altered dominant chords

[JazzFanatik]

Hey,

Okay I hope I'm calling them the right name, please correct me if i'm not...

Anyways, I'm finally to the point where I"m comfortable with maj7, min7, and dom7 chords...(yaaay)

Anyways, i wanted to start adding some tensions to the V chord, just out of curiousity, which types of chords do you guys use the most when adding tension to the V chord?

The only one i use is the Dom7#5 chord. I know there are dozens of different ways you can alter that chord (b9, #9, #11 etc) but i tend to only use that same one, and I'm ready to start experimenting with other chords.

Just curious which ones you all use more often? Like let's say in a 2-5-1 situation?

[voelker]

Thats a pretty broad question. You should be able to use them all, Are u looking for voicings and fingurings? I believe the best way is to figure them out yourself. make sure you know all inversions on strings (4321), (5432), (5321) and (6432). Make sure you know the interval of every note in those chords. Then go through each inversion and alter a note. You've already raised the 5 in the 7#5 chord. Now try flatting it for a 7b5, then raise the root to make a rootless 7b9. This alteration yields a dim7 shape, but you should think of it as the 3,5,b7,b9 of a 7b9 chord. (remember the 1 and the 5 are the first notes you leave out for more interesting notes.)
When you understand intervals well enough to do this, then you can start getting more creative with your voicings. BTW... This approach doesn't really work well for 7#9 chord because the #9 is the same note as the b3 and would be played easiest on the same string as the 3rd, but you want both the 3rd and #9 in the chord, and you want to play the #9 higher than the 3rd to avoid a clash. Here are a few voicings you dont get from the above process
C7#9 (x,x,10,9,11,11) (x,3,2,3,4,x) (8,7,8,8,x,x)
C7b9 (8,7,8,6,x,x) (x,3,2,3,2,x) (x,x,10,9,11,9)
C7#5,#9(x,3,2,3,4,4) (x,x,8,9,9,11)

[JazzFanatik]

Thanks this is very helpful. Yeah I guess I just wanted some common voicings and to figure out which ones I would actually probably use...

I agree though it would probably be best for me to just sit down and figure out what sounds good to my ear...

Thank you!

[mr. beaumont]

Most of the time my decision is informed by what comes after--and of course, since it's often my decision as to what comes after (as far as extensions) I have some freedom.

Voice leading is the important thing here. Play a minor ii-V-i and use a 7#5 for the dominant, and a m/maj9 for the i. Hear that #5 move down a half step and become the 9 and the 3rd stay the same note but become the 7? Now, do a major ii V I, and use a 7b9 as the V and let that b9 move a half step and become a 5th in your I chord...hear that one?

You have options on the I (or i) to either voice lead or keep a common voice based on what you do with the dominant...

[bako]

Here are a few adjacent note altered resolutions derived from a dominant chord resolving up a 4th to a major. If you learn the sounds you will wonder less about which one to use when. Try also combinations of these altered note resolutions.

G7-----C

b9-----5
b9-----6

#9-----7 or 8
#9------6

#5------3
#5------9

#11-----9
#11-----8 or 7

[JazzFanatik]

Thank you i will definitely try these things when i get home today. thanks for all your help guys.

[VersatileJazzGuitarist]

You may find these diagrams helpful. The altered notes are shaded. You can make a whole lot of altered dominant chords by playing around with these patterns.

[whatswisdom]

Originally Posted by VersatileJazzGuitarist

You may find these diagrams helpful. The altered notes are shaded. You can make a whole lot of altered dominant chords by playingaround with these patterns.

Thanks for the grids. Nicely done. The shading is a cool idea. On the first grid I take it that the 3rd, (Bb on the A string [first fret]) should be included, right? I'm interpreting as the key of Gb.

[VersatileJazzGuitarist]

Originally Posted by whatswisdom

On the first grid I take it that the 3rd, (Bb on the A string [first fret]) should be included, right? I'm interpreting as the key of Gb.

Actually, I didn't mean this to be in any specific position, but simply a dominant seventh chord with the root on either the sixth or fifth string. These are movable forms.

The fifth string was meant to be unplayed or muted when the root is on the sixth string. This is for two reasons: (1) Avoid having a muddy bass sound when playing low on the neck; (2) leave more fingers available for hitting those altered notes on the high strings.

It may seem odd that you would play, for example a G9 or G9#11 chord without playing the major third. But these chords work OK. Maybe because you unconsciously hear the major third as an overtone of the tonic on the sixth string?