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Originally Posted by pingu
Just played through it, both ways. I agree with your assessment totally. Ain't that something how that works?
I use my pinky when playing, but not as much...I think my pinky non-use comes from being a lazy rock player for years, which turned me into a lazy jazz player. So I wonder if my three fingered playing of the head being more "musical" come from my own comfort level...or is it chicken and egg?
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12-05-2016 11:12 AM
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Mr. B, could you please shed some lighton actual fingerings used, key, starting position, where you moved ...?
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Definitely, let me play through again on lunch today so I'm not trying to remember what I did, as that'll probably be wrong
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OK, I done it, looking forward other people's contributions
Please let me know which you preferred, if either, 3 examples with 2 versions each. I'll get a few answers and then announce my findings woot woot.
Listening back, TBH I have no preference.
Dropbox - Three finger vs four finger.m4a
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Ok, so here's my fingering for "3 finger Chaser." What I'm realizing, is my ears like the fact I have to slur a few times, it sounds bluesy, maybe a little more "drunk," or something. Generally, if I played this with 4 fingers I'm just replacing all third finger slides with the pinky, and then the end long chromatic run gets a little more convoluted, more on that later, if I can figure out how I'd actually attack that 4 fingered...
I could have done a video, but this might be easier to tell what's going on. If it's not clear, I can do a vid later...played between 5th-8th frets or so (with one B nat. 4th fret third string), strings color coded: 5th green, 4th red, 3rd blue.
Separated by "phrase" (we can all sing this one in our heads, right?) So to explain my symbols here, 3-3 is a slide, 1H2 is a hammer on...
3 3 1 2 3
3 3 1 2 3-3 1
3 3 1 2 3
3 3 1 2 3
3 3 1H2
3 3 1 2 3-3 1
3 3 1 2 3
3 3 1 2 3
3 3 1 2 3-3
2H3 1 2 3 31 2 3 3-3
3 3 1 2 3
EDIT: Missed a phrase!Last edited by mr. beaumont; 12-05-2016 at 02:20 PM.
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Christian, forgive me if you said it in your recording, but what position did you play Blue Monk in?
I agree, no real difference in sound to my ears...
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me too mr b , Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
now just gotta learn to count it right !
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V Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
That's kind of a relief
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I'd never heard it put that way, "your fingering IS your phrasing." Something to think about... Originally Posted by paulkogut
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I'd be interested to hear you do "Chaser," too... Originally Posted by christianm77
Based on what came "natural" to me (that is, going in initially and trying not to think too much about fingering outside of using 3 or 4 fingers) I noticed that three fingers I needed to slur, 4 finger I could have, but didn't. So that did effect the way one sounded versus the other.
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Interesting... Because I heard it very ofteb...I'd never heard it put that way, "your fingering IS your phrasing." Something to think about...
But there's important point about it ... the order of words in this sentece
Your fingering is your phrasing
or
Your phrasing is you fingering
In the first case you learn some fingering patterns and they are reflected in your phrasing
In the second - you choose fingering to achieve phrasing you want...
The distance between student and masterLast edited by Jonah; 12-05-2016 at 03:54 PM.
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I practice slurring upbeat into down beat - starting doing that consciously about 3 or 4 months back, and I think it's a really good thing to do. Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
So, obviously has a bearing on fingering. If I am playing position 4 fingers, lots hammer ons and pulls offs. But actually when playing I really like the feeling of slides, and 3 fingers certainly encourages this.
So, I'd think 1 2-2 3 as we start on the beat (1 2 HO 3 4 normally)
But I don't think that's what I actually did, funnily enough, maybe 1/1 HO 2 3. Oh well, it felt good.Last edited by christianm77; 12-05-2016 at 04:02 PM.
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That's heavy. I like it. Originally Posted by Jonah
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Sometimes, that's enough, ain't it? Originally Posted by christianm77
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My guess is the 2nd version is 3 fingers...OK, I done it, looking forward other people's contributions
Please let me know which you preferred, if either, 3 examples with 2 versions each. I'll get a few answers and then announce my findings woot woot.
Listening back, TBH I have no preference.
Dropbox - Three finger vs four finger.m4a
But to be honest I would not think about difference if I was not asked...
