Pickup mount problem

[pmgnut]

Hi,

Just bought a Shadow Atilla Zoller AZ48 pickup and want to mount it to my Ibanez AF105F, except the bracket on the new p/u will not slide into the channel on the neck where the stock one sits. Bracket arms are slightly higher than the channel. How involved is this for a luthier to tackle and are there any other mounting options? I've heard of mounting pickups underneath the fingerest, but don't the poles in the pickup have to line up or be underneath the strings???

[RAQ]

Originally Posted by pmgnut

Hi,

Just bought a Shadow Atilla Zoller AZ48 pickup and want to mount it to my Ibanez AF105F, except the bracket on the new p/u will not slide into the channel on the neck where the stock one sits. Bracket arms are slightly higher than the channel. How involved is this for a luthier to tackle and are there any other mounting options? I've heard of mounting pickups underneath the fingerest, but don't the poles in the pickup have to line up or be underneath the strings???

I cut the arms off mine and stuck it down with Blutack - or you can use some form of adhesive pads. I'd like to say I thought of this myself, but I didn't of course - saw it as a tip on another forum which claimed it gave a better tone that being fixed to either the solid neck or cut into the moving top.Think 'randyc' has a photograph of one of his floaters mounted in this way.

[randyc]

RAQ: perhaps this photo ?

[JohnRosett]

So, this blutack will hold well and not peel up the finish when removed? That might be just the thing for me.

[pmgnut]

That would be the ideal set up as long as it didn't wreak havoc with the finish if it ever has to be removed. Thanks for posting. Is there such a thing as mounting under the fingerest? Just looking at all options before I jump into anything.

[RAQ]

Originally Posted by JohnRosett

So, this blutack will hold well and not peel up the finish when removed? That might be just the thing for me.

I accept the effect of 'sticky pads' on the guitar finish is (to me at least) a bit of an unknown quantity - which is why I was tempted to try the Blutack method (that reuseable office 'putty' stuff) - so caution here is sensible; but some sort of adhesive solution (sorry about the pun) does seem to be an alternative accepted method for mounting a floating pickup. The tip I found claimed that Blutack did not affect the finish - I'm not so sure about double-sided tape though. In my case I was trying to swap a standard floater with a MIK Kent Armstrong, but neither the neck or screw spacings were the same so I was faced with drilling new pilot holes in the neck (not easy) and then rigging up some sort of distance pieces to match the neck width; and still get the floater into the right position with respect to the strings. I used Blutack on an Aria and then the Epi I later fitted the PAF to, so I wasn't really risking that much with either guitar. I've since fitted a Bartolini - going cheap and manufactured without mounting brackets, so somebody somewhere must be using this method - as Randy's photograph seems to show. I've tested two or three pickups now - which I could not have done if I had to keep drilling and fitting each time - and it's worked so well I've left it as it is. There are pickguard mounting options for some pickups and this may be a better route to take - it's just that I tend to remove pickguards.

[Meggy]

Originally Posted by pmgnut

Is there such a thing as mounting under the fingerest? Just looking at all options before I jump into anything.

Yes there is indeed such a thing - I have just ordered a Kent Armstrong Slimbucker pickup which will mount this way on my Ibanez Joe Pass. It has a simple bracket on the right-hand side which is designed to attach to the underside of the finger-board. Although I'm planning to also use some foam pads on the pickup base as some of the others have already described - a belt and braces job!

You would have to make and fit some kind of suitable bracket to use this approach with your pickup I would think. I'm neither suggesting this as a good nor bad idea as I'm afraid I'm fairly inexperienced with this sort of thing myself. Hope you can find a good way of getting the pickup on there though! Let us know how the guitar sounds when it's done too please.

EDIT: Having just re-read your original post - Yes the polepieces should line up as far as possible - so the pickup should be centrally placed under the end of the fingerboard. For my mod (for example) this will mean removing a bit of the finger-board to allow this (the pickup is too wide otherwise) - so I'm making a new fingerboard rather than have to alter the original.

[pmgnut]

Meggy- I have to do the same thing with my fingerest, remove a very small amount to allow for the wider pickup. Not sure what the best tool is for this, probably should make up a template of some sort

[Meggy]

Originally Posted by pmgnut

Meggy- I have to do the same thing with my fingerest, remove a very small amount to allow for the wider pickup. Not sure what the best tool is for this, probably should make up a template of some sort

Well, I'm not very expert or experienced at this sort of stuff either. The one thing I would say is do anything you can that will help make the job less error prone and more accurate. And always exercise a careful, cautious approach - there is nothing worse than cutting away too much material, or in the wrong place, or going too quickly and causing damage, and then knowing there is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING you can ever do to put things back how they were! My new pickguard has come out well by the way - I used a template which I stuck to the material to be cut with double sided tape so I would recommend that even if you're not making a whole new pickguard. And measure things carefully, plus remember you can always cut/file away a little more material, but you can't put it back!

