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Hi,
I've been using my teles with a 5e3 clone and found some great sweet spots for clean tones. I just got an Ibanez AS153 and am having trouble taming a booming sound especially when playing chords. I'm using the neck pickup and have lowered the pickup which helps some but still when playing chords is pretty boomy.
I have the amp set with all three controls around 4ish and I've tried using the 3rd and 4th inputs.
How far can I go with lowering the pickups? Is there anything else I can try?
Thanks for any help!
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02-17-2018 01:45 PM
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It depends on what you’re looking for, but I usually turn all of the tone controls all of the way down on tweed style amps. As I understand it that’s actually the flat point on those circuits.
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Use the vol and tone knobs of your guitar. That'll help a lot
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Also curious. I only have one guitar with humbuckers and this is the reason I don’t play it much. Sounds amazing through my Princeton and Henriksen though.
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I seem to remember some "magic sauce" setting with tone on 1 or 2 pm and volume up high, plug into 4th input (lowest) and roll the guitar volume way off. I'm not 100% reliable as my 5e3 has been gone a while. But I do remember that it was a very sweet and glassy clean.
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Turn the guitar volume down. With humbuckers, I rarely have my guitar volume above half when going into my 5e3 clone, often less.
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Some of the early tweed and brownface Fender amps simply do not sound that great with humbuckers unless played very softly through the second input.
Keep in mind that Leo Fender designed his earliest amps for single coil guitars.
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Out of curiosity, have people experienced the same boominess with P90 archtops, or is it just a humbucker thing?
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Yes...I had a P90 Kingpin that had to be turned down similar to humbuckers when going into the 5e3 clone.
Originally Posted by Jehu
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IME the 5e3 can be muddy in the bass if you drive it hard, or just turn it up loud. This tends to be more of a problem with HB than SC pickups.
If you've still got the original-spec 0.1uF coupling caps from the PI to the 6V6 you might consider changing them 0.047, or even 0.022 to 0.01 uF to roll off a bit of the bass response.
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Plug into the bright channel with with humbuckers. I run the tone control at about 3. Giggable volume on my guitars is with the volume at 3- practice volume at home is 2 or even a bit below. Try either the high or low input on the bright channel to see what suits your guitar best.
And try turning up the normal channel volume to 3:00 or a bit more (9-10 or so on the dial)- the controls are interactive and on mine the bass response of the bright channel is dropped down as the normal channel volume goes up. The interactive controls and inputs are the secret sauce of the 5E3 circuit. Mission Amps sells a humbucker mod that accentuates this.Last edited by Cunamara; 02-18-2018 at 07:10 PM.
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Hey, that’s right. I realized we were talking about a Deluxe circuit, but I wasn’t really thinking when I made my earlier comment. I don’t have a 5e3, but I do have a 5c3 and Cunamara is right, IME, the interactive volume controls are where it’s at. Originally Posted by Cunamara
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While you're experimenting try a a patch cable between channels too. Mine is kind of a mystery to me (25W Lildawg) nice at low volumes but once I crank it some it wails. There are some links out there with setting recommendations. As said, try a lower pickup or decreased volume settings on the guitar. Sometimes you just need a different style amp.
Off topic some but I always wondered what mine would be like with some reverb. I love a little reverb and I missed it with the tweed especially at low volumes. After lots of reading I got a Topanga reverb pedal which supposedly tries to copy an old Fender tank. Works great with the tweed.
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[+1 on the off-topic reverb! I use the Topanga, too, with one of my "fender" style amps that doesn't have built in 'verb.] Originally Posted by 73Fender
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That's what I was trying to think of in my earlier post! I had read somewhere on the net about turning up the bright channel volume while playing through the normal channel. I now revise my memory to be tone around 3, bright channel volume 7, normal channel volume to taste, and guitar into low input. Sorry, it's been a while since I had that amp. I wouldn't mind getting a new one sometime -- my previous 5e3 was a "double deluxe" -- twice the power. it was just to big and loud for me. Originally Posted by Cunamara
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Originally Posted by Gitfiddler
Some of the early tweed and brownface Fender amps simply do not sound that great with humbuckers unless played very softly through the second input.
