Jazz Jam Failure

[drdexter33]

I've only been playing Jazz for about a year, and I don't get it.

I practiced that song until i knew all of the changes.

I practiced the head.

I practiced improvising triads, scales, arpeggios, and the melody over the changes.

My guitar teacher and I went through the song, and i knew it, but when it came time to play in front of an audience, i choked.

Again.

Man, i just wanted to crawl off that stage pack up my stuff and get the heck out of there last night... and i did.

I hate this, it's almost like taking a test in school, that you've studied for and when the time comes, the jitters set in, and everything flies out the window, the difference being, I never took a test in front of an audience.

I don't even want to go to my lesson, because I know I'm going to get berated, and I've been doing enough of that on my own.

Can anyone relate to this experience?

What can I do to overcome these jitters?

These Guys I play with are pros and I have tremendous respect for them and their abilities and I think that's part of the problem, I'm completely focused on not screwing up in front of them..and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy..

What's the word?

Despair.

To be hopeless; to have no hope; to give up all hope or expectation; -- often with of. "We despaired even of life." 2 Cor. i. 8. "Never despair of God's blessings here." Wake.

dd

[FatJeff]

Easy - you suffer from performance anxiety. Me too. Well, at least I used to.

It gets better with more experience. The more you mess up in front of people, the less you will care, until eventually you will say to yourself, "Screw it! Who cares what they think of my playing?". This is the point of your liberation.

There are some things that you can do to alleviate this ahead of time, though. Meditation and hypnosis MP3s helped me a lot. I still have the MP3s and if you send me a PM, I can arrange to let you "preview" them. Some people suffer more than others, though, and if that doesn't help, you might want to look into beta blockers.

There are some other threads on this forum with similar topics. You could search for them and see what others might have to say.

[peterk1]

Did you memorize the tune or did you read? If it wasn't memorized do that next time. Did you try recording the tune in one pass and listening back to your playing afterward? If not, start doing that.

The idea is to make your practices a little more demanding so that the performances become less demanding (and more fun).

[FatJeff]

Originally Posted by peterk1

Did you memorize the tune or did you read? If it wasn't memorized do that next time. Did you try recording the tune in one pass and listening back to your playing afterward? If not, start doing that.

The idea is to make your practices a little more demanding so that the performances become less demanding (and more fun).

These are also excellent points. You gotta have the song memorized. That allows you to free up your mind to concentrate on more important stuff, like how you sound and what you're going to improv with.

+1 to recording yourself, too. I just recently started doing that and holy crap, what an eye-opener. I thought I had decent time and good comping skillz, but man was I wrong!@!@

[derek]

Gotta keep getting up on the horse. Maybe start off with some lower pressure settings, like just getting together with some guys to jam, sans audience. One year is a very short time when we are talking about jazz. Keep it simple, and don't forget to breathe!

[3shiftgtr]

Originally Posted by drdexter33

I don't even want to go to my lesson, because I know I'm going to get berated, and I've been doing enough of that on my own.

I sure hope your teacher doesn't berate you at an attempt to get in front of people and play. No reason in the world you should pay for that. Anyone who knows ANYTHING about educational psychology would know that berating a student after a performance choke is an huge mistake.

If he/she can't help you with this, boot him and find another.

What's the word?

Despair.

Alas doctor, do not despair. For you achieved victory. Your attempt served it's purpose...you did it. You were successful in stepping up. You didn't quite get the results you wanted when you did, but do NOT fail to internalize the fact that you DID IT>>>you put your guitar in your hands and got up there>>>>GOOD 4 U!!!!!! In and of itself, that is a victory.

So things didn't go well. Here's the good news...you know what your problem is. I have seen many folks get up at jams and SUCK and think they were great! Which is worse? Not your situation....you know what you want and know the distance you need to travel...the persons with delusions of greatness are stuck...THEY are the ones that need to be taken down a notch, not you.

Simply put, you have performance anxiety. It is treatable and you CAN overcome it. This is the truth, but you have to believe it. Once you do, you can set out on a path to find out what will cure it. Give something a try, and get up there again. Doesn't work? Try something else, and get up there again.

You CAN do this...you WILL do this...BELIEVE brother! I've seen several people that suffer from it too, some really badly making your situation look tame, and they have overcome it. So can you....DON"T QUIT!!!!!!