On the subject of mounting the pickup, I would now put in a vote for some sort of foam/rubber material on the base (not too soft though) plus double sided tape to mount it to the guitar body. This has worked great on my Ibanez, and I have not needed or wanted to use the side-mount bracket on the pickup (it is still attached but is hidden by the scratchplate anyway). It can be a little tricky to get the pickup height right with this approach, but it IS foolproof in the end (also using a mounting bracket would be at least as tricky anyway as you can't move holes you have already drilled!). Hope you get things how you want them!

[randyc]

Originally Posted by Meggy

... (also using a mounting bracket would be at least as tricky anyway as you can't move holes you have already drilled!). Hope you get things how you want them!

Additionally, all the accidental noises that the pickguard ALWAYS produces don't get microphonically transmitted through your pickup. I've become a fan too after observing the mounting on the Heritage Golden Eagle and the nice way that the pickup functioned without being hard-mounted.

[Meggy]

Originally Posted by randyc

Additionally, all the accidental noises that the pickguard ALWAYS produces don't get microphonically transmitted through your pickup. I've become a fan too after observing the mounting on the Heritage Golden Eagle and the nice way that the pickup functioned without being hard-mounted.

Good point Randy sir, I hadn't even considered that one, but another good reason to go for the base mounting method. It's simple and easy to do, but it works AND there are other positive benifits like the one you mention.

[pmgnut]

Well I finally got the AZ48 mounted and it sounds great. Has a super nice jazzy ring to it. I had a luthier do it who I wasn't too familiar yet with his work but he did a decent job for a reasonable price. Ideally, I wanted the pickup in the same location - floating on the end of the neck. The channel for the factory pickup arms{bracket} is slightly smaller than the AZ48 bracket, so he had to do some intricate carving out to accomodate the new one. The factory cut out on the finger rest/pickguard also had to be extended just a bit in which he used a template to make it look real nice.

[Meggy]

Originally Posted by pmgnut

Well I finally got the AZ48 mounted and it sounds great. Has a super nice jazzy ring to it. I had a luthier do it who I wasn't too familiar yet with his work but he did a decent job for a reasonable price. Ideally, I wanted the pickup in the same location - floating on the end of the neck. The channel for the factory pickup arms{bracket} is slightly smaller than the AZ48 bracket, so he had to do some intricate carving out to accomodate the new one. The factory cut out on the finger rest/pickguard also had to be extended just a bit in which he used a template to make it look real nice.

Glad to see things have worked out so well pmgnut! It's always a bit of a leap into the unknown having mods like this done - you know what you hope will be achieved but... I don't blame you at all for staying with the traditional floating mount system, nor for getting a luthier to do the tricky stuff! It looks very nice indeed, and I must say you get a lot of nice flame on that model Ibanez for your money. How does the sound of the AZ48 compare to the stock pickup?

[pmgnut]

Well when I got to the guy's place to pick it up I plugged it in and played it on a low setting, through his amp. I didn't notice any mind blowing change, but then again, I wanted to have this plugged into my own amp and dig a little deeper. Got it home, plugged her in and I instantly noticed a nice "warm ring" to it for lack of better description. The stock p/u was a good pickup but a bit on the bright, tinny side, but great for certain applications however not what I liked. The Shadow has a much more jazzy sound to it - warmer, richer tones. I'm happy I did the swap. I'll have to admit though I was nervous about giving this guy a chance to do the work - I kept imagining my guitar looking like a beaver was gnawing on it.

[Meggy]

Sounds like you got a good improvement to me - I wouldn't expect the difference to be massive either, but sometimes what seems a subtle improvement can be a very big difference in terms of how the guitar responds and plays in the end. I think you will be very pleased with this mod in the months to come. I know what you mean about worrying when you leave your prized axe with an untried luthier though - and I have heard of, and sadly even seen, a few horrible hatchet jobs in the past! Shudder! Enough of such talk though - you have a lovely guitar there.

[royall13]

You guys gave a great dissertation. You spoke of problems unforeseen and innovative solutions. I am trying to decide on p/u for my Manouche guitar, which has a Korean made p/u mounted on the fretboard. I would appreciate any opinions on jazz p/u's.