressive, you achieve a very nice tone from
    I guess, your Es175. The youtube clip of Jim Hall with Bob Brookmeyer
    on "I should care " is absolutely exquisite also. Thanks for the post, it's
    a pleasure to listen to these wonderful renditions.



    kind regards
    Silverfoxx

  20. #169
    destinytot Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by OldGuitarPlayer View Post
    Meh...I'd rather listen to someone who doesn't need backing tracks to perform...in any situation. However I don't care if others use them. Whatever makes you happy however....

    This guy is a human jukebox.

    Such joy... and Bucky's smile will light up the largest room.

  21. #170
    destinytot Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by fep View Post

    Hank playing with one of the bands he plays with:

    My kind of pageant, if needs must.

  22. #171

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    Quote Originally Posted by EOE View Post
    your right it is not the same as drums keys and bass... I do not have to worry about backing tracks flaking out and not showing up..or showing up and getting drunk. if the sound is good. then great. if find a drummer with a electric set great . do not talk about rods and brushes that will not give the sound I want.. till then will move forward.
    If you view a drummer showing up with an electronic drumset and without brushes as a positive I think it's pretty clear we have hugely different preferences for playing a gig. If the drummer is playing an electronic drumset I'd be the one to worry about getting drunk.

  23. #172

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    John Pizzarelli has a room full of adults singing "itsy bitsy spider."

    That's commanding an audience, right there. What a performer. What an entertainer.
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  24. #173
    destinytot Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by mr. beaumont View Post
    John Pizzarelli has a room full of adults singing "itsy bitsy spider."

    That's commanding an audience, right there. What a performer. What an entertainer.
    And how about those football (?) references in the improvised lyrics to The Wheel On The Bus?

  25. #174

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    you really think a guitar soloist can deliver the same percussions as a backing track? A few people may like a solo instrumentalist. but they are to few to consider in a business plan. look I play double neck bass and guitar. I can play both necks at the same time and do it effectively , I can even improve solos on both simultaneously . that is great for the show I am working on.. but in a high end restaurant they are there to talk with some nice music creating a atmosphere . not to watch a show. a drummer with a acoustic can not play at a low enough volume for that kind of gig. at least I will not be satisfied with the sound.. been there done that...not much I have not done gig wise.
    Last edited by EOE; 02-10-2015 at 11:50 AM.

  26. #175

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    Quote Originally Posted by mr. beaumont View Post
    What a performer. What an entertainer.
    At the circus he would probably get billing above the jugglers.

  27. #176

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    Quote Originally Posted by silverfoxx View Post
    Hi grahambop.
    I have just had a quick look & listened to your soundcloud clips again,
    and they are mightily impressive, you achieve a very nice tone from
    I guess, your Es175. The youtube clip of Jim Hall with Bob Brookmeyer
    on "I should care " is absolutely exquisite also. Thanks for the post, it's
    a pleasure to listen to these wonderful renditions.



    kind regards
    Silverfoxx
    Thanks very much Silverfoxx. Yes all the electric guitar stuff was done on the Gibson.

  28. #177

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    Quote Originally Posted by EOE View Post
    look I play double neck bass and guitar. I can play both necks at the same time and do it effectively , I can even improve solos on both simultaneously .
    That is very impressive, in fact I'm trying to picture how it's done.

  29. #178

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    grahanbop asked .That is very impressive, in fact I'm trying to picture how it's done.

    I have Michael Angelo Batio ( who is the master of multi neck playing) string dampers on the necks. the instrument is on a guitar stand. necks pointing up at about 10oclok. left hand is fingering normal using all taps .hammers etc. the right hand frets over the top of the bass neck. taps and hammers. can also play it more traditional doing taps ..but over under is more effective.. but the down side is I can not do pick techniques like pinch harmonics et.. can not do flamenco or classical finger styles which I draw on heavily...or slap bass .. so while it does look cool the soloing is limited in tones I can get so I still need a band to achieve a sonic landscape that satisfies me. I have got rid of all my hang-ups that I think slows musicians down. like not using backing tracks or loops etc..having to play a 2000.00 dollar guitar.

