Metamorphis

[stuart.calcutt]

Hi I'm Stu

Not a beginner as such as I've semi- pro'd all my life as a pianist, but now in my dotage, I've taken up the guitar as a challenge.
My question is, how the heck do you reprogram your brain?
All the harmony, phrases, key changing etc, that I am used to, is an advantage admittedly, but I picture everything in my head piano fashion.
Is it just a question of "geography" or has anyone out there got an alternative
to my present method of translating everything from keys to frets every step of the way?
By the way, any short cuts would be appreciated, as at my age, (76), I'm in a bit of a hurry!

I wait with bated breath.

[Drumbler]

Get this book:

[fep]

FWIW

In one of my guitar books the author wrote the guitar is like six pianos (each string being a piano - with the same WWHWWWH major scale etc.).

Since guitar is my first instrument (piano's my second) that statement didn't help me much. I can see it that way if you try to play up and down the neck on one string, but that's sure not the way I think of the guitars geography.

But speaking of geography, I like the CAGED system for guitar. Check out this material:

BTstudent8024 | Scribd

You'll fine that as far as playing notes and chords and arrangements etc., it's far easier to play on the piano and you can play fuller arrangemnet; the piano is clearly superior in that way in my opinion.

But you can still embrace what the guitar does better than piano... off the top of my head...

Expressiveness
- All the things you can do with tone
- All the things you can do with a note, pull offs, hammer-ons, vibrato, slides, bends

It's portable

There must be more, I'm drawing a blank...

[cosmic gumbo]

Well, I remember when my Grampa Gumbo was 80 and he decided to switch from playing sousaphone and took up the 4-string banjo. It was pretty hard going the first 5 or 6 years, but he got to play a couple dixie gigs before he went senile.

[fep]

Well that's sure to take the wind right out of his sails.

Another helpful post from Gumbo...

[Drumbler]

I'd say to get a quick jumpstart get the Mickey Baker book.

It gets you right away comping jazz chords in a practical manner, learning intros, endings, etc.

And it's only about $8.

Don't waste time reinventing the wheel. Get the book.

With your background in piano it will all fall in place quickly.

[bako]

I would suggest that you thoroughly study the fingerboard layout and right and left hand technique.
Then begin to locate and play everything that you know on piano on the guitar.
Somethings will transfer better than others. Don't worry about that, it is all helpful in teaching you what is easy, challenging and possibly impossible.

From this vantage point you can explore that which is common to jazz guitar through books, videos and a teacher if possible.

[stuart.calcutt]

Thanks for everyone's advice,really helpful, even COSMIC GUMBO who made me smile! I have, however, reported him to Age Concern.

[FatJeff]

Originally Posted by stuart.calcutt

Hi I'm Stu

Not a beginner as such as I've semi- pro'd all my life as a pianist, but now in my dotage, I've taken up the guitar as a challenge.
My question is, how the heck do you reprogram your brain?
All the harmony, phrases, key changing etc, that I am used to, is an advantage admittedly, but I picture everything in my head piano fashion.
Is it just a question of "geography" or has anyone out there got an alternative
to my present method of translating everything from keys to frets every step of the way?
By the way, any short cuts would be appreciated, as at my age, (76), I'm in a bit of a hurry!

I wait with bated breath.

I've gone the other way (guitar to piano)...while I'm not much of a pianist, I found that it's just a matter of repetition. I used the Jerry Coker book for non-pianists and the core there is just rote, repetition, playing ii/V/Is in all keys. The more i do it, the easier (and more automatic) it becomes. I suspect the same would be true in transitioning from piano to guitar.

If you can stand lessons, I heartily recommend (as do many others on this site) the Jimmy Bruno online guitar institute. Jimmy Bruno Jazz Guitar. His fingering system is really great and may quite possibly be the fastest way to learn your way around the fretboard. Better than CAGED, IMO, and the closest thing to a "shortcut" I've found for jazz guitar.

[keith]

I'd be interested to hear how you think about the piano to understand the question more. I'd guess it's the chordal arrangements that are giving you fits as the horizontal arrangement of each string is akin to a piano. The thing I think is useful about the guitar in jazz is that it is tuned for the most part in fourths which corresponds well to a large part of jazz harmony progressions so moving through progressions can be done by moving across the fretboard ( vertically ) as long as you understand the chord and it's root for that string and so it becomes a matter of locating the chord roots. The CAGED system gives you a general outline of the basic chord structures and where they lie across the strings but it's most important to know where the triad is each of these forms so they can modified to give you the minors, dominants etc. My guess is that you learned piano from scales to chords and not the reverse but the CAGED system can allow you to generate the scales backward from the chords if you know where the triad is in the chord. This is just the root oriented basics and does not address inversions etc but can simplify one of those massive chord charts if that is what you are dealing with. The above explanation is very basic and leaves out so much of jazz guitar including playing multiple lines ( as in piano )and rhythmic aspects etc, etc.Please tell us more about how you think while playing the piano in particular while going through changes.

[timscarey]

I found it helpful to memorize interval "shapes" on the lowest 4 strings. As that part of the guitar is symmetrical. The high E and B strings must be tweaked up a fret to fit the same pattern as the lowest 4 strings. If you can build chords using intervals, it's just a matter of time, as the shapes can be memorized and moved.

The main difference between intervals on the guitar and on the piano is that on the guitar, it's just a shape, no white or back note considerations. When conceptualizing a guitar though, you have to think in 2 dimensions, whereas the piano is one dimensional.