Altered dominant licks!

[aniss1001]

Inspired by JonniPac's chromatic lick thread I thought it could be cool with a collection of altered (and diminished) licks.

I tend to diferentiate between the altered sounds that are derived from the altered scale and those derived from the diminished scale. But they can often be superimposed on eachother so it makes sense to think of them together (Joe Pass style).

Etiher way practicing scales wont do you much good in order to improv on these chords. A vocabulary of licks is very necesary.

For now I have time to post only this one (Joe Pass) lick. It goes with a G altered chord:

|-6-4-3-----------|---------------|
|-------6-4-------|---------------|
|-----------4-3---|---------------|
|---------------6-|-5-3-----------|
|-----------------|-----6-2-------|
|-----------------|---------6-4---|
 

I'll post some more later. Meanwhile I hope others will join in...

[ruiner54]

Nice, thanks for posting that.. Joe Pass is one of my favourites..I watch his Hot Licks/Instruction videos over and over again taking notes and consuming his unparalleled wisdom :P

[Nuff Said]

This is a well used Altered arp to minor arp
G7 = G# B D# F (Ascending)
Cmin7 = G Eb C G (Descending)

Nuff

[JakeAcci]

Here's one I just stumbled on, for D7 leading to Gm as VI7 to ii7 in F

starting on beat 4 as a pickup, all 8th notes ascending:

C F# B D Eb F F#

then descending

F Eb C# D

So the D is on beat 1 for the Gm.

[M-ster]

Originally Posted by aniss1001

... It goes with a G altered chord:

|-6-4-3-----------|---------------|
|-------6-4-------|---------------|
|-----------4-3---|---------------|
|---------------6-|-5-3-----------|
|-----------------|-----6-2-------|
|-----------------|---------6-4-3-|
 

Sorry, I had to add the last note!

As an aside: I notice in transcribing, etc., that many of these dominant riffs will leave out the 5th of the dom 7th chord. If you think about it, that omission allows the same riff to work over both fully altered and more typical V7 of minors. IOW, in this example, it doesn't matter if your analysis suggests that this G7 takes Ab mel minor or takes C harm minor (because the difference is Db vs. D natural, and this lick omits them).

Well, for the sake of my argument, you do have to accept that wherever you have b9, you can add #9.

[aniss1001]

Originally Posted by Nuff Said

This is a well used Altered arp to minor arp
G7 = G# B D# F (Ascending)
Cmin7 = G Eb C G (Descending)

Nuff

OK! Thanks. It's a slight variation of one I've used for some time:

G7 = B D# F G# (Ascending)
Cmin7 = G Eb C G (Descending)

Originally Posted by JakeAcci

starting on beat 4 as a pickup, all 8th notes ascending:

C F# B D Eb F F#

then descending

F Eb C# D

So the D is on beat 1 for the Gm.

Hmm.. Sorry I don't quite get it

Originally Posted by M-ster

Sorry, I had to add the last note!

As an aside: I notice in transcribing, etc., that many of these dominant riffs will leave out the 5th of the dom 7th chord. If you think about it, that omission allows the same riff to work over both fully altered and more typical V7 of minors. IOW, in this example, it doesn't matter if your analysis suggests that this G7 takes Ab mel minor or takes C harm minor (because the difference is Db vs. D natural, and this lick omits them).

Well, for the sake of my argument, you do have to accept that wherever you have b9, you can add #9.

Well often it sounds quite allright to play a natural 5th over a chord with a raised 5th or vice versa. But off course leaving it out ensures an "inside" sound no matter which 5th is in the chord...

BTW I think the Pass lick is better without the added root note

[aniss1001]

Another cool "trick" is to move a frase or arp around in minor 3rds. For instance:

|-3---6-4-----3-----------
|---6-----5-3---6-----5-3-
|-----------------6-4-----  ETC..
|-------------------------
|-------------------------
|-------------------------
 

.. or in tritones. For instance:

|-----------------------4-
|-----------------3---6---
|---------------4---6-----  ETC..
|---------3-6-5-----------
|-----5-4-----------------
|-3-7---------------------
 

This concept can off course be use in an infinite amount of ways, it's easy to get into your ears/fingers and it can sound really cool.

