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Just curious how crazy my fellow jazz obsessed guitarists are about their stereos. For me, much like my attitude with all gear, I shop for mostly used, vintage or under-rated but great sounding equipment. Hearing every little detail and nuance in a great recording can be a rewarding, sensual experience, but I regularly am blown away by the musicianship on something I'm streaming off Amazon Music with my old iPhone. How do you consume music?
Full disclosure- I have vintage Marantz 1060 integrated amp, a new Teac CD player, Pioneer Alex Jones speakers a big Dayton Audio sub. I retired my fisher turntable and will pick up a u-turn or similar turntable after some remodeling.
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08-03-2017 07:19 AM
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I listen on a mid-level system of hi-fi separates comprised of a Pro-Ject turntable, a Pioneer DVD recorder (as CD player), a Marantz a/v amp and Triangle separates (plus SIMS home cinema projector), which my audiophile brother (who works on high-end audio at a precision engineering company in the UK) sneers at.
He listens on headphones for around an hour every day; I listen on Triangle speakers for around an hour every week. (I use my mp3 player to listen to talks and podcasts.)
But he listens to relatively recent recordings, whereas I listen to old.
I don't like CDs at all, but I do like the convenience of streaming.
Most of all, I like owning vinyl. There are frequent record fairs here (Valencia, Spain), and I'm interested in acquiring some more vinyl (many of the records I've bought over the years have been lent out but not returned).
I haven't found it necessary to 'invest' in a Victrola in order to listen to '78s - but I hope to get one in a couple of years. I'm very serious about that, but I never would have imagined it.
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Cant be--little kids and litle space. So i just like some decent headphones (grado's)
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Actually - and this relates to discussion of the merits of the Godin Multiac on another thread - I think of my Neunaber Immerse pedal as audiophile gear; it's helping me coax a great sound from a piezoelectric pick-up - and create an immersive soundstage around nylon-strung guitar at loud levels of amplification.
Last edited by destinytot; 08-03-2017 at 10:22 AM. Reason: pedal (singular)
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I will buy Grado-rs2 some vague future. Or ps-500 if they can make me smile wider than rs2 once did. I have 325i now but those are nothing like the memory from rs2. I have a headphone amp that sounds exactly like unamped from my Focusrite, only better. Thats about it.
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Real simple - computer, good audio interface (Mackie Onyx Blackjack) and a pair of M-audio BX-5 powered monitor speakers. Monitor speakers' response graph was nearly flat - plus or minus one and a half db. The bottom line - this system sounds like live music. I have spent over 50 years playing in musical groups, including classical ensembles and orchestras, so I know what the sound of live music is!
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Digital audio technology has made huge advances in recent years. One no longer has to spend huge money to get excellent stereo equipment. The humble little Sony HAP-S plus two excellent monitor speakers on proper (sand filled) stands, with decent speaker cables, makes up my entire home system - sure, I could do better but it's plenty good enough and enough to knock most people's socks off. Speaker placement is key. I have a vinyl collection but have dismantled and sold off my vinyl gear for now, at least until I have more free time. With the Sony, I press one button and it starts playing from where it was when I last turned it off. I have over 400 albums on there as lossless files, including album art. The Sony unit itself takes up less room than some books.
The hard part is finding the time to do quality listening!
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I think one needs a Very Good Reason to hang on to the past.
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Sony CD player into Mackie mixer into two Alto TS110a powered speakers
I briefly entertained the idea of hi-def digital player but did not want to deal with reencoding bunch of CDs. I might add a turntable in the future.
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hot rodded 60s Dynaco Stereo 70 tube amp and preamp.
old AR table and Boston Acoustic A-100's.
but these days I usually only have time to listen on Sunday mornings before our regular gig.
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I like talking to guys who work in audiophile stores, they say the only people who can afford this stuff are typically at the age their hearing has already degraded. It's just ego so they can brag about what their system cost. When I got back into working audio a few years ago I was mainly doing editing and basic mastering quick turnaround sales. I started noticing few old guys in audio and the ones that are typically mastering engineers which is mainly about working with a set of speaker you know inside out from years of use, then understanding the limits of the mastering target CD, vinyl, DVD, TV, theater, car, smartphone, live background, etc. Mastering today is more about optimizing for a specific platform.