[gingerjazz]

i think you should try getting together with some guys for a private jam session or try to get together a jazz workshop for learning but as allready stated youve learned what needs to be done listen to the pro entertainers and they will all have tales of the early years when they went down like a led balloon jazz is like any other craft youve got topay your dues

[whippersnapper]

Relax, it was your first jam!

The more you do it, the easier it gets. I also must stress how important knowing the music is. IMO if you have to use a lead sheet you don't know the song.

[drdexter33]

I should clarify, that it wasn't my first time with these guys...I've been going to this jam for almost a year. And most everyone is very gracious. Especially the leader.

It's just sometimes that if I feel i'm not on track at the beginning of the song, or miss something in the head, I start to get those feelings of impending doom, after that, it's all over.

It's as if i can't even remember the song.

Let me tell you, there's nothing worse than that feeling.

thanks everyone for the words of encouragement.

doug

[Scrybe]

I went through the song, and i knew it, but when it came time to play in front of an audience, i choked.

Again.

+1 to recording yourself, too. I just recently started doing that and holy crap, what an eye-opener. I thought I had decent time and good comping skillz, but man was I wrong!@!@

It's as if i can't even remember the song.

all of the above is also true of me. It sucks right now, but I'm just trying to practice daily and stay focussed while I work my way out of this. when I do that, the satisfaction will be a million times greater. I hope....

[mr. beaumont]

my mentor used to tell me, you gotta play a song a hundred times to be able to play with somebody, and then you gotta play it with somebody a hundred times for it to sound any damn good.

his way of telling me that playing by yourself and playing with others both require practice. you'll be fine, hang in there. I can tell you that just by going to the jam and having the guts to get up there puts you ahead of a lot of bedroom maestros. good on ya.

[Baltar Hornbeek]

Don't sweat it.
The guys in the band will let you know if you're suckin too much wind.

[Reg]

Hey drdexter33... don't sweat it... you will get better. I host a jam at one of our local clubs and your not alone. I do feel it's part of the host's job or whom ever is directing the jam to help everyone know where their at. I do have a different approach to playing at jams and jazz in gereral. If you start memorizing every thing your going to play, you might want to think about a different style of music, that's not jazz. If your going to play the head and don't read that well yet...maybe, and I guess if you have problem playing over changes...maybe... My point is if you start memorizing now... your training yourself how your going to learn how to play. Jazz jams are where you can learn how to play, not memorize. I would suggest picking easier tunes, and it sounds as though the house band knows you... let them know your not a pro, and would appreciate all the help you can get. Works on your time, your rhythm and think in forms not bar to bar. Good luck Reg

[Joe Dalton]

It will be ok, it's different for everyone. Some have it easyer on stage than others.

[bass2man]

Hey Doctor...DONT GIVE UP!!!! It sounds like you are a little hard on yourself..if you have been jamming with these guys for the past year and they are still gracious and letting you sit in..How bad can it be?

I have been playing bass for 30 years and still get anxious when I sit in on a jam, althought now its nervous energy more than "scared"...

I would start out a little more simple approach....ask the leader of the jam if you could just play the changes..forgot playing the head and all the scales, arps, etc. Get used to playing one or two songs with just the changes..then slowly add the head and then maybe the melody.

I have lead some jams and can tell you that I always encourage anyone, if they have the right attitude, who has the gumption to get up and jam, no matter how "bad" it is...most jazz guys are pretty good about helping guys starting out...rock guys seem to be more competitive for whatever reason...

As Fields/Kern said...Dust yourself off, pick yourself up, start all over again....

[fumblefingers]

Originally Posted by mr. beaumont

my mentor used to tell me, you gotta play a song a hundred times to be able to play with somebody, and then you gotta play it with somebody a hundred times for it to sound any damn good.

his way of telling me that playing by yourself and playing with others both require practice. you'll be fine, hang in there. I can tell you that just by going to the jam and having the guts to get up there puts you ahead of a lot of bedroom maestros. good on ya.

i would second this. can you play it with your eyes shut at different tempos? in different keys? how many times in a row?

stage fright and fear of failure are normal too. even after you have a piece down pat. getting over it comes with experience. another tip. don't drink caffeine the day before.

do you have years of experience playing solo recitals? that'll do ya some good. do you practice with a group? do you have years of experience playing band or combo recitals/concerts?

jumpin up on stage into a jam session in front of an audience is a tough way to hang. its not really for the rookie player. you are making it tougher on yourself than is necessary.

can you get with a college or even a community college night program to iron some of these things out?