PS: in the meantime I found this thread on another forum. Still hope you guys will share your favorite altered licks though

[M-ster]

Originally Posted by aniss1001

Another cool "trick" is to move a frase or arp around in minor 3rds. For instance:

|-3---6-4-----3-----------
|---6-----5-3---6-----5-3-
|-----------------6-4-----  ETC..
|-------------------------
|-------------------------
|-------------------------
 

Just for categorization purposes: This is a symmetrical diminished scale riff. But, they're cool, too.

Originally Posted by aniss1001

.. or in tritones. For instance:

|-----------------------4-
|-----------------3---6---
|---------------4---6-----  ETC..
|---------3-6-5-----------
|-----5-4-----------------
|-3-7---------------------
 

And, many people refer to these as triad-pairs (this one's a G major and Db major pairing).

[JakeAcci]

Originally Posted by JakeAcci

Here's one I just stumbled on, for D7 leading to Gm as VI7 to ii7 in F

starting on beat 4 as a pickup, all 8th notes ascending:

C F# B D Eb F F#

then descending

F Eb C# D

So the D is on beat 1 for the Gm.

re aniss, I made a typo.

you play C then up to F#, then B, D, Eb, F, F#, that's all going up - then from that last F# you then go down to F, down to Eb, down to C#, then actually up to D (my mistake in previous post.)

You start on beat 4 , all 8th notes, the the line resolves on beat 1.

(up) C F# B D Eb F# (down) F Eb C# (up) D.

[aniss1001]

Originally Posted by M-ster

Just for categorization purposes: This is a symmetrical diminished scale riff. But, they're cool, too.

I believe I addressed this in the topic description....

Originally Posted by M-ster

And, many people refer to these as triad-pairs (this one's a G major and Db major pairing).

Ok, heard the term triad pair before but not sure WHAT it means. Some time I'll look into that.

Anyway thanks BUT I'd much prefer if you'd share a lick or two

[aniss1001]

Originally Posted by JakeAcci

re aniss, I made a typo.

you play C then up to F#, then B, D, Eb, F, F#, that's all going up - then from that last F# you then go down to F, down to Eb, down to C#, then actually up to D (my mistake in previous post.)

You start on beat 4 , all 8th notes, the the line resolves on beat 1.

(up) C F# B D Eb F# (down) F Eb C# (up) D.

I think you made another typo in the last line. It lacks an F between the Eb and F# no?

Anyway thanks.... Think I finally got it. Kinda a difficult way to describe / learn a lick though

[Kman]

For G7 starting on beat one, eight notes.

#1

---------------------------------------------
--6----------------5------------------------
------------------------8---7---6---5------
-----7---6---7------------------------------
---------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------

#2

------3---------------------------------------
--5--------6---5---4-------------------------
------------------------4---------------------
----------------------------5-----3----2-----
----------------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------------

[/tab

[JakeAcci]

ack, you're right! sorry, for some reason I just didn't feel like tabbing.

Here ya go (all 8th notes starts on beat 4)


**********************D7*********************G or Gm

E :------------------|---10-11-13-14-13-11----|10---------------|
B :------------------|12-------------------14-|-----------------|
G :---------------11-|------------------------|-----------------|
D :------------10----|------------------------|-----------------|
A :------------------|------------------------|-----------------|
E :------------------|------------------------|-----------------|

To make up for my mistake, here's another one, D7 for a bar resolving to any kind of G chord with a natural fifth. All 8th notes, starting on beat one. I play this kind of thing a lot:


E :6---2-----------|----------------|
B :--6---4---6---4-|3---------------|
G :--------3---5---|----------------|
D :----------------|----------------|
A :----------------|----------------|
E :----------------|----------------|

[JakeAcci]

Something I also do often over a dominant chord, since it's easy, is play only notes from this four note "scale" - b5, #5, b7, b9. It's 1235 of the tritone - it's an extremely consonant structure that sounds dissonant placed over the tritone...I like to play lines that span a few octaves

example for D7 to Gmaj7, this line is all 8th notes starting on the and of 4.


E :--|--------------8-11-|10-7--------------|
B :--|---------9-11------|-----7------------|
G :--|-------8-----------|-------7----------|
D :--|6-8-10-------------|---------11-------|
A :6-|-------------------|------------------|
E :--|-------------------|------------------|

[aniss1001]

Thanks guys.. some nice lines / ideas there