Transcribing

alwaysharp · #1 01-30-2012, 12:54 PM

Hello all. Just a quick rant on my new found love of transcribing. I'm sure everybody know's how important it is already, but I wanted to post something for people that may be like me. Transcribing was always a daunting task and I would easily get overwhelmed and kinda forget about it. I don't consider myself a pro by any means but I don't consider myelf a total beginner either. That being said I kept wondering why I just can never cross that threshold like some of the better players I know. I think there's always a need to improve one's knowledge of the fretboard so finding the right notes is not an issue; but beyond that I think transcription is the key. I used to bite off more than I could chew transcribing and I would get overwhelmed. Awhile ago I heard a nice Bill Frisell solo and decided I wanted to learn it. So I did. And things just started snowballing from there. I've since transcribed some Chris Potter and right now I'm learning some Sonny Rollins. People say to analyze what they're doing and that's true; but I believe it's just as important just to play along and get a sense of their feel. And coneptually the ideas they're playing, where they're starting and stopping phrases, how they manipulate one motif to become something èlse. The things that are sort of intangible, or at least impossible to trully get from a book. Anyway, that was a long winded way of saying that one should transcribe. Find a solo you enjoy and want to learn, I think that's important, keep it simple and just go for it. Slowly at first and go from there. It does get easier. If you're like me an get overwhelmed, pick an nice simple solo to start and just do a littl bit at a time. You'll find yourself improving like crazy. Take care all.

kris · #2 01-30-2012, 01:02 PM

I like to hear nice solo and transcribe it.
Sometimes it is hard work and sometimes not.
Transcibing solos open your eyes.

alwaysharp · #3 01-30-2012, 01:05 PM

Yep. And it's really fun and rewarding to play along with a solo you enjoy.

mattymel · #4 02-03-2012, 06:27 PM

BIG +1 on the importance of "getting the feel". for me, that is my main goal. I'm not real big on taking ii V licks from people and such. i have too many of those as it is for my liking. rhythm IS everything. the more i transcribe the more apparent it is that anyone can play pretty much ANYTHING if you use the right rhythm.

i feel that transcribing is the quickest way to develop a intuitive approach to improvising. by that i mean that whenever i force myself to practice a specific thing (play in 3 or 5 bar phrases, use diminished dom, play in 5/4, etc.) i sound LIKE CRAP and can't do it for real because I'm not HEARING IT YET.

enter transcribing. from figuring it out, LISTENING TO IT 1000x, and playing along until you totally have it, ALL that stuff starts to creep in. its not over night by ANY MEANS. but i believe that it is more REAL than forcing yourself to plug things in that you saw discussed on paper. there is a place for that to. but if you transcribe enough of one aspect, it WILL start to come out unconsciously which is where i believe good music comes from.

Asiancat · #5 02-12-2012, 09:58 PM

transcribing.... It's something I've tried getting away from In the past.. I thought I can just learned how to play Jazz, just by listening and watching players and learning from books and exercises and theory.. But It didn't work at all.. I'm still in the point where I don't feel like I'm getting anywhere yet. This is my last resort.. I guess It can't be helped!! I'll start transcribing when I get home tonight!!

aniss1001 · #6 02-12-2012, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asiancat

transcribing.... It's something I've tried getting away from In the past....

Hehe I know what you mean. Been there myself. But more and more I've come to realize that trancribing is the mother of all exercises. Nothing is more important and there is no way around it.

Think about it. You train your ear. You get to know the fretboard. You get to see how the great players aproach the task of improvising. You build a vocabulary of jazz licks. For starters...

I recommend getting some software right away. Save yourself the frustration of trying to do it with a normal mp3 player. I use Transcribe! Check out the trial version and you'll see what I mean. It let's you repeat a certain passage and slow down the speed whenever you need to.

And start with something simple. For example Paul Desmond and Chet Baker (well the earlier Chet) has been a good starting out point for me.

M-ster · #7 02-13-2012, 09:29 AM

I'm in the transcribing camp, but I found it interesting that Gary Burton, in a video in a recent thread (http://www.jazzguitar.be/forum/impro...ry-burton.html), said he never did much transcribing. Different strokes, I suppose.