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I mostly listen from my computer. HDMI out to a Xonar U3 DAC, to an older Onkyo receiver/amplifier, then to some Fisher 104 speakers I bought back in the 70s. In the living room, I use the TV, out to a cheap Lepai amp, to Bose 901 speakers I bought in the early 70s, and which replaced the Fishers. I almost always stream audio, and don't even have a CD player in either chain. I have several on storage shelves, but I don't use them. I have some Sennheiser headphones, which I seldom use unless I want to listen quietly while the wife sleeps. I honestly don't think there is enough difference between expensive high-end equipment and the cheaper gear I use for me to tell the difference. I've listened to high-end gear in stores, and just can't come close to justifying spending that much money on at best a minimal upgrade in sound. I have more important uses for my money. I'm still short one guitar (aren't we all?), and maybe an amp.
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They're the bee's knees. I got the pair for $200. I miss my old 70's Pioneer receiver but laptop to the BX-5's is good enough.
Originally Posted by robertm2000
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Exactly - it is all about the music! Originally Posted by Stevebol
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I have a computer, decent sound card, speakers, headphones, etc. It is what it is. Impossible to get by without that much. I also have a VTL tube pre amp, a Canadian made 35 watt integrated tube power amp, Celestion S600 speakers, and cheap-ish Sony CD player. I used to have 100 watt VTL mono block tube power amps, but one crapped out so I sold both to someone that wanted to fix it. I already went through one fix that lasted about a year and I didn't want to throw any more money at it. I also used to have a Dynaco SCA-35 and FM -1, and Wharfedale speakers in the garage but gave them all to a friend that opened a tattoo shop. He rocked them for about 5 years before the tubes needed replacing, but he decided to trash the Dynacos instead.
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There is a line between audiophile, and audiofool
Having a great tube amp, some butt kicking speakers. Awesome.
mystical pyramids that prevent your cables from touching the ground, $2k power cables, etc. All promising the tone of the gods. You're being lied to and taken advantage of.
BTW, years back on a recording forum I remember hearing of a shootout between the top monster cable available, and metal coat hangers straightened out and used as cable.
nobody knew the difference.
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Appreciate all the responses. I think, just like different guitars bring out different elements from our music, different gear allows us to hear different aspects of a given recording. Waiting in the car the other day, I was playing some music from my phone into my Prius' less than exemplary speakers and could really hear piano parts that are usually buried in those old, one mic Charlie Parker recordings. It felt akin to how a crappy acoustic, missing the high e string, someone had at a party made me hear my rhythm differently.
We're all happy to play well made, quality gear that's less than or equal to a mortgage/rent payment, but I know if I had the scratch I'd buy an L5 thinline in a second and bet many of you buy a more expensive axe as well. That extra 10% of 'sonic magic' is expensive, subjective and open to debate, but what about art/craft isn't?
Lastly, I love the whole experience of playing a record. The act itself makes me listen more intently. I also prefer a single disc CD player for the same reason, it focus' me a little more.
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Yeah I have some nice stuff but I also love listening in my newish car as it has a really nice surround sound system that's tough to beat.
And yes good headphones are also tough to beat although one has to watch out for hearing damage.
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Gunksman, I am a burnt-out audiophool. The amount I spent could have bought me some nice vintage guitars which unlike high-end hifi will still have value today. Audiophoolery is akin to buying cars or motorbikes; they ain't worth shit in the long run.
That said, keep your Marantz. Deoxit the RCA connectors and speaker binding posts. 12-ga Audio Technica wire works fine. Solder the ends and terminate with banana plugs. Audiophools love Eichmann Plugs now called ETI Research...There I go again. You can't escape the orbit.
Turntable-tonearm: Regaplanar 3, Systemdek or Project. I don't like VPI.