[mr. beaumont]

i agree--depending on the jam they can be pretty tough, and a it competitive as well!

but, i still say kudos to our OP for getting out there. Sometimes you gotta go with what's available in your area....

I am fairly sure I have shared this advice already, but I have come to find out the fastest way to interalize something is to sing it. If you can sing the root movement of the changes, you know them and you will likely hear them solidly in your head as you improvise....more like 'feeling' them. If you hear the changes so clearly that you have no questions about where each chord is going, you will likely find your improvising will come easier and you can relax.

Also, nothing really wrong with nerves per se. I am not sure I have met, talked with, studied with, etc anyone that didn't have them to some degree. I think the trick is to think of them not as anxiety but as positive energy which can be used. It is a subtle shift of the mind, but worth the effort to think on it.

Of course, if all else fails...space is your friend. Space and the melody of the tune will get you through when all else fails.

A lot of good advice in this thread so hopefully you will find something that will work. There are a few books that might give you some other things to consider besides what is in this thread...Abby Whitesides book 'On Piano Playing' and Kato Havas' book called 'Stage Fright'. Both are fairly standard classical musicians reference books that have stood the test for decades. You can find youtube videos of each of them speaking about controlling nerves.

Peace.

jas

[Little Jay]

Don't worry, we have all been though that! The lucky ones among us already at a young age. Only a few very arrogant self-confident @$$holes never expercience this to any degree... (ignorance is bliss, right?)

All the advice given here should help. There's only one way the get better at something: by doing it over and over again. That goes for performing in front of an audience too.

But:

What you experience is pure fear. You have to ask yourself: why? What do you fear? Will you die? Will you use a limb? Will your world fall apart when you fail? Of course not, making music should be pleasureable and that has nothing to do with playing technically advanced stuff, or stuff that you think your audience wants to hear. It has everything to do with playing what you feel like playing, playing the stuff that makes you feel good, about BEING YOURSELF. Your problem is that you try to play what your are tought, what you think is acceptable to play (what you think the audience wants to hear) or what you want to sound like (= trying to sound like your examples). Actually you try immitating a concept. The problem is that you are not there yet, so let it go. Try to play simple ideas that come out of YOUR inner place and don't worry about what it sound likes or what people will think of it. It is good stuff, because YOU play it. Any self-respecting musician understands that. The ones who don't and critize you or laugh about your "failure": forget about them, they are not important, they don't understand what it's about and they will never be good musicians themselves (actually the term "good musician" is already loaded with imposed expectations... I prefer the term "happy musician", because if you are happy you have no fear and thus no stage-fright).
So the only thing there is to fear is that you don't live up to your own expectations. And that's kind of silly isn't it? DON'T BE SO HARD ON YOURSELF! Enjoy!

Next time you get on that stage, take a deep breath, try to feel good (happy) and try to reach that inner place in yourself where the beautiful music lives. And then unlock it.... So get out there and torture yourself!

[gingerjazz]

i think im a bit square but what the heck does kudos mean mr b

[Space Pickle]

It means: Well done good sir! You are a prince amongst men and ripping good example of the finest of us! Jolly good show!

[Little Jay]

Originally Posted by gingerjazz

i think im a bit square but what the heck does kudos mean mr b

Live and learn:
Kudos - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

(I never knew this, glad I do now...)

[NeillonGuitar]

Here is a practice thing to do with a chart - it is aimed at more classical students. Instead of working on passages, apply it to the head and the chord changes. I have pinched of few of these games to get a standard ready for gigging.
PracticeSpot: Infopedia: On Practicing: Making your piece Secure : Seven Stages of Misery

It is an approach to dealing with the playing-jitters: do things like this to get you used to the feelings that will ALWAYS arrive - you just get used to them quicker. Ella Fitzgerald used to vomit because of anxiety before most performances, and she is (was) the best. Allan Holdsworth gets the same drag.
It is part of the playing thing. It is the nervous energy you need to keep around, not get rid of.


NL

[mr. beaumont]

Originally Posted by Space Pickle

It means: Well done good sir! You are a prince amongst men and ripping good example of the finest of us! Jolly good show!

Shoot, in my neighborhood, it means "I'm the one whose been eating the leftovers and stealing 1 of a pair of socks."

guess I need to change my post.