AmundLauritzen · #8 02-13-2012, 10:05 AM

I believe it is an invaluable skill to develop in order to learn the language.
Being able to play idiomatically to the style(s) one has chosen is so important. Authenticity is what separates a good player from a not so good player. The best part is, if you have a pair of ears and a guitar, you're set. It's not some intellectual skill for the chosen few or whatever else bullshit people want you to believe.
Personally, I don't believe it's any use to write down the notes unless you're thinking of publishing a transcription book. Your eyes should be on the fretboard, and your ears listening to the music.
That's an individual thing though, and some people learn it better from writing it down. But most of the musicians I know, myself included, find no use in writing it down in regards to learning and internalizing. You just have to play it again, again, again forever. Dissect it, take bits and pieces and mix it up with what you already know so you create associations. That way, it will show up spontaneously in your improvisations.

drobniuch · #9 02-13-2012, 11:28 AM

I transcribe using WINDOWS MEDIA PLAYER no need to pay for software.. yep WMP has the abilyty to slow down Mp3...
One more tip.. Transcibing is more fun with a bottle of wine

aniss1001 · #10 02-13-2012, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmundLauritzen

Personally, I don't believe it's any use to write down the notes unless you're thinking of publishing a transcription book.

Well I believe you call it transcribing whether you write it down or not. That is the process of learning stuff by ear. Correct me if I'm wrong?!

I personally don't write it down either. I listen, learn, memorize, analize, play and eventually I will pick out the most interesting phrases and play them in all posible positions.

I don't think writing it down is useless though. For starters you'll learn to read and write music. But it could also help you getting to know the fretboard I think. The thing is I tend to think in relative notes (=intervals) rather than absolute notes. That is I'm very aware that a note is eg. the natural 6th of the current chord but I have to think for a moment in order to determine that it's a D# or whatnot. So I think I'll start writing down some stuff to see what it gives me.

And I know that not everybody uses software, but for me transcribing was an absolutely horrible experience untill I started using Transcribe! So I'd still recommend it. Not just the slowing down part but also because you can repeat a passage without having to constantly rewind manually.

M-ster · #11 02-13-2012, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmundLauritzen

... Personally, I don't believe it's any use to write down the notes unless you're thinking of publishing a transcription book.

I find that notating the work adds a dimension to its analysis and absorption. Often, something I didn't understand or appreciate at the time of the transcription provides some new insight upon later review. I think it's worthwhile to write and keep them, although I've lost countless pages I've transcribed in the past. These days I do them with software and keep them - sometimes updating them as I find mistakes, etc. - on the PC.

Asiancat · #12 02-15-2012, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aniss1001

Hehe I know what you mean. Been there myself. But more and more I've come to realize that trancribing is the mother of all exercises. Nothing is more important and there is no way around it.

I've just thought about going back to this thread after a couple nights of transcribing. And Boy! What an Eye opener this thread is. I felt like I wasted a lot of time feeling frustrated about 'Not getting IT' despite having all those instructional Videos, books, Tips and theory or whatsoever.
I'm thinking of sticking with transcription for awhile now. I have to agree with you, transcribing is probably IF not, the best exercise.

kris · #13 02-20-2012, 12:58 PM

If I like the solo I like to transcribe it.
But I do want to play copy of the solo on gig!

ScotGormley · #14 02-26-2012, 08:05 AM

As another point to consider: I attended a Dave Liebman clinic recently, and he advised that the transcribing process should emphasis exact reproduction of the original soloist--to the point where one cannot distinguish between the original recording and the transcriber's reproduction (notation is just a secondary consideration). The point being that you should be focusing on internalizing the time feel of soloist more than anything. Heard some great music that day from Dave and Vic Juris.

kris · #15 02-26-2012, 09:44 AM

For sure playing transcribed solo is a good technical exercise.:-)

mr. beaumont · #16 02-26-2012, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kris

If I like the solo I like to transcribe it.
But I do want to play copy of the solo on gig!

This.

I've never learned a whole jazz guitar solo note for note...but i have learned a few Miles and Chet Baker solos.

Some stuff is too complex for me to remember...I gotta write it. When it's just for me, I worry most about getting the pitches right.

I try to internalize the "hell yeah" moments as quickly as possible--make them mine and then put the papers away.

elmorrosamba · #17 02-26-2012, 10:43 PM

The good thing about taking a jazz improv class (at least the one Im enrolled in) is they MAKE you transcribe, and you get credit for it!

My first transcription assignment only requires 8 bars, but we have to analyze the solo and perform it to the class. We also have to notate it.

I choose Wes's solo on King of the Road off 'the further adventures of...w Jimmy Smith'. So far I've got the first 24 bars which is all the single note lines, but then he launches into a mother of a chord solo that has me hung up. Also, I can't find the changes to the tune anywhere, so I'm trying to get those by ear as well. I know it's in C, but I'm pretty sure it modulates at least one time.

transcribing for me has less to do with stealing licks and more to do with FUN! It's kind of a blast to hear myself playing Wes's lines. Kind of like getting to take a Rolls Royce for a spin, rather than my usual beat-up pickup...haha.