  30. #179

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    Quote Originally Posted by cosmic gumbo View Post
    At the circus he would probably get billing above the jugglers.
    Puppet show still gets top billing.
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  31. #180
    I play in a trio with a bass player and a drummer and they always show up on time and don't get drunk on the gig.
    This is because they consider themselves professionals. We always never make less than $100 each for a 2 hr gig. If someone justifies using backing tracks because they don't have to worry bout flakey or drunk musicians than they need to play with a higher caliber of working musicians. Having had to sit through a set of backing tracks by a local pop singer it gets very boring and tedious and after 30 mins I left. I guess it's ok for the "fern bar" crowd who aren't really paying attention however if that's your target audience than why bother with backing tracks at all? Just play your guitar quietly in the corner and still get paid. I've done it plenty of times.

  32. #181

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    even with a bass and a drummer I will still use backing tracs.. my understudy plays bass, percussions and keys. now that using backing tracks no longer bothers me they will be a part of my acts. until I can afford a 9 or 10 pic band that is.

  33. #182

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    Somewhat related, I saw Beck (the guy who just stole the grammy from Beyonce ) at a small gig at Northwestern University some years back...just him and his guitar player and a drum machine (and old Roland thing)

    Near the end of the show, he had the drum machine take a drum solo. It was great.
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  34. #183

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    My question is, if a player is only making $200 for a gig, is it reasonable to expect him to split that with 3 other people because...Jazz?
    $200 doesn't seem like "lemme split this up" kind of money.

  35. #184

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    That's why you play larger group jazz gigs for your soul and make your money in the local wedding band, or something.

    Or play solo.
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  36. #185

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    200 dollars is not enough really for one.. backing tracks are a industry standard and lots of acts use them at some level.. I look to people who make good money and many of them use backing tracks loppers and other types of sampled music. I apologize if offend anyone but if you are only making 300. dollars for a 2 hr show for three people you are each making a profit of what 10. dollars? at best 50. dollars? your advice and opinions is not something I want to copy..quite the opposite . it is a example of what not to do.

  37. #186

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    Quote Originally Posted by EOE View Post
    200 dollars is not enough really for one.. backing tracks are a industry standard and lots of acts use them at some level.. I look to people who make good money and many of them use backing tracks loppers and other types of sampled music. I apologize if offend anyone but if you are only making 300. dollars for a 2 hr show for three people you are each making a profit of what 10. dollars? at best 50. dollars? your advice and opinions is not something I want to copy..quite the opposite . it is a example of what not to do.
    When I was at jazz camp last summer, we had a small course on technology. One of the faculty guitarist talked about how he gigs with his looper pedals and iPad. It was pretty impressive how he uses technology to create sets and arrange music on the fly.

  38. #187
    Quote Originally Posted by EOE View Post
    200 dollars is not enough really for one.. backing tracks are a industry standard and lots of acts use them at some level.. I look to people who make good money and many of them use backing tracks loppers and other types of sampled music. I apologize if offend anyone but if you are only making 300. dollars for a 2 hr show for three people you are each making a profit of what 10. dollars? at best 50. dollars? your advice and opinions is not something I want to copy..quite the opposite . it is a example of what not to do.

    I don't understand your math. If my trio gets paid a minimum of of $300 (we usually make more than that) for a 2 hr show that is $100 each or $50 an hour each. I pay everyone in my group equally including myself. Sometimes I pay myself less because my band is so good! You should try hiring competent musicians sometime. It's a lot more fun than playing to canned music.

