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To make a living and career with music, what can a jazz musician do? Just out of curiosity, my plan is to study jazz at uni (college), some people I know doing that are also doing gigs and such at the same time, but after that what can a jazz musician do? I definitely want to make music my career but I don't know exactly what I can do. Also if anybody who's been through that has any tips it would be greatly appreciated, cheers
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11-04-2011 06:55 PM
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A lot of jazz musicians are good typists or have a lot of experience pulling espresso.
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There are always burgers that need flipping...
For the record, I've been considering going back to school for music. It would be purely for the education and enjoyment of it, though. I'm sure I'll still be building homes and doing guitar tech work to pay the bills.
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Elderly Inst. has bumper stickers - " Real Muscians Have Day Jobs ".
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Yes everybody, that's what my worry is. What are music related jobs for a jazz musician to make a living playing music? While no doubt I'll end up flipping burgers by day and doing the little order voice box at maccas by night that's not what I'm aiming for.
Originally Posted by morroben
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The stark reality is that the supply exceeds the demand.
I guess that's why you've got to really love it to put in the time to play it.
I went to music school to study jazz and classical guitar and wouldn't exchange that experience. Its given me a lifetime of things to study and really accelerated my musical growth.
When I was young and single, I didn't mind paying my dues, driving a humility mobile, and living in a roach motel. Getting married somehow changed that. I got a day job - BUT kept plowing the music field too. Its give & take - seasons with more music, and seasons with less.
Instead of flipping burgers, go after a job that may give you a better standard of living. Eight hours is eight hours, whether you are flipping burgers or working in technology. But one pays a lot better than the other - and you ultimately get to lay hold of some better gear.
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You could move to some of the busiest jazz cities in the world, and you still wouldn't be able to make a living performing jazz. It would be easier to move to Hollywood and be an actor.
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It largely depends on the area you live, but from my research and observations(I know a lot of professional musicians) it is generally not as bleak as people make it seem. Most pro musicans ive talked too actually have to turn down tons of gigs. The only catch is, you have to be willing to work your ass off. Most musicians either can't (family restraints etc) or aren't willing to put the time in necessary to make it happen. There's gonna be a few years of 8+ hours practice a day, plus hours to arrange each gig, promotion etc. (I'm just now starting to get going myself, today I spent 3 hours just calling people to get everything straight for a gig later this month) If you want it bad enough you can make it happen, don't let people tell you otherwise. You just gotta decide if you are willing to make the sacrifices necessary. Kiss your social life goodbye.
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What social life? I'm spending all my time in the woodshed anyway. Next holidays I might do the Bird 16hrs a day woodshedding... maybe. I know musicians who need to turn down gigs too but it seems it's because every Friday night they can only do one gig and nobody's looking for them on a Tuesday. Of course if it's practicing it doesn't feel like work and any pre-gig organizing I've had to do hasn't been bad as the pre-gig excitement keeps me motivated and the post-gig perks pay off. So essentially I get what you're saying and I think I'd be fine to do all that. But to make a living, what are specific things to do, to work towards etc?
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Get reallllllly fucking good. Learn tons of songs, aim for one a week. Make connections. Get your face out there, let people know what you are doing. I still have a long way to go myself, but im doing well considering how long ive been playing jazz, and ive done a lot of research. The thing all the greats have in common is that they worked hard as hell and played with as many people as they could.
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Here's an answer that might help, even if its not what you might be expecting.
In college I majored in music composition, the one major with possibly even lower potential for leading to a job than studying jazz. I played guitar in the jazz big band, and even got to write a few charts that we took and played in some of the local clubs. At the time I had no idea how I 'd make a living, but music was what I wanted to study.
After graduating, I moved to LA (on the advice of my composition teacher). Within a year I was working for a record company, the distributor at the time for Verve Records. The work was in sales, not directly related to performing, but I got to hear (and in some cases meet and hang out with) a lot of great, top musicians. I also met a lot of local guys, some of whom I ended up playing gigs with.
After 10 years I went in a completely different direction, working in high-tech. But luck crossed my path there, in part because of my musical education, and now I work mainly on a successful music software program. Again, I'm not playing for a living, but it uses my musical knowledge and keeps me in touch with music-minded folks, while paying the bills.
