Giant Steps - Page 2

oleo20 · #31 04-11-2009, 11:10 AM

ahhh i get it!!!

by playing a B7 arpeggio up to the 9th ie

B D# F# A C#

you are playing the #4 #5 b9 3rd and #5

and also by adding the F natural into the B7 arp (ie maiking it a B7#11 sound) you are playing an F augmented Triad.

Is this correct MW?

m78w · #32 04-12-2009, 12:06 AM

You can use arpeggios, lick, patterns or scales, anything your ear tells you is cool. More modern guys use this a lot, Martino tended to stick pretty close to the changes of the tune, with most of his subs being alterations of the underlying chord or just the tri-tone.

MW

renema · #33 04-12-2009, 02:24 PM

You are right, if you have enough technique to play very fast and clean notes, you can play almost anything, you don't even need to follow the chord changes. Everything goes especially in tunes like Giant Steps where there is no clear tonal center. Listen to Mc Laughlin's "Do You Hear The Voices You Left Behind?".

Luan · #34 04-12-2009, 09:20 PM

Finally a good approach to giant steps, using viagra!

renema · #35 04-16-2009, 07:37 PM

Mc Laughlin & Chick Corea don't need Viagra. I am sure you will enjoy this video showing the transcription of Mc Laughlin's solo.
Do You Hear The Voices You Left Behind?

JohnW400 · #36 04-16-2009, 10:16 PM

Smokin' as always. I've listend to him since the 70's. I think he is one of the overall best guitar players there is.

franco6719 · #37 04-17-2009, 03:26 AM

Fascinating "living" transcription software there. Amazing. And the playing as well, of course.

heavyblues · #38 04-18-2009, 02:45 AM

The article mentions playing 3-6 instead of 3-7(chords)...WHAT THE HECK? I know I only know basic theory, but since when did 6 become the new 7? If somebody can please tell me the idea behind this and when to do it, I would really appreciate since the article doesn't say when it must be used. If you can tell me where I can find this idea in mark levine's 'jazz bible', I would also highly appreciate that too. Thanks for the help!

I haven't tried the 1-3-5, 1-3-5-7, 1-2-3-5 --ascending/descending idea for following the changes, but I am so damn excited because I have a feeling this is really going to work!

heavyblues · #39 04-18-2009, 02:50 AM

Hey guys, thought I would share this for people that want more ideas on constucting motifs for giant steps type changes. I'm sure gonna use it.

Giant Steps

m78w · #40 04-18-2009, 10:56 AM

Hey Heavyblues,

The 6 on a major chord can be substituted for the 7 in any comping situation as long as it doesn't interfere with the melody line.

The 6 has a more "mellow" sound than the 7th which can be used effectively in certain situations.

MW

Luan · #41 04-18-2009, 11:02 AM

And sometimes it's even needed, if the melody is the root, you shouldn't comp with a maj7

heavyblues · #42 04-19-2009, 12:16 AM

ahh, thanks a lot guys. So If the melody has a lot of the root note in it, the 7th would clash with the root as it is a half step away, so 1-3-5-6 would be a better choice then?

I can dig that

604bourne123 · #43 04-19-2009, 12:30 AM

facing the brick wall again;richard

Luan · #44 04-19-2009, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by heavyblues

ahh, thanks a lot guys. So If the melody has a lot of the root note in it, the 7th would clash with the root as it is a half step away, so 1-3-5-6 would be a better choice then?

I can dig that

or even a b9 in some cases, and that gets worse.

skei · #45 04-23-2009, 02:29 AM

Fascinating,
and well done, both the playing and the transcript style. Fascinating these days, fascinating...
Peace
Skei (the enjoying sun and warmth for the first time this year one)

Quote:

Originally Posted by renema

Mc Laughlin & Chick Corea don't need Viagra. I am sure you will enjoy this video showing the transcription of Mc Laughlin's solo.
Do You Hear The Voices You Left Behind?

dirkji · #46 04-23-2009, 04:35 AM

@ Renema: great stuf man, good idea to use Band in a Box in conjunction with Camtesia.

604bourne123 · #47 04-23-2009, 05:59 AM

hi skei yes today was sunny pretty nice got a shot of viagra too.giant steps is such a cool word it reminds me when i was 13 and walking down the street and you would take these giant steps instead of little ones it felt neat.as we all say this lesson is a humdinger it needs study and time which i have and i intend to try and grasp aa of it.604 bourne 123

604bourne123 · #48 04-23-2009, 07:14 AM

iwas here .Theory is so easy to the actual music,this is what I love.

Luan · #49 04-23-2009, 01:29 PM

lol what

Stringbean · #50 04-23-2009, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m78w

There is a second part dealing with chords but it hasn't been put up on the site yet, I'm sure it'll be up shortly.

Also yep it's in B.

MW

Thanks for the lesson. One question about this part:
"Even though we do not have a root in our voicings, these two note chords outline the harmonic function of each chord.

The 3rd will tell us whether the chord is major or minor
The 7th will tell us whether the chord is major, dominant or minor seventh"

Does this work because, we know the tune and our brains are sort of silently playing the roots?

m78w · #51 04-23-2009, 01:50 PM

It can work on this tune, or any other tune, because the root is "implied" like you said. Try it out with just a 2-5-1, or over a blues, it's surprising how well you can hear the chords move without using the roots, just the 3rds and 7ths.

MW

Stringbean · #52 04-23-2009, 02:30 PM

I see... when you say "hear the chords move" I get a better picture of what's going on. What comes before and after helps to establish those 3rds and 7ths. I tend to get a bit static when studying harmony.

franco6719 · #53 04-25-2009, 05:09 AM

These are great insights into playing over "Steps", MW. I find that I really need to keep working on my arpeggios and vertical cross-string playing as opposed to more horizontal approaches when I run across tunes like Giant Steps and these lessons lay it out well.

It's a great deal of work, which is good. But I think I will set aside a few months to mastering just this material at some point. There are so many damned tunes to learn (or re-learn) for one thing.

m78w · #54 04-25-2009, 10:01 AM

Glad you dug the lesson Franco!

MW

604bourne123 · #55 04-25-2009, 12:51 PM

giant steps is easy to read but to memorize the ascending descending arps is really head banging then to recall the patterns as the music flows takes practice then the alt scale is starting to take effect but all and all push forward till it becomes second nature.thanks so much M.W./Dirk/franco/blackbirds/new strings.Richard

franco6719 · #56 04-26-2009, 04:29 AM

The only othet thing I could recommend on Giant Steps is to listen to the tune, espcially the original version, as much as you can. Eventually the sound of the changes (difficult as they are) gets embedded in your brain, just like a II-V-I pattern or any tune. This way, if you get lost or play something that just sounds wrong, you can always find you way back by ear.

604bourne123 · #57 04-26-2009, 01:18 PM

hi franco:got a book from a friend of mine who is also a musician by abersold/deals with coltrane changes going around the circle keeping melodic patterns within the changes chromatically.

franco6719 · #58 04-27-2009, 03:49 AM

Yeah, the Aebersold stuff is very good. There are usually backing tracks that go along with each "idea" or player, etc.. so you can also hear and play along. I know he has one on Giant Steps at different tempos, one on Two-Five-Ones In Giant Steps. I think he has another one (disk) on Coltrane Changes in different keys.

604bourne123 · #59 04-27-2009, 01:23 PM

hi franco: In british columbia we have a very good library system I got a que on Mark Levine,s jazz theory that you hear so much about can't wait?