Intervalic fretboard

[Evan]

I just ordered a book called Intervalic Fretboard. It hasn't arrived yet, but the reviews and description sound really interesting.

Does anyone have it, have thoughts about it, or want to start a study group for it?

Intervalic Fretboard

[macrat123]

Will take a look.

[bobsguitars09]

Did you get the book in the mail yet? how is it?

[Evan]

I got it, but it took a while to get into. Life got really busy over the last few weeks and I haven't spent as much time as I had planned. I was stuck on their explanation of one particular interval. I never felt like I really understood it well enough to move on. I'll post back soon and explain the example.

I did think that the calculations in the beginning of the book could have been explained better.

[Evan]

I revisited page 21 and can now say for certain that this book can be very confusing.

For example: on page 20, the meat of their explanation about the formula they use for calculating intervals is provided in a footnote. They give this as an example and an explanation:

"4th + 4th + 3rd = b7th + 3rd = 2nd ... unfortunately, intervals don't add up as in the decimal system (a 5th + 5th is not a 10th but a 9th)"

It's crazy that the basis of everything they're going to present in the rest of the book was stuffed into a cryptic footnote!

They have only just barely covered the calculation at this point. The examples they provide don't include note names and since they aren't explained clearly, the generic nature of the diagrams don't help to seal the deal. I did work a few real examples out on paper (with note names) and finally made some sense of it.

Then comes page 21. That's where I'm stuck right now. If anyone has this book and would like to discuss this page, please join in. If not, I can describe the example given.

[M-ster]

You can see the preview better by using this link:
http://www.intervallicfretboard.com/...previewweb.pdf

I didn't see anything that spoke to me, but that's subjective, of course.

[pinbridge]

Hi Evan. I messaged you a while ago. If I can help in any way with your being stuck, I'd be happy to (I'm the co-author). Write back if you like.

[Evan]

Originally Posted by pinbridge

Hi Evan. I messaged you a while ago. If I can help in any way with your being stuck, I'd be happy to (I'm the co-author). Write back if you like.

I haven't forgotten or lost interest. I'm really hoping to have time to reply this weekend. Thanks for writing.

[Evan]

Thanks for your interest PinBridge.

Most of my head scratching has been due to pages 20 and 21. There are several key concepts presented on these pages without enough (for me) explanation or illustrations. The concepts are are probably old hat for more experienced musicians, and if I had a teacher I would have asked -- but that's not an option right now.

I drew up a few diagrams and posted the images on my tumblr page. I think they will help explain my confusion better than I can describe in words.

I began by trying to make sense of the basic math for determining an interval.

One of the jumps the book makes is naming an interval across 5 strings. I tried to work through that to make some sense out of it.

When that made sense, I took a stab at the math.

And when I thought that I finally had that concept down, I realized that the book doesn't explain the difference in doing math on a minor 7th vs a major 7th interval.

Please understand that I'm not criticizing your book. I'm just trying to work though the examples to have a solid understanding. I have a basic understanding of music theory - but perhaps not enough for this part of the book.

[pinbridge]

Hi Evan. I'm glad you wrote. I looked at the diagrams you created and spent time trying to understand what the hurdles were. I think I have an understanding where the pain points come from. I will attempt to explain what I gathered from your notes.

1-First off, before delving into the interval on fig. 15, it's important to become very familiar with the section earlier on intervals between adjacent strings. Those can be committed to memory (fig 11-12).
From your first picture, I see you have gone through that part. You decided to locate the example of fig. 15 on the 3rd fret - you don't have to restrict it to any single position because intervals apply across the fingerboard, but for the sake of illustrating with note names, it is a good idea. So in your case, fig 15. becomes interval from C to D.
Next on that first picture, you added the diatonic note names between C and D (i.e. C D E F G A B C D). I would say you don't need to since you already know the intervals between each adjacent strings (previous section), but it might be a tool you used to better see what is going on.
So on 3rd fret, from 5th to 4th string, you have: C D E F = 4th, as you pointed out. From 4th to 3rd string, F G A Bb = 4th (the note on 3rd fret 3rd string is B flat though, not B). And last, from 3rd to 2nd string, Bb C D = 3rd (you wrote b3rd because of the previous mistake). So this all matches the adjacent string intervals you wrote on top of your diagram: 4 -> 4 -> 3
Now on to how you are adding these. Interval between strings 5&4 + interval between strings 4&3 = 4th + 4th = b7th, as you wrote.
Then you have interval between strings 5&3 + interval between strings 3&2 = b7th (last result) + 3rd = 2nd. You wrote b2 because of the previous error.
However, I see that you wrote: 9-7=2. I assume you are removing the octave here from the 9th and not adding/subtracting just as in the decimal system. Adding in a similar fashion to the decimal system wouldn't be correct, as states the footnote guarding against that on page 20, and that's the main purpose of breaking down the operation of "calculating" intervals into bitesize additions (interval between adjacent strings on the same fret, or interval between notes on the same string).
The operation of removing the octave (in compound intervals) in order to obtain the corresponding simple interval is explained in the first paragraph of page 12.

2- Now on to your second picture, which is about fig 18. From what you drew, this was done correctly (so I suspect the error in the first picture was a simple mistake) - this time, you picked the note D on 5th string 5th fret and A on 1st string 5th fret. Again, you wrote down all the note names between the two notes; I think you don't have to once you are well familiar with all adjacent string intervals.
However, I don't see the steps that led you to arrive to the interval between D to A being a 5th. I see the adjacent string intervals you drew: 4 - 4 - 3 - 4.
So, proceeding just as we did in fig 15, D->G->C->E = 4 + 4 + 3 = b7th + 3rd = 2nd (you can use the result from fig. 15 - as you see, note names don't matter). Then you have E->A (string 2 to 1) = 4th. So overall, D->A = 2nd + 4th = 5th.
And here, remember the mirroring concept that was explained earlier on page 19. You could easily get from D on 5th string to A on 1st string looking in the opposite direction, i.e. go from D on 5th string 5th fret to A on 6th string same fret, then you could see immediately that the result was a 5th) - look at the mirror note on the second diagram in fig 19.

3- Your third picture. This is still about fig 18, and fig 19-20.
You got the vertical interval (D to A) and horizontal interval (D to E) perfectly, both ways (i.e. D to A and A to D, as is explained in Chapter 1 - this is a key point on page 15).
So going from E to D to A (E->D->A), you have b7 + 5 = 4th.

4- What you show on the right column on your 4th picture is not accurate for major 7th + 5th - it should equal a tritone (#4th or b5th), not a perfect 4th. What you wrote is correct however for b7th + 5th.

Let me know if there is anything I misunderstood from your diagrams. I hope this helps and clarifies a little where there might have been roadblocks.