So if you want to study music badly enough, I say go for it. Your life will find a way (that you probably won't see in advance) of pulling you in the direction of what you love.
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Good question. Jazz has not been popular for about 50 years. 50 YEARS!!!! Originally Posted by SammieWammie
To make a living and career with music, what can a jazz musician do? Just out of curiosity, my plan is to study jazz at uni (college), some people I know doing that are also doing gigs and such at the same time, but after that what can a jazz musician do? I definitely want to make music my career but I don't know exactly what I can do. Also if anybody who's been through that has any tips it would be greatly appreciated, cheers
When is the last time you heard jazz on the pop radio stations?
So major in something else more useful. Play jazz/take lessons on the side. Weddings during the open bar period, senior citizen centers, bars after 9 PM, etc.
How's that sound? Pretty cool right?Last edited by Drumbler; 11-05-2011 at 07:40 AM.
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Jazz may not be popular outside the jazz world but big artists still alive still do sold out shows. And if I'm looking to be a musician in general, jazz is probably the most useful thing to master, a jazz musician could no doubt pull of a blues or rock or pop song but a blues or rock or pop musician couldn't pull of a traditional jazz piece. My experience is that jazz musicians I know well can and do play other genres better than people who solely play those genres. After studying a bit (lot) of jazz myself my abilities in every part of musicianship and my technique I can think of have gotten unbelievably better, and I'm not a particularly good jazz player yet. As for the last time I heard jazz on pop radio stations I heard Virtual Insanity by Jamiroquai not long ago, although far from traditional jazz seeing as it's got some funk and soul mixed in, the harmony is very much jazz based. I should extend my question as well, what can a musician do to make a living in the general music world if this musician can play a variety of genres including jazz (there must be more opportunities for a good jazz/alround musician than a solely pop singer/songwriter like there are so many of in this world).
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I think I misunderstood your original question. Are you asking what types of jobs you can get? (I thought you were talking about preperation at first)
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I was originally asking what jobs one could get or schemes one could do to make it as a (jazz) musician. Then once I have an idea of that I can think of specific things to achieve that. Of course to call yourself a jazz musician you need to be reallllllly fucking good as you said, and I'm working on that all the time, working on making connections, working on getting my music out there, working on my 2nd Bird head (the B section of Confirmation is a bitch), working on improvisation etc.
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my career is as a Jazz Musician, my job is a Jazz educator/
my career hasn't done much in the last 3 years. my job is amazing. I have a car that works, an apartment to myself, I get to play the music I want to and don't have to compromise myself by taking gigs I don't want to take or play with people I don't want to play with.
I an a rare individual that I get to do this because of my job where I go to work every day and play guitar all day, talk about music with exciting people and young men and women who want to know more. I get to go home and practice or work on whatever I want to because I don't have to hustle gigs. But i make long term goals and have accomplished nearly all of them thanks to my Job... a job i take very seriously and am passionate about... and a job I'm lucky to have.
The very intellegent, or business savy people can make a living off just playing Jazz. They also have to be in the very elite in terms of their ability to play. Going to school for music can assist you in that process, but really it's all on you, the individual how good you get as a player/writer and that for the vast majority a life as just a player is something most will never acchieve, and that really actually is more then just a jazz thing, that is most styles of music.
tl.dr
musicians life is hard, it's not for everyone. you need a fall back plan, come at it with open eyes and you'll get by.
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You might go to a school and major in Getting Famous.
You could sell a kidney. Make sure you get a good deal though, you're only going to want to do this once.
Attitude is very important. Many great jazz musicians will accept being poor on the way to becoming well known. After they're well known, this attitude helps because they still remain poor.
Retail and service industry are good training for surviving on the pay scale of a decent jazz gig. Have you ever fasted? I find that's good training for surviving on the take home pay after carfare and parking fees.
Girlfriend? What do you call a jazz musician without a girlfriend? ... homeless.
Now if you're a good improvisor, you'll think outside the box. Maybe you could get a job part time as a poet on an independent cable news channel.
Have you thought about being one of the top 1%? That would answer your question quite nicely. It works for them.
