Jazz Guitar
Learn how to play jazz guitar with our eBook bundle
+ Reply to Thread
Page 17 of 17 FirstFirst ... 7151617
Results 481 to 492 of 492
  1. #481
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Wilmore, KY USA
    Posts
    5,025
    Quote Originally Posted by Lobomov View Post
    On a philosophical level I might agree with you, but not in a practical sense. Wes is in no way unique in playing 3 fingers. There is just so many great players doing the 3 finger thing, both in jazz, blues and rock.

    Christian mentioned something similar higher in this thread. My first guitar book as a child was aimed at classical players and I've been playing 4 fingers ever since. Around 5 years ago my left wrist started hurting bad.

    The cure for me was to wrap my thumb around the fretboard and change to a 3 finger technique. I off course still do the 4 finger thing at times, but the last couple of years I've worked hard to make 3 fingers my default and it has greatly relieved my wrist pain.
    This is confusing. I'd always heard that classical technique was developed mainly to help develop great playing while also preventing injuries to the hands and wrists. This is new for me to hear otherwise.
    - Lawson
    "Whenever you come near the human race, there's layers and layers of nonsense." - Thornton Wilder, Our Town

  2. #482
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    London
    Posts
    9,784

    three finger technique

    BTW at no point is the argument for me 4 fingers bad 3 fingers good.

    I’ve always use all 4. Early classical training. I’m not going to stop now.

    The argument is ‘3 fingers with a pronated hand and thumb over is a different and valid school of technique.’

    Miles Okazaki actually retrained himself to play this way afaik.

    OTOH you have many great players who use 4 fingers. I’m not sure Lage Lund with his small hands would have adapted naturally to a 3 fingered technique.

    And there are some who really cannot thumb fret.

    Advantage of classical technique - it works for everyone.

  3. #483
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    London
    Posts
    9,784
    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone View Post
    This is confusing. I'd always heard that classical technique was developed mainly to help develop great playing while also preventing injuries to the hands and wrists. This is new for me to hear otherwise.
    Classical technique was developed to facilitate the execution of demanding polyphonic music on the guitar.

    Injuries are only avoided if the student is fastidious about posture and stance. Hence the need for a teacher.

    The footstool ain’t great for your back tho.
    Last edited by christianm77; 02-13-2018 at 06:37 PM.

  4. #484
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    London
    Posts
    9,784

    three finger technique

    Also bear in mind classical guitar technique as we understand it is quite young - especially the right hand. 17th, 18th and 19th century players employed different techniques on different instruments.

    Segovia was waging a PR campaign to make the guitar acceptable as a concert instrument. It served him well to have a legit technique that looked different from flamenco, jazz and folk players, although it undoubtedly served the needs of playing, say, Bach.

    To give an idea - Julian Bream was largely self taught. There was no guitar teacher at the Royal College. The pedagogy is YOUNG - hence the fact that new players are constantly raising the technical bar.

    In fact the pedagogy is pretty much contemporary with plectrum guitar.
    Last edited by christianm77; 02-13-2018 at 06:53 PM.

  5. #485
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    London
    Posts
    9,784
    I'm going to post this cos I love it :-)



    Same piece, different posture:


  6. #486
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    London
    Posts
    9,784

  7. #487
    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone View Post
    This is confusing. I'd always heard that classical technique was developed mainly to help develop great playing while also preventing injuries to the hands and wrists. This is new for me to hear otherwise.
    There are several issues. But the main issue is vibrato and bending. I don't think you see much of that in classical

    By lengthening your strap and wrapping your thumb around the neck you minimize the strain on your wrist .. but doing that kinda forces you into the 3 finger thing.

    But my wrist just isn't what it used to be. I've been forced to go down in string gauge and even if when I don't do much in terms of vibrato and bending, it is still just preferable for me to be in the 3 finger position with the thumb over the neck most of the time.

  8. #488
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    London
    Posts
    9,784

  9. #489
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    London
    Posts
    9,784
    But that's by the by.... Left hand technique is pretty constant, although early players play more heavy articulation from the left hand facilated by lower tension strings, Dai (David) Miller told me, also makes nailless playing easier and more projecting... You can hear that in the Baroque guitar players, left hand legato or what?

    Maybe 15th century lutenist played thumb over lol...

  10. #490
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    New York, NY, USA
    Posts
    1,306
    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77 View Post
    BTW at no point is the argument for me 4 fingers bad 3 fingers good.

    I’ve always use all 4. Early classical training. I’m not going to stop now.

    The argument is ‘3 fingers with a pronated hand and thumb over is a different and valid school of technique.’

    Miles Okazaki actually retrained himself to play this way afaik.

    OTOH you have many great players who use 4 fingers. I’m not sure Lage Lund with his small hands would have adapted naturally to a 3 fingered technique.

    And there are some who really cannot thumb fret.

    Advantage of classical technique - it works for everyone.
    Tuck Andress has a video where he talks about three finger technique. He thinks it's superior for jazz. It's part of his larger perspective that Wes is basically perfection and we should have what we do on what he did. It's seems a little strange for him to be saying this, given how different his playing is, but he says it.

    John

  11. #491
    I don't really worry about this question because I just tend to use whichever approach best facilitates the music at any given moment.

    I was classically trained, so from the start I was used to using all 4 fingers equally. Later I played rock guitar so then I tended to use 3 fingers since it's all based on blues, string bending etc.

    Now with jazz I will use either technique without even thinking about it. The 3 finger thing is good for any kind of blues-based, pentatonic type phrasing where you slur a lot of LH notes or use vibrato, because the 1st and 3rd fingers are so strong. But for complicated chromatic bebop-type runs, using all 4 fingers seems better. So I will switch instantly between the two as the phrases demand it, in fact I probably just see it all under one umbrella of 'jazz guitar technique'.

    But I can see that a natural approach if you are self-taught is to rely on the 3 'strongest' fingers, so it may be harder to start using all 4 if you've always done it that way.

  12. #492
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    London
    Posts
    9,784
    Quote Originally Posted by grahambop View Post
    I don't really worry about this question because I just tend to use whichever approach best facilitates the music at any given moment.

    I was classically trained, so from the start I was used to using all 4 fingers equally. Later I played rock guitar so then I tended to use 3 fingers since it's all based on blues, string bending etc.

    Now with jazz I will use either technique without even thinking about it. The 3 finger thing is good for any kind of blues-based, pentatonic type phrasing where you slur a lot of LH notes or use vibrato, because the 1st and 3rd fingers are so strong. But for complicated chromatic bebop-type runs, using all 4 fingers seems better. So I will switch instantly between the two as the phrases demand it, in fact I probably just see it all under one umbrella of 'jazz guitar technique'.

    But I can see that a natural approach if you are self-taught is to rely on the 3 'strongest' fingers, so it may be harder to start using all 4 if you've always done it that way.
    Perhaps players would be more likely to develop 'idiomatic guitar language' doing the 3 fingers thing...

Join our Facebook Page

Get in Touch


Jazz Guitar eBooks
How To Get a Jazz Guitar Tone?
Privacy Policy

 

 

Follow us on:

Jazz Guitar Online on FacebookJazz Guitar Online on TwitterJazz Guitar Online on YoutubeJazz Guitar Online RSS Feed