  39. #188

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    Quote Originally Posted by EOE View Post
    200 dollars is not enough really for one.. backing tracks are a industry standard and lots of acts use them at some level.. I look to people who make good money and many of them use backing tracks loppers and other types of sampled music. I apologize if offend anyone but if you are only making 300. dollars for a 2 hr show for three people you are each making a profit of what 10. dollars? at best 50. dollars? your advice and opinions is not something I want to copy..quite the opposite . it is a example of what not to do.
    That depends .... First of all if the industry is improvising music or jazz then backing tracks are absolutely not the industry standard. Saying they're okay is one thing and it's certainly your prerogative but they're most definitely not an "industry standard" ... I also put loops and samples in a different category than boppin' along to Stella with a backing track band. Also ... There's a difference of perspective. I'm not an act ... I'm a musician ... W backing tracks the music isn't as good. Again ... My opinion... But that's end of story for me
    Last edited by pamosmusic; 02-11-2015 at 03:35 PM.

  40. #189

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    the math.. what were your expenses?.. how much fuel? was there a meal involved? was there at least one rehearsal? you have to figure in space even if you own the space has to be figured in for tax purposes. what were the expenses on that? was there miscellaneous expenses? just saying I know from past spreadsheets.. not a lot of profit there. I do not have anyone on my list that will work for that.. 200. minimum is the cheapest cat on my list. my understudy works for free but that will most likely not last over a year and I will have to pay him. I do not like all jazz bands ... lot of trios etc . I would not go see...just saying .
    Last edited by EOE; 02-11-2015 at 04:50 PM.

  41. #190

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    Again, we have met the enemy, and he is us.
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  42. #191

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    I am working on a series of home recordings that I would term "work tapes" of jazz standards that essentially are three tracks - two classical guitar and a vocal. Occasionally I add a synth bass track. I term them 'work tapes' because they are not fine tuned in a computer DAW with comped tracks, extensive dynamics processing, etc. And I would never use Autotune, which I consider a form of fraud. I think the results are pretty good.

    I find it is harder to overdub oneself well than to play with other musicians live. But I could see doing a restaurant gig or wine tasting or private party with well executed backing tracks that are in effect recorded as one take "live" tracks.
    The point is that the music becomes more complex and rich imo. I'm also comfortable doing chord melody instrumental versions or voice plus guitar accompaniment live. I just like to go beyond the limitations of live solo performance. And if a restaurant proprietor is willing to pay me for a gig with this format, I would not turn it down. Nothing replaces a live jazz trio or quintet, but these days economic reality rears its ugly head. It ain't the Fifties in Manhattan anymore.

    Jay
    Last edited by targuit; 02-11-2015 at 06:11 PM.

  43. #192

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    Even as a listener/consumer, I would never stick around a bar listening to someone playing to tracks. At that point why not just play in a wedding band to make money?

  44. #193

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    well as a consumer I would never stick around a bar to listen to anyone rofl. I am sick of bars.

  45. #194

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    How can you even call it McJazz unless you use backing tracks on your McGig?

  46. #195

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    Quote Originally Posted by EOE View Post
    well as a consumer I would never stick around a bar to listen to anyone rofl. I am sick of bars.
    So where are you playing these play along gigs?

  47. #196

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    Maybe Jazzapalooza....

  48. #197

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    upscale restaurants pay better have you even been following the thread? and if you can read I said " as a consumer" so ill help you here is the definition. a person who acquires goods and services for his or her own personal needs .. if you are performing in the bar you are not a consumer. I know i am a bad writer but did not think that was that bad, cosmic I have been to way to many jazzapaloozas and rockpalozas to old for that now .lolol
    Last edited by EOE; 02-11-2015 at 11:38 PM.

  49. #198

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    Well this is devolving to be more unpleasant than interesting so I'll leave it there. I guess all I meant to say was if having the rest of the band be recorded what value are you really adding, might as well just play pandora. But if you make your bread on it more power to you.

  50. #199

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    and that is the bottom line money...I remember at 18 when I told my rock band I was going on the road in a country band ..they all called me a sell out 3 years latter I was still full time musician and they had day jobs. that band leader taught me a lot about music.

  51. #200

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    There's a place near me, a Vietnamese restaurant I used to frequent where the musicians played jazz with backing tracks. I'm assuming this is what they expect, or it doesn't pay enough to cover a band.