Frank Sinatra and Nat King Cole for solo guitar accompanyment and vocal?

[spooni]

Hey!

I´m new on this forum and this is my first post!
I started my relationship with jazz music last autumn, under a year ago, so i´m quite confused with all the information there is, but very exited about this music called jazz!

My previous interests (2-3 years ago) were mostly pop-based tunes and stuff that people can play at campfire. Playing simple cords, singing easy, attracted lines and having a good time without thinkin about the voice leading, tonality, bass lines and the character tones.
Wait! I found myself wondering; "Is this all the music is about?".

After listening and freaking about John Mayer´s music ( Fortynately i´m now wise enough to see that he is not musically and mentally as cool as i was thinkin then) I found myself buying Hendrix´s and Srv´s records.
BANG! I was introduced to the musical form called Blues.
Going through S.R.V, Eric Clapton, B.B King, Albert King, Freddie King etc. all the way ending up buying the box of Complete Studio Recordings of Robert Johnson I was ready to ask myself again a question; "Is there more than that?"

Last autumn i was lucky to have a new guitar teacher who introduced me to the music of Charlie Parker, Wes Montgomery, Miles Davis, A.C Jobim etc.

Nowadays i´m studying the fingerings and techniques of Jimmy Bruno and William G. Leawitt. Patterns of Joe Cocker and Jamey Aebersold. Ear training of Aebersold and David Lucas Burge. Theory of Mark Levine and Max Tabell. And last but not least; the Biographies, Transcribed solos and Repertoire of Charlie Parker.

Thats my instrumental background.

Now i´m wondering if I can fit my old interests from the good old campfire to the world of jazz?
I would love to accompany myself on guitar (Acoustic or archtop) and sing out the good old standards like Frank Sinatra, Nat King Cole, Diana Crall, George Benson and John Pizzarelli.

Without going again the good old try and fail approach, I´m wondering if you guys have some good books or tips about how to fit standard-type songs (Fly Me To The Moon, Autumn leaves, Nature Boy, All The Things You Are, Summertime, All of Me etc.) for one man and one guitar?

I think it´s a good thing to move the melody above of all like music teachers do with the piano when acomppanying the school class in the school´s music lessons? Is it? The singing is just a hobby for me and i´m not virtuoso in it so i think it would help me to identify the melody if the melody is being played same time when singin it? Thats why i post this post to the chord-melody forum.

The basslines? How to fit them with the melody?
The Harmony? Again; How to fit them with the melody? Keeping it simple or doing some fat 13th chords?
How to move the bass in a relationship with the melody and harmony? The Swingin´ 8-note shuffle all the time or some freeflowing ambient chords?

Questions like those made me wondering if there is some idols to look above and listen who does the stuff like that?
John pizzarelli does that voice with the guitar work, but he´s got the band and sometimes the horns to back him so the approach he´s using is not the approach what i´m searching for.


Any artists to listen and transcribe?
Any books that includes jazz-standard arrangements for one guitar and one vocal?

I would love to learn to do these kind of arrangements of standards by myself but i haven´t got no arrangements and artists to look above so i´m quite lost.

Thanks for reading my very first post on this forum and this longlong testament about my musical identity. Thanks to this forum and people here who shares the joys and the sads of jazzguitar!

Sorry ´bout the typo-stuff regarding to this writing. I´m from the land of the thousand lakes; Finland, so my english is not as good as yours.

Greetings from Finland for all you guys and keep up the good work you´re doing!

Yours;

Petri

[derek]

Welcome Petri. If you are just wanting to accompany yourself singing standards, then pick up a copy of the Real Book, and start playing and singing. Since your vocal will suppy the melody, the chords the harmony, you are good to go.

As far as taking it to another level, check the 4 or 5 recordings Ella and Joe Pass did together. Their interaction is sublime. Also, there is Julie London and Barney Kessel, and a current duo, Tuck and Patti Andress.

YouTube Video

YouTube Video

[fivebells]

Petri, I think you're looking for the same kind of accompaniment style that I keep seeking. So far the best examples I've found are Julie London's albums with Barney Kessel (Julie Is Her Name), Al Viola (Lonely Girl) and Howard Roberts (Julie Is Her Name Vol. II), and of course Joe and Ella. John Pizz is good too, but I have the same reservations.

What we're talking about here is the chord-melody style of playing, minus the melody voice. Keep everything else: the basslines, timekeeping role, harmony voices, embellishments and flourishes and blue notes. That's how I try to play when accompanying.

[spooni]

Originally Posted by fivebells

Petri, I think you're looking for the same kind of accompaniment style that I keep seeking. So far the best examples I've found are Julie London's albums with Barney Kessel (Julie Is Her Name), Al Viola (Lonely Girl) and Howard Roberts (Julie Is Her Name Vol. II), and of course Joe and Ella. John Pizz is good too, but I have the same reservations.

What we're talking about here is the chord-melody style of playing, minus the melody voice. Keep everything else: the basslines, timekeeping role, harmony voices, embellishments and flourishes and blue notes. That's how I try to play when accompanying.

Yes, we are talking exactly the same thing! I´m a quite beginner in this chord melody style playing, so do you guys have some "chord-melody style of playing, minus the melody voice"-Books (bibles) where to start my journey and build the basics?

Derek´s and yours suggestions were exactly the stuff what I was looking for. If Joe were a singer, i think that he would accompany himself just as the way he accompanies ella so this is just the look above/transcribing-stuff i was searching. I love the way he threats the basslines, timing and the harmony together when still being perfectly "behind" the singer.
The Julie London and Tuck & Patti stuff was great too!

Are there any one man/woman artists that does the same thing as these duos do?