Keep in mind that Leo Fender designed his earliest amps for single coil guitars.
this is exactly correct..when fender was designing amps..the input/preamp stages..they weren't testing them with les pauls!!!
fenders always sounded good thru fenders
cheers
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5e3’s work fine with humbuckers too.
Use the milder input (no 2).
Use Bright channel.
What are Your preamp tubes? V1 should be 12AY7. V2 is a matter of testing. I found that 5751 gives a good headroom but is still warm. If they both are 12AX7, Your mission is near impossible.
”Both volumes on 4” – do You first adjust Your amp and then plug in Your guitar? Try to first plug Your guitar in and then start from 0. Turn the Vol of the unused channel too. When You are in the Bright channel and turn Your Normal Vol to 11-12 You have very little bass. Turning the tone eases the bass. If it gets too bright, use the tone of Your guitar. Trust Your ears.
If You have (or if You want to learn) tinkering skills try to swap the speaker (easy) or some of the capacitors (easy if You can solder).
I swapped half a dozen speakers before I found the Weber 12A125 which has just perfect bass response. A bit later I moved on to 12A150, which has a bit more headroom. And then there is speakers which has their sensitivity value near or over 100dB, which give You PLENTY of headroom! (Buy used speakers from The Gear Page or such, You get the same back if You end up selling them).
Here’s some advice for electronics, and some easy theory too:
5E3 Mods
I have played my humbucker ES175 with a Tweed Deluxe clone for some years now. Needed some learning and tweaking but could not be happier now! 5e3 circuit is easy to tweak!
My pickup is very high too, found the sweet spot there. Apparently I like my electric spanish electric. And I don’t never use the vol or tone of my guitar, they are always on 10. (I know I should learn...)
Good luck!
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Herbie is right on. Use the "Humbucker" input: #2. I use the normal channel. Roll your guitar volume back. Try about 2-3. That'll cool the hot signal down.
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My 5E3 has a Cannabis Rex speaker. Good combination for jazz as it's got enough sensitivity to make you think there is more clean headroom than there really is.
Rob Robinette's mod page is fantastic, thanks Herbie.
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Question for the experts:
Would not these early Fender amps been designed to accommodate pedal steel guitars
and do pedal steels have a higher output?
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Hey just found all your replies. Thank you. I’ll play with the suggestions tomorrow. I have to be careful as I get really impatient with new amp guitar combos. Btw, I use the topanga as well. Works great with the amp.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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The tweed Deluxe amps were made before the advent of pedals. I can't think of any pedals that are going to improve the sound of the Deluxe with the possible exception of a reverb pedal.
Distortion? Heck, the Deluxe gets some of the very best distortion of all time, all on its own. I guess you could grab a distortion pedal--if you want to go for the Slash--November Rain heavy preamp distortion sound. That kind of distortion is what I think of as "bag of bees" tone. It works for some folks, but it is completely lacking, to me, in comparison with Clapton's preamp/power amp grind on Live Cream/"Sleepy Time Time." Now, that's distortion. The Deluxe can get THAT sound by simply turning the guitar and amp up. No pedals needed.
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Bill Frisell would argue that point... He uses a pair of Deluxe amps on the road and uses multiple flavors/layers of distortion all the time... He sounds pretty good...
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I like Bill Frisell and his playing a lot. I still contend, however, that the natural distortion of a tweed Deluxe (or a tweed Champ, for that matter) is a superior sound to that of a distortion pedal into a clean amp, FWIW. It's pretty subjective, but power tubes getting a workout really sound great.
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I agree 100%. Achieving non-linearities (distortion is such an ugly word - I prefer "harmonic enrichment) at both the pre- and power- stages allows for not only soft-knee (and then some) compression but also even-order harmonic lushness and over-all tonal complexity such that a touch of vibrato or a bend (up or done) elicits comb-filter effects that only a little reverb could improve. Originally Posted by Greentone
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