[barak]

Hey Brother
We all have been there, don't feel so bad for it, learn to accept and enjoy the way you are, be a bit less demmanding and rigid, let yourself sometimes fail, if the ride was so smooth no bumps you would never have the chance to grow and discover anything in life. I think we as artists are to perfectionist and we are not even close to that stage, so learn to be humble, study a lot but don't forget to enjoy the ride, being intransignet unpermissive with yourself is not going to help, on the contrary is going to take you down and down an probably become grumpy and bitter. Pray every time you study devote your music to the king of kings Read psalm 37
Man if you need more of my help feel free God Blees you

[Hugh]

My first experience in playing was in front of a packed club, and I had the misfortune to be playing lead guitar in an instrumental band. I could hardly face the audience and spent a lot of the time with my back to them til the band told me to get my finger out and just play. I was only fourteen at the time but I remember it like it was yesterday. But after a few gigs and a bit of encouragement, I got on fine.
It is better the younger you are for sure, less fears I suppose. I would'nt advise any medication as this is only giving you false support. Just get playing with as many musicians as possible to as many people as possible and you will laugh at your bad experience in no time and you'll be giving this advice to other worried musicians yourself someday I'm sure.

[randalljazz]

Originally Posted by NeillonGuitar

Here is a practice thing to do with a chart - it is aimed at more classical students. Instead of working on passages, apply it to the head and the chord changes. I have pinched of few of these games to get a standard ready for gigging.
PracticeSpot: Infopedia: On Practicing: Making your piece Secure : Seven Stages of Misery

It is an approach to dealing with the playing-jitters: do things like this to get you used to the feelings that will ALWAYS arrive - you just get used to them quicker. Ella Fitzgerald used to vomit because of anxiety before most performances, and she is (was) the best. Allan Holdsworth gets the same drag.
It is part of the playing thing. It is the nervous energy you need to keep around, not get rid of.


NL

hmmm...heard of barrios' hundred pebbles?

[shadowguitarist]

Hey drdexter33,

First up - I am not surprised at all that you experience the jitters. I actually recently wrote an article on my blog in how you might overcome it. Without ranting on too much, the four tips which really helped me overcome it are as follows:

Tip 1 - Know your material well and have the chops (basically have the technical competency to play jazz)
-Basically, if you can't improvise over the chord changes in the comfort of your own room, then there's no way you're able to do so in front of a live audience but this shouldn't be an issue for you because you practise hard.

Tip 2 - Visualise success
-Imagine in your head, in vivid detail, how you are going to ace the performance - do this everyday until it becomes a part of you.

Tip 3 - Change your physiology
-A nice psychological tool to boost your confidence in any situation is to think what your body posture and motions (termed 'physiology') are going to be like IF you are confident guitarist. Your emotions dictate the way you move and act but the reverse is also true. So if you're a sloucher - stand up staight etc. Sounds stupid but it works for me!

Tip 4 - Use an anchor tool
Is there a song that you like which instantly cheers you up or brings you a sense of empowerment? (Something cheesy like Eye of the Tiger for example ). By listening to a song which is anchored to feelings of power, it is possible to invoke feelings of confidence.

I'm not saying these tips will work for everyone but they certainly helped me out. If you want to find out more, check out my blog post Guitar Lesson – Overcoming Performance Stage Fright The Shadow Guitarist Blog.

[cjl]

Relaxation is the key to so many things in life.... music, sports, all sorts of things.... of course, it takes practise and you have to make a positive effort to relax - as one of the other posters said, "don't forget to breathe!" (sounds like my boxing instructor!)

I've been a very tensed-up person all of my life - when I've played guitar in the studio my neck and shoulders used to feel like someone had been stabbing them - on stage I used to hide behind the horn section, or the curtains.... but as I've got older I've realised that the best way to overcome this sort of stress is to confront your fears and get over it... and relax!

Playing a wrong note, or even completely screwing up isn't going to change the price of bananas down the greengrocers, and no-one's going to punch you in the face for it, so it doesn't matter that much.....

It's a just a matter of personal pride, and we all have to swallow that sometimes - it's part of the learning process, and it's part of life... you've done well to get up there in the first place (I'll be honest, I don't ever see myself playing jazz in public!) so be proud of that.... and the more you get out of your comfort zone, the more you'll get used to it, and grow to enjoy it......

Relax, relax, relax........!!!

[franamico]

I'd say ANY musician can relate to this!
BTW, that's not a failure...that's just your first gig man!
Welcome to the stage. It's fun, believe me!!