Learning Bebop

[bass2man]

Hey Guys:
I have been trying to add some bebop type lines in my soloing and have gone to the usual sources on the web and have got the david baker books on bebop...learned the major and dom bebop scales (it looks like the dorian bebop is the same as the dom..no?)...learned some heads..Blues for alice, AuPrivave, Billies bounce...

However, I can't seem to string the scales together..it just sounds choppy. Any practice suggestions or more importantly, any leading tone resolutions from chord to chord that I need to focus on?

Any suggestions would help..thanks so much!!

[604bourne123]

about bebop scales

[Alzo]

Yeah I've been trying to do the same thing, it's taken a while but it's starting to happen. I looked at the bebop scales once but they just confused me, their whole point of existence is really a rhythmic one, it just introduces an extra note so that your "in" notes fall on the beat. I don't use bebop scales at all now though, or I'm sure i do, but I don't know it. Don't be afraid of chromaticism and semitone resolution, even if your mind tells you it's "out of key". it's a lifelong commitment playing this stuff too, and can be frustrating. I know it can sound a bit like a cop out when someone says this, but trust your ears, sing along with the tune and find those notes on the neck, if you know your scales well (major, har min, mel min, dim) you should be able to figure out what it is your singing. hope this helps, I try to do this every day.

[Mario Abbagliati]

I don't think you'll get too far with scales. You need to look at the vocabulary, learn it from the solos and find your own variations on the phrases. If you check Wardell Gray's improvisation on Twisted (courtesy of Scooby-sax), a landmark solo from the be-bop era, you'll see it's not about scales because it has too many references to chord tones, non-harmonic notes and common practice blues vocabulary.

[IbanezAS100]

I agree with Mario that scales won't get you far..since you've already learnt a few bebop heads, why not analyse them and see what makes them work ? You'll find many arpeggios (quite often superimposed/upper structure), enclosures/neighbour tones (Baker is quite thorough with those), chromatic notes (or combinations of) that connect chord tones and a whole lot more...

I assume you've tried the Charlie Parker Omnibook already.??

Best of luck

[derek]

Originally Posted by IbanezAS100

I assume you've tried the Charlie Parker Omnibook already.??

This is always my suggestion when guys talk about wanting to learn bebop. It is definitely a language, and I am not sure there is anyone better than CP to teach it to you. I find the bebop scales thing really contrived. No one from that era was talking about them, they are theoretical analysis after the fact. As pointed out above, they give you 8 notes, so you can play 8th notes with important tones on the proper beats.

The last two posts really get at what bebop seems to me to be about, arps + enclosures/chromatics/neighbor tones, however you want to describe it. If you are addressing arps with chromatics, these should smooth out your choppiness over time. Keep in mind though that most bebop stuff doesn't fall easily on the fretboard, and takes some work to get positions that flow for you. Good luck

[Mario Abbagliati]

I find Bird too hard to be first soloist to learn from. I find musicians like Hank Mobley and Chet Baker more suitable, or Grant Green for guitarrists.

[derek]

Originally Posted by Mario Abbagliati

I find Bird too hard to be first soloist to learn from. I find musicians like Hank Mobley and Chet Baker more suitable, or Grant Green for guitarrists.

I am not suggesting Parker solos, but heads from CP tunes. They are a goldmine of bebop licks.

[IbanezAS100]

That's what I had in mind too, just the heads...as Derek said it's all there, arpeggios, chromatics, resolutions.....

Another great resource is, IMO, the Joe Pass Guitar Style books. Sample solos over major and minor blues, Bird Blues, Rhythm Changes as well as turnarounds, II-V material...I don't think you could wrong with that either...

[bass2man]

Derek/Mario/Ibanez....Thanks much for all the great insight...arps+chromatics/enclosures...never thought of it in that light..I've been stuck in the "what Bebop scale is used over this chord" mode...I'll go back and look at the heads I've learned from that perspective.

Ibanez, I actually just got the Joe Pass book...guess that's like a two for one..work on my less than stellar reading skills (no tab) while learning licks..

Thanks again!!

[Carl Craven]

You should aslo try transcribing, it's not as hard as it seems and it doesn't require site reading skills and also, you learn the performance qualities of a piece that the written music cannot convey. It's worth considering that transcription be ear, from vinyl was how most of the guys you are interested to play like, learnt to play.

It just requires a lot of patience, but it gets easier the more you do and helps improve you ear.

[matt.guitarteacher]

Apologies if this has been discussed already, but what are some good first Charlie Parker tunes to learn?

I did a search and didn't successfully find a thread on this. Please link if there is one.

Thanks

[JonnyPac]

Check the new linear harmony threads goin'. Connecting Chords with Linear Harmony is great for building a bop vocab. Lot's of CP lines in the book too.

There is another bop thread with tons of info too. Dig this...

http://www.jazzguitar.be/forum/impro...explained.html

This is nice too. http://www.jazzguitar.be/charlie_parker_licks.html

[fep]

Originally Posted by matt.guitarteacher

Apologies if this has been discussed already, but what are some good first Charlie Parker tunes to learn?

I did a search and didn't successfully find a thread on this. Please link if there is one.

Thanks

Starting at the beginning of the alphabet:

Anthropology

Billies Bounce

Blues For Alice

Those are all in the Real Book, lots of people play them, they're not to difficult if you keep the tempo down. At Charlie Parker tempos many Charlie Parker tunes are near impossible - for me anyways.

I love Confirmation but it's too hard to play.

Fellow forum member M-ster did a great transcription of Andres Oberg playing Billies Bounce (up tempo). You got to check that out, the thread has the video and a pdf of the transcription:

http://www.jazzguitar.be/forum/impro...es-bounce.html

[matt.guitarteacher]

Thanks!