[fivebells]

Looks like it's just you and me

I'm not aware of any books for this approach. I develop a full chord-melody arrangement for each tune because that's my primary interest, then if I think the song is singable I just drop the melody line from the guitar part. The melody note is (nearly) always the highest note in every chord, so it's not a big adjustment to lose it. That said, the comp arrangement usually changes somewhat over time (especially if I have to move it to another key).

[spooni]

Yep!

So we came to that point where we have to admit the fact that it´s actually chord melody stuff but the highest notes are replaced with your voice?
So i have to get the basics of the chord-melody stuff to learn to accompany myself singing some standard type songs?

How about some trio stuff? Guitar&Voc, Bass & Drums playing standards?
I used to do that kind of trio stuff when I played Blues and Pop back in the days. Are there any trios like Hendrix and Srv & Double Trouble was but in the jazzfield where the guitarist also sings? And the music should be the standards in the style of Sinatra, Pizzarelli & Nat King Cole.

Oh, this jazz is so new, but interesting world for me!
I Feel like a little boy in a candyshop when spotting out new artists!

[fivebells]

So i have to get the basics of the chord-melody stuff to learn to accompany myself singing some standard type songs?

Well, you can of course just play rhythm guitar, using full chords and maybe a bit of a bassline. That's plenty to start with.

But chord-melody (in my not-so-humble opinion) is the peak of the artform. If you build your playing and arranging skills in that area, you'll be able to make the music you really want to hear.

Here's something for you to chew on — three guitarists' versions of "Cry Me A River".

The first you may already be familiar with: Barney Kessel, backing Julie London with Ray Leatherwood on bass. For its time this was a very different kind of sound.

YouTube Video

Next, a voice-and-guitar version by Marylee Rose Bussard. This is great.

YouTube Video

Also rather special: Tony R. Clef's acoustic fingerstyle version.

YouTube Video

[spooni]

Hi!

It´s been awhile and it seems that there is no traffic in this topic

Since my last post, i´ve started my joyrney in a chord melody/acomppanyment-world.
I took the original versions of Sinatra's My Way and Armstrong's Wonderful world; made notes about what are the most important stuff in those songs ( My way's bassline and piano acomppanyment style, WW´s 6/8-arpeggio-feel). Took the original sheets from songs, transcribed the most important stuff from the original recordings and finally writed all the acommpany-notes/arpeggios with their right inversion so the melody line is always on the top, bassline the root or fift ( 3rd in second bar of the V-V7-I). I Use my thumb to pick the bass, and Martin Maylor style-like three fingers without pinky to pick the chords and the melody.

My main goal was to get a good backup when singin those songs like those inversions were always on the top of the chord. And i ended up getting a good backup for singing when playin a little less and simplifying stuff what I wroted, and gettin quite a simple chord melody arrangement when not singin and playing the top note as the melody note.

So, Fivebelly, you were right! First the chord melody and then drop out the melody and replace it with your voice. I like it a lot when you can play one chorus in the middle of the song with just on your instrument and then backup the second etc.

i was googling around the chord melody-posts and find that the Guitar-instructor Fred Sokolow is doing exactly the same stuff what we were looking for! I´m planning maybe get his dvd´s for the instructional-material, even thought i don´t really like the style of singin, strumming chords with his thumb etc. He´s not the kind of a guitar-player/singer what i was looking for, but the consept he is doing (Chord melody - backing up singin) is just the thing I was looking for.

Homepage for instructional material;

Jazz Guitar Instructional Material - Fred Sokolow Music

Introduction and They cant take that away from me;

YouTube - (Part 1) "They Can't Take That Away From Me" taught by Fred Sokolow

Summertime;

YouTube - Fred Sokolow teaches "Summertime"


Do you guys have someone else in your mind, after checkin up the sokolow's stuff what he is doing, who is doing the same kind of thing with guitar and not so "smoky" voice?


Yours;
-Petri

[Old Feller]

Good subject Petri. I have also been looking for this format, and other than Tuck & Patti, Ella & Pass, I hadn't found much.

[derek]

I think Fred Sokolow does a really good job with beginners. The problem for me is, his stuff isn't very sophisticated, but a great place to start if you don't have a live teacher around you who knows this stuff.

The guy I like best for this stuff these days is John Pizzarelli. However, he doesn't do a lot of stuff where it just he and his guitar, though some. I have posted the first one several times, but frankly, it never gets old for me. The second example is Andy Summers and Sting on Round Midnight. There is some light accompanyment in the background after the first verse, but it could easily just be Andy.

YouTube Video

YouTube Video

[spooni]

Hey!

I just finished doing finale files from these two songs i told you guys lately. Would like to have some feedback if I am getting it right?
Thank you already!

The files are Pdf's and are here on my Scribd-page;

plusikka on Scribd

Both songs are on the key of C, so i made the arrangements using a lot of open strings and open chords.

[rabbit]

The basic chords , or "Vanilla Changes" to many Standards
available here:

Index

Simpler and good for comparison to a fake book or 'Real' book
which will have much more complicated choices.

[RonD]

@ derek,
"The second example is Andy Summers and Sting on Round Midnight."
Love his comping, his soloing... not so much. What is this from?

[chrisg]

Check out James Sherlock and Kristin Berardi. Great Guitar/Vocal duo. and James has a very interesting way of playing.
YouTube - Kristin Berardi Manly Jazz festival 2007

[derek]

Originally Posted by RonD

@ derek,
"The second example is Andy Summers and Sting on Round Midnight."
Love his comping, his soloing... not so much. What is this from?

Yeah, I am with you. I love this version, but wish he had played less pentatonics and developed his solo more, but that really isn't his bag. It is from Andy's tribute to Monk called Green Chimneys.

Amazon.com: Green Chimneys: The Music of Thelonious Monk: Andy Summers: Music