The journey of an idea

[nkforster]

Some of you may be aware of a little series I have been posting on my blog - the latest episode should be of interest to
jazzers...

nkforsterguitars: The journey of an idea III



NKForster Guitars : The Book

[cosmic gumbo]

Who are you?

[hot ford coupe]

It looks like some advertizing. If you hit the link at the bottom, that's the ad page. He's primarily a flattop builder but has built an archtop and that's what he's showing us.

[caravan]

It's definitly different! I'd like to hear how it sounds.

[nkforster]

Yes, I've spent over 20 years making flat top guitars, and carved top mandolin and bouzouki.

If you read through the earlier episodes of the blog you will see how this design came about almost by chance, it may well be the first new take on the design in decades.

I'll post a video of this prototype being played in a few days so you can hear.

Nigel

NKForster Guitars : The Book

[nkforster]

Here is the latest version, you can read about it on the blog.


nkforsterguitars: The journey of an idea V - CHARLIE

nigel

[Pierrot]

Very interesting. Any sound sample?

Cheers.

[cosmic gumbo]

It is my usual policy to provide a review and possible endorsement for any instrument given to me. Thank you.

[bananafist]

For those who may not know, Nick Forster worked for some years with Stefan Sobell, and no doubt knows a thing or two about acoustics.
I have no connection or personal knowledge of him, other than having read an article about him in the UK acoustic magazine.

[Pierrot]

Originally Posted by cosmic gumbo

It is my usual policy to provide a review and possible endorsement for any instrument given to me. Thank you.

hehehe, you took the words right of my mouth .

[nkforster]

I've not a video of Charlie yet, but this is the Model I made prior to him. The main difference being Charlie, despite being shallower, is acoustically superior to the guitar in the vid. Pickup wise, it's a Kent Armstrong on both.

YouTube - ‪NK Forster Guitars and Bryan Younger - Archtop 1‬‏

charlie and oscar
the book

Nigel (not Nick!)

[spiral]

Can we talk about Wafer Custom Guitars instead?

[strumcat]

Hm. From the picture, it looks like the entire fretboard, or at least the new extension of it, becomes part of the sound-making process, instead of mostly just the bridge vibrating the top. Is that whole new piece flexible enough to respond to heel-of-the-hand pressure, or even just picking and fingering dynamics? Very interesting. It looks very touch-sensitive.

[nkforster]

I'm not entirely sure what you mean old chap, but the guitar is super responsive. The "long neck" is not flexible - that's the whole point - it takes ALL the strain of the strings. There is no tail to neck pressure on the soundboard, only down pressure from the bridge which amplifies the vibration of the mahogany "long neck".

It's a totally different way for an arch top to work. And it give us more sustain and a body under much less stress.

charlie and oscar
the book

[nkforster]

You might get a better idea from these shots.



nigel

charlie and oscar
the book

[kambor]

I don't know if it's becauseof the recording or the slim body, but it sounds too metallic.

Maybe it's because the neck is taking too much pressure out of the top, and it doesn't vibrate that much, thus making this guitar virtually a solid body, much like an steinberger.

Not to bash anyone's work, really, and I do like innovations, but that much wood to transfer energy from an already stiff point (the neck), seems a bit overkill.

[strumcat]

I see. The other pictures make it clearer. I didn't see that the neck is at a slight angle to the body. I thought you had carved the bottom of the neck extension into a curve or taper so that it would float above the sound board. And being thinner there (as I thought) it would be slightly flexible, allowing more touch sensitivity, and would vibrate more strongly, for a little more sound. I also thought that the end extended further past its contact point with the bridge, perhaps allowing some control using the palm of the right hand out past the saddle. Seems like that would prevent the neck from having to be angled that way, and, if not overdone, would still provide enough overall stiffness to the neck. And the strain would still be off the body, just as desired.

Just thinking out loud. I defer to your judgement on the plausibility of any of those ideas, of course. Really interesting basic idea you have there.

[bananafist]

Have to say, listening to the second vid, I love the version of cheek to cheek, very Atkins style, and I really like the tone. I prefer a clearer less woolly tone than what seems to be considered the 'proper' jazz tone. Would you be able to have a segment played purely acoustically when you record the Charlie vid, so we can hear the acoustic sound?
I plan to try and get to the BBQ on 25th July, so I hope you will have one of your new archtops there. Any idea of price yet?
Apologies for 'Nick' and not Nigel!

[kamlapati]

What provides the downward pressure, to conduct the string vibrations to the top and body?

[nkforster]

Originally Posted by kamlapati

What provides the downward pressure, to conduct the string vibrations to the top and body?

Screws! The rigid neck is bolted in place into a long internal neck block. The gap between the neck and the body in the bridge area is around 10mm. The bridge is higher than the gap. So, placing the bridge between the two forces the top into action. The neck is rigid, and the truss rod travels the whole length - it's going nowhere so all the pressure goes down and radiates out.

Folk get really disturbed by the concept at first as it sometimes contradicts their intuitive understanding of the physics, but the proof of the pudding is in the playing, and folk usually forget what they think they know pretty quick. There is as much down pressure as a normal archtop and no end to end pressure.

Charlie is currently in London so if anyone can suggest a GOOD demonstrator around there we could get a video done soon. Any volunteers?

nigel

charlie and oscar

the book

[kamlapati]

Originally Posted by nkforster

Screws!

I suspected as much when I read all your blog posts. Very original design, I love the idea and the look of it. Could be very nice to be played while standing, in a band situation where mobility is needed.

Of course, I'm a great appreciator of Orville, Lloyd, John, and Jimmy's designs and enhancements too. I love the traditional archtop just the way it is.

Thanks for posting.

[Jake Hanlon]

curious to know what you're prices are like.

[bborzell]

Originally Posted by spiral

Can we talk about Wafer Custom Guitars instead?

Only if you can get them to pay their hosting fees.

[spiral]

Originally Posted by bborzell

Only if you can get them to pay their hosting fees.

Good point. I should have bought 3.

[nkforster]

Originally Posted by kamlapati

I suspected as much when I read all your blog posts. Very original design, I love the idea and the look of it. Could be very nice to be played while standing, in a band situation where mobility is needed.

Of course, I'm a great appreciator of Orville, Lloyd, John, and Jimmy's designs and enhancements too. I love the traditional archtop just the way it is.

Thanks for posting.

I love 'em too, but when a new idea comes up, the only way to find out if it works is to make it. And it works!

Any London demonstrators out there?

charlie and oscar

the book

[bananafist]

He's based in WSussex, not London, but if its any help I can give you Big Jim Sullivans email address. Pm me if of interest.

[nkforster]

Originally Posted by Jake Hanlon

curious to know what you're prices are like.

Charlie is £4500.

charlie and oscar
the book

[nkforster]

Some of you may be interested in the "follow-up" to "Charlie" my new design of Jazz guitar. This one is a little more traditional, I've called him "Oscar"





read more here if you like:
oscar

nigel