Cartridge: Grado. Load it properly at the phono stage. 47Kohms? Grado Labs Prestige Cartridges
The important thing is to know how to set up the geometry well. It is a mechanical tracker of fine grooves, after all. VTA, Overhang, Azimuth, Tracking Force, etc. Check them out on the net.
Site your record on an mdf shelf or tempered glass sitting on three or four pointy cones. The frugal audiophool makes his own. Got a butcher's block? Level it and rest in on the butcher's block. Place the whole thing on some console or sideboard.
Oh yeah, lest I forget: IKEA Läck square coffee table. Gusset up the corners under the top to make it stiff and rigid. Rest your turntable directly on it. 40-year old audiophool trick for lightly sprung UK style turntables. Not for a VPI. Red Läck sounds better than Black....Just kidding!!!
Speakers: I like anything Bowers & Wilkins. You require a pair of solid stands for them, 18" to 20" high but of the same height. MDF ones work very well as long as they are rigid and stiff. No phallic jokes, please. Spike the bottom plate with four wood screws. These contact the floor or carpet. Blutak the speaker to the top plate. Do it for the other side.
Where you site your speakers is very important. On their stands, pull them away from the rear wall and rear corners, about 3 feet to six feet. Pull them away from the side walls, about 3 feet or more, if you can manage it. The speakers should be separated from each other, centre to centre, by between 6 feet and 8 feet.
Imagine an equilateral triangle. The speakers are sited at the corners of this triangle. You are seated at the apex.
You may start with the baffles of the speakers firing forwards. And then experiment by angling the speakers, little by little, to fire into your ears. This is called toe-in. You stop when you are happy with the sound.
One trick is to reverse the polarity of one speaker. When you hear one speaker cancelling out the other completely at your listening seat, you know pretty well you have got them set up well. You feel as if you are listening in a vacuum when that happens.
Just my audiophool take. Buy a decent carbon-fibre brush and a Zerostat. I love analogue vinyl, not digitally remastered ones. You can hear the digital remasters. The early Telarcs were terrible. Some of the Blue Note and Impulse digital remasters that came out in the "dying" days of vinyl were execrable.
Vinyl reproduces well the attack of the note and the decay of the tail. Vinyl set up right reproduces pace, rhythm and timing of a piece. Well, UK-style lightly sprung turntables do that. American turntables are terrible in this aspect except for the Bill Firebaugh Well-Tempered Turntable and Allen Perkins Immedia RPM-1. Oops, there I go again.
Keep it simple, mate. Leave the $30 000 speaker cables to the true audiophools. You don't have to spend a lot to get good sound. You need to know how and where to spend it.
I guess the test is: does it sound real? Or does it sound like a flat imitation of the real thing? There's gold in them vinyl. Most fellas have not heard them yet.Last edited by Jabberwocky; 08-05-2017 at 01:52 PM.
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My name is Jeff, and I am (was) an audiofool...
My listening habits have changed over the years. As a young man, I listened to albums obsessively, and spent half the money I made one summer on what is still my dream system: Harmon Kardon HK560, in my opinion STILL the coolest amp design ever created; Infinity speakers; a JVC DD turntable with an Ortofon cartridge, later replaced by B&O; and a JVC cassette deck. That setup lasted 2 decades, before bit by bit every piece failed and it became cheaper to replace.
In the late 80's I got a Nakamichi receiver and Onkyo turntable with an Audiotechnica cartridge, and Bose 100 speakers.
In the late 90's my wife and I inherited her old man's system when he decided to upgrade. He was and is an eccentric guy and world-class narcissist, but I digress. This system was highlighted by an Eagle 7A amp and Watkins speakers. (The preamp might have been an ML-1 or JC-2, but not sure.) The amp weighed 100 lbs, and the speakers were 6 feet high. Unfortunately, it drew a ton of power, and was just too big for the house we were living in--one needs a huge sound space for a system like that. So I traded it to Dave Rogers of Dave's Guitars for a guitar, amp and equipment.
I kinda regret getting rid of it, though I can't imagine lugging that around and setting it up in any of the houses I've lived in since then.
