What would be a good cd to buy to start transcribing with??

Jazz Junior · #1 11-25-2010, 10:59 PM

I've read that Jim Hall is good for beginning transcribing on the guitar, and I want to build my "jazz" collection, so what might be a good one to start with?

Any other guitarists would be awesome also.

ksjazzguitar · #2 11-26-2010, 12:05 AM

The album "Kinda Blue" is a great one to start transcribing - straightforward solos, usually an easy tempo.

I transcribed some bluesy Burrell when I was starting too. Charlie Christian is great too - really clear ideas and gets you familiar with where it all started.

Peace,
Kevin

mr. beaumont · #3 11-26-2010, 08:45 AM

Who told you that?

Jim's chord voicings will keep you up at night! His single note lines are often pretty approachable, but I like to steer people to start with a more straightforward player--analysis is one of the most important parts of transcription, and Jim's ideas can be pretty complex for a beginner to really glean from effectively...

I love the kind of blue suggestion. You can sing any one of miles' solos on that record, and that's the rub right there--if you can sing it, you can learn it on the guitar. Trumpet players can be a good choice, particularly the more lyrical players (for when starting out) Chet Baker comes to mind as well--dig the record "Chet," or any of the stuff he did on steeplechase with Doug Raney (and another great Steeplechas Chet record is "Diane" with Paul Bley)

If you want guitarists to transcribe, grant green is great to start with, as is CC. For GG, dig albums like "green street" or "idle moments" or the quartets with sonny clark--you'll learn more from these than from grant funky later stuff. KB is good too, but he can get fast occasionally...it'll be a good test.

For sax, you can't beat paul desmond for lines that are both brilliant and easy to pick up. Hank Mobley's a pretty approachable tenor, if you pick up "Workout Vol. 1" you get Mobley and Grant Green on the same record...

Jake Hanlon · #4 11-26-2010, 10:23 AM

I wouldn't recommend Kind of Blue or Jim Hall solos as your starting point for seeking Transcription although if you did choose them they're not bad choices. I shall explain .

1 - Jim Hall's vocabulary is highly advanced harmonically. If you're just going to try and take his single note stuff then that's fine and none of it is overly complex but his voicings and use of them is really unequaled. I'd pass on it until you get some more swinging straight ahead things in your fingers.

2 - KoB is a landmark album, but in my experience it's better to start transcribing over tunes with changes rather then Modal. This is purely my own practical idea that when you start transcribing it should be over simple standards that move in ii V I patterns, not 24 bars of Dminor.

Now, i'm not saying don't transcribe it, because that shit is golden.

If I were you I'd be looking at starting with Wes' single not vocabulary for Guitarists, learning Chet Baker/Paul Desmond sort of playing, melodic but fits changes perfectly. Bill Evans' single note lines are swinging and logical. Grant Green probably is the easiest Jazz Guitarist to transcribe and teaches such vital lessons as groove, repetition and articulation.

So that being said, go transcribe some Grant Green.

FatJeff · #5 11-26-2010, 11:05 AM

I second Chet Baker. "In Milan" and "The Italian Sessions" are great, and they'll get you exposed to a number of essential standards.

Grant Green is also a good choice (although I don't personally like his playing), as well as Hank Mobley or Lester Young.

The "Joy Of Improv" method (there are threads on this at this site if you search) is good in that each week you'll be transcribing a specific solo, and they are laid out chronologically (starting with Louis Armstrong and ending up with Pat Metheny).

docbop · #6 11-26-2010, 12:10 PM

Sonny Rollins stuff is good it lays well on guitar. I have trouble hearing the stuff sometimes so I go for stuff that is easy to hear like the Milt Jackson recording vibes are clean and easy to hear to transcribe. "Bag's and Trane" and there's a CD the "Big 3" with Bags, Joe Pass, and Ray Brown.

brad4d8 · #7 11-26-2010, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr. beaumont

For sax, you can't beat paul desmond for lines that are both brilliant and easy to pick up. Hank Mobley's a pretty approachable tenor, if you pick up "Workout Vol. 1" you get Mobley and Grant Green on the same record...

Stan Getz is another one. You can even get him with Johnny Smith on the "Moonight in Vermont" CD. Brad

rabbit · #8 11-26-2010, 12:27 PM

Here are some horn transcriptions ready to try, with audio.

Part of this guy's "Lester Young' Centennial. (scroll to bottom, 'Contents')

I can't say Lester Young is a wise choice for your needs,
but my baseline posture in life is "What would Lester Young do?"

2) Oh, Lady! - Do The Math

RonD · #9 11-26-2010, 05:14 PM

I may be way off base here, but wouldn't Sonny Stitt be a good transcription source? I found/find his solos to be more accessible than Bird for learning the Be-Bop vocabulary. A little less challenging, but to my ears, still on the money.
I agree wholeheartedly with the Chet suggestions.

Cheers, Ron

max_power · #10 11-26-2010, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jake Hanlon

KoB is a landmark album, but in my experience it's better to start transcribing over tunes with changes rather then Modal. This is purely my own practical idea that when you start transcribing it should be over simple standards that move in ii V I patterns, not 24 bars of Dminor.

Now, i'm not saying don't transcribe it, because that shit is golden.

I wholeheartedly agree. KoB is great, but beginners may find that theyll spent a lot of time transcribing the album and in the end they still can't play "traditional" jazz (i.e. chord changes), which is often the goal in the first place. I had this problem myself when I started, and it wasted a lot of time for me.

In addition to what everyone else has said, I'll add that anything by Miles Davis in between Birth of the Cool and Kind of Blue is perfect for beginners since he tends to play pretty slowly. "Bags' Groove" in particular is a great album to start transcribing from.

mr. beaumont · #11 11-26-2010, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jake Hanlon

2 - KoB is a landmark album, but in my experience it's better to start transcribing over tunes with changes rather then Modal. This is purely my own practical idea that when you start transcribing it should be over simple standards that move in ii V I patterns, not 24 bars of Dminor.

Quote:

Originally Posted by max_power

I wholeheartedly agree. KoB is great, but beginners may find that theyll spent a lot of time transcribing the album and in the end they still can't play "traditional" jazz (i.e. chord changes), which is often the goal in the first place.

This is very true, however (there's always a however, huh?) when you get somebody coming from a rock background who thinks scales and no changes, something like "so what" can be a nice "break in," even if they don't realize all that's available to them in that "two chord" tune...

max_power · #12 11-26-2010, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr. beaumont

This is very true, however (there's always a however, huh?) when you get somebody coming from a rock background who thinks scales and no changes, something like "so what" can be a nice "break in," even if they don't realize all that's available to them in that "two chord" tune...

I guess it depends on your goals. If you only want to give jazz a try, or you aren't really interested in "traditional" jazz, or if you're so far removed from jazz that it would be really difficult to start by learning how to play changes, then sure, transcribing KoB is a great way to start off. And everyone ends up transcribing it anyways, so in the long run it doesn't matter exactly when you start learning it.