15 chord?

[bako]

Full extension chords from note collections (scales) of more than 7 notes could be named with numbers including 15, 17, 19, 21, 23.

These occur with extensions of 8-12 note structures.
Apart from these kind of sounds being less familiar problems arise from the use of a naming system with 7 letters.
Post tonal theory numbers the notes 0-11 and calls them pitch class.
Name choice can be challenging when you are playing just a crunchier version of tonal movements.
Post tonal theory believes it wrong to describe music tonally that is not following tonal conventions.
Personally I don't fully believe in atonality when I can still hear resolutions between chords.
Maybe there are too many direct modulations, I see it as a shortcoming of my ears to keep up with complexities.
Post tonalists also use the word centricity to explain when one pitch class is featured over others.
I can get behind this idea. Dave Leibman in his book on chromatic harmony likes the idea of multi tiered slash chords because it gives insight into some component parts that can be played off of, perhaps a more multi chordal approach than the scalar approach conveyed by 7 note extended chord names.

When these ideas start manifesting on leadsheets with regularity we will have to deal with naming conventions as a collective.
Till that day it will be at times confusing.

[Reg]

Originally Posted by dfhwze

Suppose you're using a post-gregorian scale with altered major and minor thirds (GEGBDF#AC#..), you encounter the augmented 15th at C#. However, rather dissonant, 15th chords become available for passing use.

Very funny... and OK in your context, Reg

[larry graves]

If there was such a chord, it would be called a compound octave, no earthly use, the 13th is our ceiling [major 6th with a dom7]--11#[flat5],flat9 etc.
We're in the moving dominant business[around the cycle]. If that sounds too simple, get a copy of the LCCTO, Ive just received mine. No pain no gain.LG..

[timscarey]

Originally Posted by larry graves

We're in the moving dominant business[around the cycle]. If that sounds too simple, get a copy of the LCCTO, Ive just received mine. No pain no gain.LG..

There are a lot of theories of music, I am of the mind that investigation and understanding of as many points of view as possible is a good objective.

Just because the traditional system of writing chord symbols is so widely used, doesn't mean that our personal musical mind must be limited to a notation system. I never advocated for the use of such a chord symbol, it was just an observation that this particular voicing for a dominant b9 sounds vastly different from others, and thus, has a slightly different function.

not sure what the LCCTO is.

[timscarey]

Originally Posted by larry graves

no earthly use

I cannot agree with this statement, having heard the chord and used it, it sounds very different from a traditional dom(b9)

[larry graves]

Tim.What does it look like in a chord box. If I can play it I'll use it. The LCCTO means--The Lydian Chromatic Concept of Tonal Organization [the Concept], by George Russell.It's rocket science with a pick. the fourth edition costs about a £150.00. If you have the wedge and are serious
about enhancing your jazz vocabulary,buy it! Or steal it, you'll need serious cell time to learn it. LG..

[timscarey]

One example would be somthing like this


e---X-----1----X---X-----X---
b---4-----1----1---X-----1---
g---5-----3----0---3-----1----
d---5-----3----2---2-----1----
a---X-----4----4---4-----X---
e---4-----X----X---X-----1---


if the bass player plays Ab---- Db---- C-- C-- F----
Then you get the tention and resolution of the root to the 7th. At least thats how I hear it. I often use this voicing to get some added dissonance to the old (b9)

The Lydian Chromatic concept is definatley worth spending more time with, I've taken a gander but never jumped in all the way.

[eddue]

Originally Posted by timscarey

Anyone on here ever heard of a 15 chord?
There is a big band composer named Jim Knapp here in seattle who uses them in his tunes. wondering if this is just a thing he does or if other people do it too.

While I'm asking, ever heard of a # or b 12 chord. Dave Peck, a local pianist uses that name for a chord type. Same question, ever heard of it?

I just saw this thread, didn't want to restart any controversy but...

When I think of a "15 chord" I don't think 15th chord but 1,5 chord as in power chords played by rock guitarists (R,5 or R,5,R). Either a 2 or 3 note chord with the root on the 6th or 5th strings with no 3rd played.

While it technically may not be a chord and certainly much simpler than previous descriptions, I thought it might be interesting if to mention even though it probably isn't what the OP had in mind.