I gave the Nakamichi system above plus my 800 or so records to my fiancee's daughter and son-in-law last year, as I just wasn't listening to it much--the albums were actually in a storage unit. I figured it would still be "in the family," though now they're getting divorced, so who gets custody of my vinyl? Can't say it bothers me much at this point...
Nowadays I listen to 99% streaming music through Apple Play. My car has an awesome JL system, which is where is listen to music most of the time. At home I run my laptop through a set of HK powered speakers with a subwoofer, and it sounds pretty darn good.
I also occasionally stream via Airplay through my TV sound system--a moderately high-end Bose system with 2 small speakers and a subwoofer.
To be honest, with my hearing loss, I don't know I would appreciate true audiophile stuff these days. Plus I don't have the time or space or money for obsessing over exotic equipment and a big ole vinyl record collection.Last edited by Doctor Jeff; 08-06-2017 at 09:46 AM.
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This calls for a 70's receiver side track;
This was my modest little unit;
Maybe not as sweet sounding as a Marantz but pretty dependable.
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I've posted before there was just some wonderful design in midlevel audio equipment in the 60's and especially the 70's. There was some serious performance in there and the design was clean and utilitarian.
The earlier 60's stuff was a little too kitschy, without the sound. Some people are nuts about MacIntosh, but I prefer the mid- to late-70's Japanese and German designs myself. (Kind of like their cars, as well.)
The high-end equipment to me just seems too industrial, not something you'd put on an entertainment cabinet in your living room or den. Though I guess it comes with bragging rights.
My ex-FIL designed a listening room for his house, which he built in late 70's. It was about 20 x 30", in the basement, and had 18" thick poured concrete walls. One wall had a huge wallpaper painting of a 747 taking off. The stereo rack was built into the back wall, and there was a small utility room behind it for access to the wiring. He would invite people down there for listening parties, though ironically he actually rarely listened to music there--maybe once a week. He had about 100 albums that were all special audiophile pressings, the piece de resistance of which was Saint-Saens Orgel Symphonie (Nr 3). The whole house shook with that one when the organ came in.
The stereo he gave us was probably the last nice thing he did before we parted on bad terms. I've only spoken to him once in the 20 years since, at my daughter's graduation, where, somewhat surprisingly, he was subdued and polite, if not overly friendly.Last edited by Doctor Jeff; 08-06-2017 at 09:31 AM.
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I've got a Nakamichi receiver and the Klipsch Heresey speakers I bought during high school in the late 70's. The sad fact is that I just don't have ,or take the time to just sit down and listen to an entire album of music like I used to do. Does anyone still do that? I have a Bose system on my tv that plays cd's and I'll listen on that while I'm cooking or cleaning in the kitchen, it sounds ok but does not compare with the Klipsch. I used to spend so much time actively listening but now I feel like that time is better spent practicing and playing my guitar.
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I'm in a situation where I practice and play a little more than my body can handle so I look at active listening as a way to 'practice' away from the instrument.
As musicians, the convenience of digital music is fantastic, even if the average quality is so-so. I keep a playlist of the songs I know, played by various artists, on my Amazon Music app to them into my head. The notes and rhythms come through even on my phone's speakers, but for studying the nuances and subtle shadings of a recording, a decent recording, source, and speakers or headphones can really help.
I remember reading how some famous jazz cat who's name escapes me at the moment, said that, as a kid, he got ahold of some Django discs back when after a dozen or so playings the records were almost unlistenable, but it was enough for him to learn all the tunes and solos! I don't know what his setup was, but I suspect it wasn't too hifi.
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I once had some good stereo equipment that I bought at the PX back in the early 70s, but it all got stolen in a burglary while we were on vacation. The only thing left was my set of Bose 901 speakers, which were hanging from the ceiling, out of reach without a ladder. I replaced some of it, and still have the replacement turntable, a Pioneer, that still works well. I've used it for digitizing some of my vinyl collection, but rarely bother to listen to LPs. It's just a lot of trouble, and I can listen to almost anything I have via streaming or playing from my computer, with better quality and less work.
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