Set up required if switch to flatwounds?

[CP40Carl]

I'm considering replacing my roundwound 0.10s with flatwound 0.10s (probably try XL Chomes); I have a Gibson Les Paul Standard 2008 and had a set up only a couple of years back. My luthier has said I should bring it in for another setup if switching to flatwounds. However, I've checked the 'tension' guide on the string manufacturer's website and there is no difference in tension between the same gauge flatwounds and roundwounds. Any advice greatly appreciate.

[mambosun]

Originally Posted by CP40Carl

I'm considering replacing my roundwound 0.10s with flatwound 0.10s (probably try XL Chomes); I have a Gibson Les Paul Standard 2008 and had a set up only a couple of years back. My luthier has said I should bring it in for another setup if switching to flatwounds. However, I've checked the 'tension' guide on the string manufacturer's website and there is no difference in tension between the same gauge flatwounds and roundwounds. Any advice greatly appreciate.

From my experience, there's no need of any special setup if switching to flatwound, sticking to the same gauge.
The only difference I found was feel and sound.

[PTChristopher]

There are a few differences between most round .010 sets and the Chromes in .010.

The same overall tension makes it likely that your neck relief will be about the same with both sets of strings.

But, tension - all by itself- tells you almost nothing about other setup requirements. Flats can be stiffer than rounds. This affects vibration particularly near the end of the string, and can very much affect the best-fit bridge compensation used.

Also the G is wound on the Chromes. This means that the bridge compensation will be far less on the wound G than on your current (most likely) plain G.

But if this is an experiment, then just move the G saddle forward some - to slightly farther back than your high E - and see how you like the strings.

Your bridge compensation will very likely be less than ideal, but will also be very likely usable to try the strings.

Why not learn about bridge compensation some and re-set it yourself if you decide to stay with the flats?

It is also possible that some minor nut adjustment will be helpful, but depending on how the nut slots are currently cut, the change to flats may not require any adjustment. In-hand is the only way to tell.

[CP40Carl]

Great, thanks guys. Will have a think about this, didn't think it would be straightforward. Might even consider moving up a gauge to flatwound 0.11s and going for luthier set up. Thanks again, appreciate your advice.

[whiskey02]

Be sure to check the size of each string compared to what you've been using. Just because the top string is .10 doesn't mean all the others are the same. You may have to slightly widen a few nut slots. Also,as has been mentioned , flats do exert higher more lbs of tension than rounds.

[TruthHertz]

While you're making the switch, you might think about trying out some different types of strings, still in the flatwound family though. Labella and Thomatik both make flat wounds that are very good, but have different feels and tensions. Keep your mind open, and really play in a set for a few days to get impressions. They're going to be different. You might also find that because of the different resiliency that PTChristopher so rightly discusses, you are going to want to check and match the neck relief to the new strings, especially if going to something like a Thomastik. Do play around with them. You may find your action may be different when you settle on what you need to play comfortably. It might not be as simple as the strings you have now-only smoother. Different beast. Remember too, that setup means pickup height and your response changes to a huge degree with even the most subtle pickup height adjustment. Work with your tech to get the sound you want, the response you are used to with your new strings/pickup setup.
Have fun.
David

[CP40Carl]

Thanks guys, I value all of your input and advice. Sounds like I'm going to have to do a fair bit of experimenting before heading to the local luthier to make and appropriate adjustments. Knowing me, I'll probably end up back where I started on roundwound 0.10s!

[TruthHertz]

Yah- but have an adventure, try it out! For the price of the strings, you can get an idea of what it can offer you. With a proper set up, it just makes it better.
While you're at it try out some other options. And have you ever tried D'addario Half Rounds or Labella Press wound? They both take round wound and smooth them out for a quieter string. D'addarios grind the edges off the windings, Labella puts them through a roller press, they're a little brighter.
You can still play the guitar without a setup, it just optimizes your instrument so you can get the most out of it.
David

[PTChristopher]

Carl,

David is right.

Man, there are SO MANY great string sounds out there.

Strings and picks are the top ways (BY FAR) to make significant tone differences. Even the most absurdly expensive strings and picks (and they do get silly) are cheap and very effective compared to many ways players throw money at guitars for immeasurably small tone changes.

My picks for picks and strings (only an opinion of course):

Thomastik JS-111 and JS-112. These get rid of the slightly grinding sound of Chromes - albeit at a significant cost. Still a dirt-cheap mod.

Sadowsky Jimmy Bruno .012 to .050. A nice smooth sounding sort of round.

DR Pure Blues heavy .011. Not really "Heavy" but a nice sounding string if you want to stay with rounds a plain G.

Dunlop Ultex 1.4mm standard shape or 2.0mm "sharp", but with the tip sanded back to standard.

Pro-plec 351 1.5mm. I just got these and they are absolutely fantastic.

Wegen Gypsy Jazz ~3.5mm (I think) mm. Great sound, but more pick noise than I would prefer.

I would definitely experiment some. this is an area where you can make a huge difference at a modest cost.

Chris

[ruiner54]

I use D'Addario 12 flatwounds and although they are not as nice as Thomastiks I think they are fantatsic. They stay in tune almost perfectly and at 3 months old still sound virtually brand new.
Concerning picks, its unreal the difference they can make. My tele can almost sound like a jazz box using the flatwounds and thicker.

[CP40Carl]

Wow, you guys have certainly presented me with a lot of cool options. I've not long purchased my Les Paul and, although it's not the seen as a typical jazz machine, it plays really well although I just wanted to nudge it towards a slightly more classic jazz tone (I'm sure you all know what I mean here). Will give it a go and let you know how I get on! Again, thanks for the posts, really helpful.

[CP40Carl]

Just to add to that, I agree entirely iro how much difference a change of plec can make - I recently changed from the old small gibson plecs (I think they stopped making them so I used to file down the larger size!) to the Jim Dunlop Jazz III Ultex. Much more of a 'dead' sound using the Jazz IIIs, quite surprising really. Got used to them now and really like them (haven't dropped one yet either!) although for some reason I seem to be increasingly playing finger style...strange.

[zigzag]

String tension guide:

The String Guy on Pyramid Strings

TI= Thomastik-Infeld

FYI:

TI Flatwound- 10s Tension: 107.6, 11s Tension: 123.6

D'Addario Flatwound Chromes- 10s Tension: 117, 11s Tension: 137

D'Addario XL Roundwound Nickel (w/wound third)- 11s Tension: 121.5

[TruthHertz]

Originally Posted by CP40Carl

I've not long purchased my Les Paul and, although it's not the seen as a typical jazz machine, it plays really well although I just wanted to nudge it towards a slightly more classic jazz tone (I'm sure you all know what I mean here). .

I had an Ibanez little semi, put beefy strings, a johnny Smith pickup and wooden bridge on it. Very warm jazzy sound and very easy to schlepp around.
Was my workhorse until I went 7 string.
David

[Al_F]

I just did this & put flat-wounds on my 335. I had to adjust the intonation on a few strings but that was it. I used the same size, 11's, no problem of the nut slots at all. I really like the tone too.