I just heard that 2nd versions sound a bit more restrained... maybe
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Practice strict so that when you play music you can do it intuitively... That's my aim anyway :-) Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
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I'll post up which was which tomorrow... ;-) Originally Posted by Jonah
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I'm not so sure of that. Think of the old Cramps song, "The way I walk is just the way I walk." It's not like I decided to walk the way I do but it would be hard to try and walk in some other way. I don't think much about my fingering while I'm playing. (Really, it only comes to mind when there is a problem.) If your fingers are pointing toward the bridge when you play, you won't play the same way you would if your fingers remained in neat rows one-finger-per-fret fashion pointing toward the fingerboard. Some people use both approaches, depending on the needs of the moment. It's like being able to speak two languages. Originally Posted by Jonah
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Yeah for
The Cramps!!!!
Christian, there is some difference. In example No.3, the first one sounds more even and accents are kind of straight. The second one is more uneven in level, some may interpret it as having more dynamics, and accents come as sort of inverted. On first listen the second came as more emotional so I thought it must be 3 finger version, everybody say 3 fingers sound better, However, after the second run I started to hear and get the accents from the first one, like there was some consciousness in application ... Now I think I may actually prefer the first take, so it must be the ...
Mr. B, my usual disclaimer, I've never heard the tune, not that I remember, let alone played it. For the purpose of try out I almost learned and almost can play the first 5 bars (with almost 4 bars that for the sake of discussion I almost learned and almost can play of that tune in Practical Standards thread, it's almost a A section worth of music), so my impressions
1. I'd use different string set 4-2, full 4 fingers approach, forward motion, Rock and Roll.
2. If I was to use same string set as you, what you played 33123, I'd play 331-12 and so on.
Pinky I'd use only to avoid ring finger roll, which is nothing to avoid.
I'd start with pinky only if I'd go for full straight alternate picking.
Sent from VladanMovies @ YouTubeLast edited by Vladan; 12-05-2016 at 06:13 PM.
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I was a big fan for quite a while. Saw them once in Miami and it was a good show---Lux and Ivy were in fine form---but their last few records didn't do anything for me. They'd lost their three-guitar/no bass vibe and the drums were too loud and not doing that sorta '50s beat that sounded so good on "Bad Music For Bad People" and "Psychedelic Jungle." Originally Posted by Vladan
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I agree with you...I'm not so sure of that. Think of the old Cramps song, "The way I walk is just the way I walk." It's not like I decided to walk the way I do but it would be hard to try and walk in some other way. I don't think much about my fingering while I'm playing. (Really, it only comes to mind when there is a problem.) If your fingers are pointing toward the bridge when you play, you won't play the same way you would if your fingers remained in neat rows one-finger-per-fret fashion pointing toward the fingerboard. Some people use both approaches, depending on the needs of the moment. It's like being able to speak two languages.
as general conception of cretive process I like Spanish saying (I think originally it comes from the inscription of a cloister in Spain, but it was used many times - at least the teo I know is Atonio Machado'd poem and Luggi Nono's piece)
No hay caminos, hay que caminar... hard to translate properly. Maybe something like: There's no walkway, there's a a need to walk.
It's like you see no road before you make every step of your own then again and again step by step... not the trivial concept of untrodden way etc... but this illusive feeling that the road is there you just have to secure it, to make it real by choosing to make your own step.
We make things worthy meaningful and real.
This is truely existential problem... the poblem of choice basically. How do we make it? We are given the will to make free choice and still we feel that something else moves our will? Or is it also us? Where are the limits of our personality? Are there any? Is there something of me that I am not ware of? And now? And now? Am I true to myself enough? And now? And the moment after that? To be truely living should we be there alone?
Sorry for getting too much into abstract philosophy... but I find these things not less practical than fingering.
As per my 'formula' about fingering... well you are right... this is not strictly practical... but more about approach...
Not that you conciously think about it every time and choose it (it is of course much more complex process) but that you keep in mind that you in general see it that way...
I mean you let your fingers guide you.. you that you choose to let them do it.Last edited by Jonah; 12-06-2016 at 03:33 AM.
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I am the kind of weirdo who is quite literally learning to walk in a different way (more from the core muscles.)
Last edited by christianm77; 12-06-2016 at 05:58 AM.
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How interesting :-) (Strokes beard.) Originally Posted by Vladan
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I scratch my head as now I find the second one less dynamic. If I'd continue listening I might start preferring it, again?! Originally Posted by christianm77
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I think I have a preference, but it's hard to say. Originally Posted by Vladan
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