Hmmm, those are the best prospects and secrets I can think of. Please don't spread the word around too much, competition is tough enough as it is!
DavidLast edited by TH; 11-05-2011 at 10:26 AM.
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Hahahahahahahahaha! Brazil...
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That video has a lot of great points. "Waffles will make you famous." I know what I'm going to be eating for the next few years...
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Berklee caf has a kick ass waffle maker. Remember that if you're debating the merits of applying there. Originally Posted by SammieWammie
David
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If you are thinking about doing this, remember that you have to have multiple income streams. You can't survive on gigs alone. As SSSwung said, you can get a million calls for a gig Friday night, but guess what? Friday night you can only be in one place!
What do you do the other 6 nights of the week? Here are some thoughts... 1.) Teach. 2.) Write a book. 3.) Record a CD to sell. Want to know the kicker? All of those options are just as unstable as gigs! LOL. You can book lessons and the student doesn't show, or pays you with a hot check, you can write or record and nobody buys it!
The folks that do this sucessfully are few and far between, but there are some. It is the same with any field. If you wanted to be a Financial Advisor, or sell Insurance I would tell you the same thing, "Go for it, but have a solid business plan before you do and understand the risks. "
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Go to nursing school.
It's common for a nurse to work three consecutive days a week, 12 hour days, full benefits, pretty good pay, honorable work. Work Monday Tuesday & Wednesday, spend the rest of the week being a musician.
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I figured I'd chime in on this subject. I went to the Atlanta Institute of Music, and made my living as a guitar player in the Atlanta area for a year. That city has a lot of music to go around, and it wasn't hard to pay bills with gigs, teaching, etc. However, I moved back to California(where I'm from) a few years back, and am just now finding enough "ins" to be able to support myself. For a while I was a dishwasher. But I met the right people and I gig now on average 3 nights a week, and balance having students on Saturday mornings. In order to make it work for you you need to balance having a few sources of income. I teach students on the weekends, gig on the weekends, and host a jam night at a local bar every other Wednesday. Now I'm not playing a ton of jazz gigs. The majority of my gigs are with a top 40 cover band, but I am able to pepper in a few latin jazz gigs on occasion. I am still going to school though, working to get my degree in Music Education, where I can hopefully get a job as a high school band director and then go back and work on getting my Master's degree.
Basically, it's a really tough life. I have my anniversary coming up in a few weeks with my girl, and guess what, I had to book a gig that night to make ends meet for the week. She understands, but I would have rather not worked that day. Working a lot of different things in music can be quite draining, but if you really love it go for it. If you are passionate enough about doing it you can make it happen. When you get to school you just need to talk to the right people, and get working doing this stuff as soon as possible.
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I was studying jazz in college and was hemming and hawing on whether that was what I wanted to do with my life and someone gave me some good advice:
"If you have to think about it then maybe it's not for you. If it is a compulsion and you can't see yourself doing anything else then there is your answer"
So I switched my major to Economics and I still love playing music as much as I did when I was 14 and just starting out. My friends that do it full-time have come to think of it as a job.
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For what it's worth, I started giving guitar lessons professionally, out of high school (in 2002) and I've been doing only that ever since and it's worked really well for me. I haven't gone to college. I don't work for a company, it's just me (I can link to my website via pm if anybody is interested; I fear googlebots on this forum) and I've made a good living only working 25-30 hours a week or so.
However, I'm in the minority. I enjoy teaching beginners, I seem to have a knack for it and I get the vast majority of my clients via word of mouth. Being reliable, responsible, and personable has helped probably more than any musical skills.
If I struggle I can get two hours a day to practice amid teaching, emailing parents, setting up lessons, grocery shopping, etc, but even that doesn't often happen. I'm applying to school for fall 2012 so i can get more time to play, practice, learn, and I think the likely scenario is that when i'm done with school I'll simply still be teaching but have more gigs. Better case scenario is that I can teach who I want and when I want but have more high profile gigs (or higher profile teaching jobs) to make up my income.
For me I know teaching is probably more financially promising than gigging, so the decision to go to school is definitely going to be a few steps backwards financially, but I figure it's worth it because I want to play music instead of always just showing other people how to play music.
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