MIke Longo -- rethinking licks and vocabulary

[Bobby Marshall]

I already Swing now but do it by feel....and tuplets are in my lines- it is natural for me to do.

I just never thought of them as Polyrhythms though..

I have experimented with 5/4 or 7/4 Rhythm Guitar Parts in
4/4 but those are Polymetric and Polyrhythmic ...right?

When Rhythms go over the Bar Line but Sync on the
1 every 4 bars or 7 bars- those are technically Polyrhythmic and Polymetric ...where 6 against 4
12-8 as in Jazz Swing usually resolve within the Bar ( or are in continuous Sync ) so are Polyrhythmic
but not Polymetric ?

I guess I always thought of over the Bar lines Patterns as being Polyrhythmic - I don't hear that in early BeBop...

I hear it when I copy some of Brecker's quintuplets and other tuplets ...which go over the Bar Lines and eventually 'Sync' on the 1 ?

Some observations and regurgitation of knowledge gleaned from personal experience and other sources indirectly such as Mr. Longo and Mr. Gillespie:

Triplets over a single beat are not a polyrhythm. A triplet played over a measure where another instrument is playing in 2 or 4 (beats per measure)is a polyrhythm. This also applies to playing with 5 or 7 beats within a measure where another instrument playing 4 beats or 6 beats. And it is worth saying that you don't literally have to play all of the notes, but play based on the structure of that feel.

Playing 5/4 over the bar line of 4/4 and synchronizing after 5 bars is polymetric, a polymeter. Polymeters share their subdivisions (downbeats, upbeats, etc.). In general, polyrhythms share very few subdivisions with each pothet and might only share the down of 1, and sometimes also the down of 3. But this is only if the second rhythm starts on the down of 1, but I digress.

Basically polyrhythm means the voices having two or more time feels at the same time that sync after each measure. Polymeter means the feels sync after more than 1 measure.

The more you can ingrain these feels, the more simple they become. And eventually it becomes part of your musicianship which frees you to play rhythmically instead of thinking rhythmically. We all think when performing but, at some point, certain aspects of our performance happen without thought, meaning we start to literally play music, stream of consciousness type stuff.

I guess I should have been a stand up philospopher. Hope it was helpful.

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

[Robertkoa]

My orientation is tight time by feel ..but Notation would be difficult because I read like a 8 week piano student ...lol.

And when creating Polymetric Harmonic Rhythms that actuall fit and groove well- they can be difficult to count.

There was a point where Longo was talking about 6/8 against 5/4 and 7/4 and putting the 1 in a different spot- a cool idea.


Excellent Summary - reinforced mostly what I was thinking ...Longo was doing Polymetric and Polyrhythmic stuff on two simultaneous drum parts which are not overtly present as Harmonic Rhythms in BeBop.


I am interested in that more for Composition of actual Harmonic Rhythms which do that ...not what he was referring to.

He seems to be referring to odd note groupings and tuplets in the Melodic/ improvised lines which can be squeezed in while playing to a conform to 4/4.











Definitely Helps .

[rlrhett]

Even though I struggled with technical issues on the DVDs he put out on rhythm, the concept seems very interesting.

From what I’ve seen, I agree. He isn’t really talking about “swinging “. He is very specifically talking about the rhythm underpinnings of bebop phrasing. It is about understanding simultaneous 3/4, 6/8, 4/4, 5/4 rhythms and how they play together.

And it isn’t African clave either. As he says, you don’t travel to Africa and hear bebop phrases being played in the streets.

It is an integral part of the bebop language that he feels has been overlooked and neglected. When you hear/see his demonstrations, it is hard not to be convinced he’s right.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk